If masks work. Most places are supposedly covid safe. Why are cases rising.

[LetsPlayAGame20]

Genuine question that's juts popped into my mind.

Surely if cases are rising and majority are following rules. Why are cases rapidly increasing

Did you see the arseholes at Coventry University. What were they thinking. Or maybe they think they are different and special and its just not fair!

That and household transmission .

Is there any data for the actual size of outbreaks in schools? So we can see that it is 10 people rather than 2?

I would love to see that figure too. Schools are open all over planet Earth so maybe the data exists from another country?

@LetsPlayAGame20

Genuine question that's juts popped into my mind.

Surely if cases are rising and majority are following rules. Why are cases rapidly increasing

Because not everyone is wearing masks. A lot of workplaces and offices are still forcing or expecting their employees to come into work, even though their job could be done from home, plus they're not making people wear masks indoors (I just had an interview at a place where both of those things were happening).

A lot of people are too arrogant, stubborn or ignorant to leave a bit of space on pavements or pathway by going in single file just for a few seconds. Instead of leaving a gap, they will walk right in the middle, just to show how marvellously tough or nonchalant they are.

A lot of people are unable to control their immediate environment - the majority of young people live in house shares, sometimes quite large houseshares with 7-8 other people and it only takes one idiot to put everyone else at risk.

What we need to know is how many children test positive during the 14 day quarantine period, and I believe that families are under no obligation to tell the school if a child becomes ill at home. They can, and they should, but there is no legal obligation to do so. So realistically, schools don't know how many pupils the virus is affecting. If we had a good track and trace system, we would be able to know and schools could adjust their measures accordingly, but they don't know. It's a bit crap.

This and it's more than a bit crap, it's actually putting everyone at risk. In Germany they test close contacts of positive cases, which is probably why they're keeping the virus under much better control than us.

In the Israeli school outbreaks, 60% of children were asymptomatic, so there needs to be - at a minimum - some studies of the cohorts sent home when there's a case in school to try and quantify how much transmission is happening.

In theory at the moment, you could have children sent home for 14 days due to one or two classmates testing positive, they could then be asymptomatic or symptomatic without any of the 3 testing symptoms and infectious during that period (and would test positive if tested, which PHE actually says you should never do - only test with 3 symptoms) and then pass the virus on to a parent or sibling in the home, who then goes on to become infectious AFTER the 14 day period. Since current ideas are that the presymptomatic period could be important, any parent who then goes out to work / the shops could be then spreading the disease within the community. This is how schools will drive spread.

We are going to have to stop sending years home if one child tests positive.

@notevenat20

The guidance doesn't say that's what should happen anyway. Many schools/LAs are making their own rules.

The guidance doesn't say that's what should happen anyway. Many schools/LAs are making their own rules.

I thought it was entirely down to PHE. Is that wrong?

Because people aren’t following guidelines, even people who should know better. I was gobsmacked this week to be told by a friend that works in a hospital that one of her colleagues came into work and told her that they had been working with someone who tested positive at the weekend. They should have gone into isolation and got a test but went into work instead. In a hospital. FFS.

Transmission is happening in places where people dont wear masks - the home, schools, universities, care homes, hospital wards.

Not everyone wears a mask or wears it properly at work.

It takes time to stop an oil tanker - people infected now infect family so takes a few weeks to have a lot of impact.

This is not an official site but picks up reports from educational institutions via the press/ the establishments. www.boycottunsafeschools.co.uk/reported-covid-19-cases/school-cases-before-12-8-20/

Based on the symptom tracker app cases in my area have increased 10 fold within the month......schools went back 2 weeks prior to that and we have a large student population who have also returned in the last couple of weeks....I reckon that accounts for a large proportion of the increase, as well as all the muppets who can't follow basic rules or asymptomatic people spreading it unknowingly.
Given that Greater Manchester has had additional restrictions for 2 months now and cases are still increasing then it's not just household transmission if people are following the rules (which they probably aren't).

