What will New Zealand do long term?

[Missingsockswheresotheygo]

What do people think will happen in New Zealand long term?

I initially thought they were in the best position but now I'm not so sure.

A vaccine won't eradicate the virus it will only suppress it to manageable levels (I think?)

But with their population having no immunity will it not just wreak havoc the minute they open their borders?

@Straven123

Australia is vast - I don't think comparing it to the UK is helpful. Or just another excuse to whinge about Boris.

Yes, there’s no getting away from the fact that we have geography on our side. It’s fairly easy to shut the cities off from each other. Having said that, Sydney is a city of over 5 million people, so it’s not tiny, and yet we have had a couple of hundred deaths in the whole of NSW. The state government has just done a good job. There was a point in March when we had the same number of cases as the U.K. (my husband was in the U.K. so I was keeping a careful watch) but Australia acted decisively, closed borders, got a track and trace app going in weeks, had hundreds of test centres, bought up masses of PPE and that, combined with really thorough track and trace meant we got the outbreak under control. It’s not Boris bashing - I want the UK to do well, we actually run a business in the Midlands, but we lookEd at the U.K. just letting people flood back from Italy, Iran and America and wondered why on Earth an island wouldn’t just close its borders until it knew what was going on.

Apparently the number of people with effective antibodies in countries that have had the virus is under 10% so don't think herd immunity is a thing really. Plus they've had the benefit of being open in terms of retail, cafes, pubs and so on - not to mention an entire generation of children who haven't really missed much school this whole time. It's the last part I'm most jealous of.

I am in NZ but am from UK. My Kiwi partner and I have most of our family in the UK including both elderly parents.

A huge amount of people in NZ were born overseas. Unless a vaccine is found and we are able to open the borders within the next year, it is going to become untenable that we continue to live here.

Whilst I was happy with the initial response by the government, there has been no thought given to anyone who needs to be able to travel due to family overseas. NZ has been welcoming immigrants for decades but soon no one will want to come here if they can never leave. $7000 to quarantine after an overseas visit plus 2 weeks managed isolation is not possible.

We may be virtually Covid free but people are suffering. We had a trip home in July cancelled and now my mother is ill. It's nice to wake up and have the freedoms on a day to day scale but long term the worry is enormous.

Dr Kerry Chant is a Boss, I feel quite confident going about my socially distanced business knowing she has the ear of the Premier and they have this in hand.

Very impressed by both Dr Chant and Gladys Berejiklian. I may not always agree with her politics but she has risen to the occasion on managing this in NSW.

NZ have done well and imo did the right thing closing their borders to protect the population. As others have pointed out - they had to, their health service would not have coped. However what people seem to be missing is that there are only approx 5 million and people in NZ tend to be very community minded, proud of their country, willing to work together. Compare this to the UK - massive population, very fragmented and not integrated. NZ will be ok, they can pick and choose who they let in (always have done and it's not easy to get in) and people will want to go there (provided they can travel). They have good trading agreements esp with Australia and China. I am glad for them, they have protected themselves - no massive immigration, making sure the world views them as a premium partner with premium products and a clean, green environment.

I don’t think there is any point asking NZers to critique their country. They are convinced they are exceptional and can do no wrong.

There was a woman on the radio earlier who returned from NZ to the UK as her father was dying. On return to NZ, the military got on the flight and escorted everyone off onto buses. She was separated from her brother, he went to a hotel in Aukland, she was driven 1.5 hours to Hamilton. They are in managed isolation, she said they have daily health checks and she had a review with a mental health nurse and a covid test yday. She mixes with others from her flight and is able to go outside 3 times a day for exercise. They are kept separate from people who were on different flights.

She said the fee is 3100 dollars (£1500) but she had her fee waived on 'compassionate' grounds.

Doesn't sound too bad to me!

no massive immigration

This is not true.

New Zealand’s net migration rate was 11.4 per 1,000 people in the year ended June 2019 (time period used for international comparability), reflecting annual net migration of about 56,000 for a population of about 4.9 million. This rate is similar to Australia's in 2017–18 but more than triple recent migration rates in the United States and United Kingdom.

They will trade & travel with fellow zerocovid nations in pan-Pacific region, which includes China, Thailand, Vietnam etc

Not one of those countries is a 'zerocovid nation'. Neither is NZ.

@AllAussieAdventures

Dr Kerry Chant is a Boss, I feel quite confident going about my socially distanced business knowing she has the ear of the Premier and they have this in hand.

Very impressed by both Dr Chant and Gladys Berejiklian. I may not always agree with her politics but she has risen to the occasion on managing this in NSW.

Agree - Gladys has done such a good job of balancing the needs of businesses with the need to keep the virus under control. I think she’s got that balance spot on.

@LemonTT " I don’t think there is any point asking NZers to critique their country. They are convinced they are exceptional and can do no wrong."