Cases are positive test results. Most people tested positive have no symptoms or mild symptoms.
PCR tests are unreliable. They find fragments of the virus and don't prove that person is infectious. False positive rate is high depending on a lab.
So "cases" are rising because the number of tests increased and many positive results are false positive.
Policies should not be based on OCR tests and Belgium already confirmed that that would not used PCR tests as a base for policies.
I recommend to watch Ivor Cummings on YouTube. He explained it all very well.

There are more places masks don’t need to be worn than places where they have to be. People go into peoples houses without masks, no masks at school and no masks in some work places.

I think masks should be worn in high schools, I know many won’t agree (including my dc’s).

Genuine question that's juts popped into my mind

Of course.

Next.

The graphic on page 1 showing the proportion of places where Covid-19 was caught lumps schools and colleges together.

After watching the news over the last couple of days, it is clear that the students at colleges and universities living together are causing a massive increase in numbers in this category, not particularly the schools, where cases are still largely isolated, i.e. one pupils catches it and maybe passes it on to their closest contact only, and then the year-group gets sent home and that keeps it out of the wider school. So most schools don't have all year-groups at home.

The superspreader events are happening mostly in colleges/universities not schools.

Masks don't protect from viruses

www.sott.net/article/438827-A-classic-fallacious-argument-If-masks-dont-work-then-why-do-surgeons-wear-them

The really shocking (but not surprising) fact from that graphic on page 1 is the fact that 5% of cases are still being caught in hospital.
That is because the tests take too long to come back. The new fast tests should not be going to aviation and sporting events, but to the NHS to help stop patients catching Covid-19 in hospital.
Plus better PPE for NHS staff. The current PPE is cheap and low quality. And have hospitals examined their air conditioning to ensure it has the correct filters so coronavirus doesn't get blown around the hospital? And all hospitals need the peroxide bomb machines. Could go on forever. This is a shocking statistic.

Masks don't work and nowhere is covid secure. That's all there is to it.

This is why I have reluctantly kept my children at home. Schools are not safe for teachers, students, or their families.

It's community and household transmission in the main part. People like this don't help though

metro.co.uk/2020/09/27/brit-29-who-thought-coronavirus-was-bullt-says-i-am-paying-the-price-13332249/

Went on a lads holiday, had symptoms but ignored them, flew home, went to work all feeling ill and not wearing a mask, ended up hospitalised in the city he works in. Probably shared the virus in Spain, on a plane, in 2 airports, in his house, with his workmates then took it to hospital.

@Lunar567

Most people tested positive have no symptoms or mild symptoms.

Where's the source for that? Most asymptomatic people shouldn't be having a test!

@JinglingHellsBells

Masks reduce the spread by around 3-6%.
That means for every person with Covid, up to 97% per cent can still pass it on, regardless of masking up or not. masks simply help a tiny bit.
Do you have a source for those statements?
Surely it depends on the mask? e.g. if someone is wearing a mask with 95% or 99% filtration then surely that isn't comparable to the cheap surgical masks people are wearing?

Because masks help reduce the risk but certainly don't eliminate it. Nowhere near.

As well as all the situations when people don't wear masks, or don't wear them properly.

It's a bit like asking why people still die in car crashes if seatbelts work.

people have gotten to the point of only wearing them when required - so they people will put them on entering a shop and take them off as they leave

That's what I do - I'm unclear as to why this is a bad thing? You don't need to wear them outside, although if I am going from one shop to another one, I don't bother taking it off inbetween.

Masks reduce spread by a lot more than 3-6% Some figures have put it at 70%. Even if it's half that, it is very significant.

@FatGirlShrinking

Where does that article say he went to work?

@Itsabeautifuldayheyhey it's been all over the media including statements by Dr Jenny Harries at the time. have a google ! :) Very few people are able to buy or wear the better hepafilter masks.

@Lovemusic33

My oldest DC has been wearing a mask to school. She puts one on before leaving the house in the morning, takes it off to eat lunch, then puts on a fresh one after eating until she comes home. They were told in school last week they should not be wearing masks in class. With my support, she's chosen to continue wearing one.