What do you want them to say? In the shitstorm that has overwhelmed much of the planet they are OK.

Nothing wrong with being pleased about that. Their being OK doesn't make any difference to the UK's situation.

Comparing Ardern and Johnson and I hands down know who I want in charge.

@brushandmop - I didn't phrase that very well. The immigration into NZ is completely different to that of the UK. It is very difficult to get into NZ, I know I've done it, and the majority of people are younger, fit, skilled and able to support themselves, generally NZ doesn't want them if they're not. This gives a completely different population dynamic.

@hesaidshesaidwhat Yes I have done it too. Family immigration is easy and low skilled fruit pickers have been brought in by the thousands.

Back to the point though, NZ immigration will never be the same now. I would give anything to move back to the UK. Sell the house, use the equity and live mortgage free in the UK. Just have to see what the next year holds.

Nz population of around 5-6 million
Uk population over 60 million in the same kind of area , what worked for one country cannot necessarily be applied to another
We have such high population density in many places in the uk as well as being a huge travel hub and being part of europe where travel is done daily in normal times
Travelling to nz easily is only done from a few countries
NZ have done well but you cannot compare uk and nz like for like

@Notfeelinggreattoday - I agree that you cannot compare NZ to the UK like for like. However NZ acted early and hard, and all communication from the government has been communicated clearly, and with a sensible timeframe - which also could have been done in the UK but seems not to have been.

NZ acted early on the curve,

This was when there was already public awareness of what was happening in Europe

It’d be interesting to know what date that would be equivalent to in U.K.

It feels like we are trapped on a luxury liner floating around the Pacific. No one can come in, no one can (realistically) leave.
My partner went to the UK in March and can't come back. Immigration aren't processing paperwork. It sucks. Families are separated and relationships suffering.
Our main industry is tourism. We have no tourists.
I adore our PM but this is unsustainable.

@Notfeelinggreattoday

Nz population of around 5-6 million Uk population over 60 million in the same kind of area , what worked for one country cannot necessarily be applied to another We have such high population density in many places in the uk as well as being a huge travel hub and being part of europe where travel is done daily in normal times Travelling to nz easily is only done from a few countries NZ have done well but you cannot compare uk and nz like for like

NZ is a bad comparison but South Korea is not. Or Taiwan.

NZ has done well but it’s getting a bit overly covered because frankly it’s English speaking and mostly white. Taiwan has 24 million people and a highly respected female president too. Also an island, no COVID cases for 4 months I believe.

Our main industry is tourism. We have no tourists.

Er - what about agriculture?

We do have tourists, just not overseas tourists.

@LemonTT I agree! Far better to get others, who know little or nothing about life in NZ, to critique them and tell them what they're doing wrong and feeling.

Personally I think they must be looking at what is going on here and seething with jealousy. My NZ friends certainly are - but they're hiding it well with their active and virtually unhindered social lives.

Tourism bypassed farming (dairy) as our main industry in 2018/19.

NZ has done a good job, but we can't live like this forever!

We have elderly parents in the UK who need to be visited, family who want to visit us. Schools are experiencing shortfalls of millions of dollars in income because we have no international students - ordinary state schools depend on this money. Our borders need to open, in a controlled way.

@Athrawes, that sounds hard. Do you know why immigration aren't processing paperwork? Is there any indication when this will change?

A lot of people say that the country will need to open up for travel purposes but is it possible that we have seen the end of the golden age of travel? Travel between UK-NZ used to take weeks, maybe it will again. I thought airlines might go under due to climate change concerns eventually if clean energy couldn't be achieved, maybe this is the catalyst instead.

I don't say this to be alarmist in anyway, it's just a possibility that occurred to me.

I think NZ have done absolutely the right thing for NZ. I don’t know what I’d think if I was there and stuck there. I’m not sure if that would make me more positive or more negative about it honestly. The consensus seems to be that people there are satisfied with the situation. I assume they’ll wait for the population to be vaccinated and ‘open up’. I’m sure medical treatments need to be consensual so I’m not sure how they’ll deal with non compliance and all that. The impact of Covid will be less in NZ in every sense though I believe. It’s a different ball game to Europe - large, dense, mobile, interdependent populations make Covid much more politically and logistically challenging.

I also wonder - having seen quite how crappily so many people in other countries, for example the UK, are behaving they'll probably think good riddance. Who'd want us coming in?

Interesting comment. I'm a dual citizen of UK and NZ, living in the UK. A lot of NZers (including my family) seem to be becoming quite xenophobic - a lot of vitriol directed towards overseas NZers returning, for example. I read an article in the Guardian that was saying the campaign of "team of five million" during lockdown inadvertently encouraged this. I definitely think they've handled it well and am envious of how their life hasn't been affected like ours has.