Main points from today anyone?

[Yetiyoga]

Can someone give any info on what was said today? I don't know what to believe with media. I missed it

If they provided realistic guidance - like mix with no more than 3 households, and as minimally and infrequently as possible, I think people would stick to it. So my Mum (not old she's 52) has my DC after school once a week. I'd happily have this has my only arrangement. We actually could just stick to that household contact. 3 households would enable most people to see most of their grown up children/very close relatives.

But Tappity what do expect them to say, the fact is the virus is transmitted from person to person so the more people mix the more it will spread. I agree you are in a very difficult position but it’s just a fact of life, the government cannot magic this away , only people limiting their own social contacts will limit it .

Then I am simply saying that I (and several other families I know) will not comply. However much people on mumsnet froth about it. In the real world, I don’t know people who are willing to sacrifice their earning potential for this, not one. On mumsnet however, everyone is perfectly happy to entirely screw their futures apparently. Sounds like a really sensible plan 👍

www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3563

Thanks for that Orange blossom it does make interesting reading and as to T cells more work needs doing and re the South American populations maybe theres another mechainasm on the go there as it does seem to affect BAME communities in a way we don't seem to understand yet..

It’s currently unclear either T cell immunity if that makes you non infectious. It generally takes 7 days for your T cell attack to reach its peak. Whilst T cell immunity might lead to you having few symptoms they don’t yet know if you’re contagious for a while. Whereas I think they have more knowledge about neutralising antibodies

@diggadoo excellent summary! I second the suggestion that you should report for the BBC.

-stop fucking saying it's like flu, it's worse. It's worse because it's we've never had it before. When the flu made its first appearance it was worse because we didn't have any antibodies

• 8% of the U.K. have immunity but it fades - We can actually contract this again but the more we get it the more we build up antibodies against it - ever heard of the phrase "you never catch the same cold/flu twice"

-you can catch this more than once - as above

• cases are rising, it's got fuck all to do with more tests so stop saying that as well. - testing is pointless in the general population. If we continue testing the care homes, hospital etc and people maintain social distancing etc within these environments all would be fine.

-we'll avoid saying schools opening have contributed to the rising cases, but if you're not dense you'll work this out. - Germs spread, fact of life. -people are going to die, we can't help that. - same again. -we're fluffing you for a big fat bumming from Boris Johnson when he announces six months of restrictions later this week.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54228649 great artical, covers all points.

We cannot keep locking down!!

@tappitytaptap unfortunately what you’ll eventually realise is that unless Society comes together in this crisis our economy and therefore eventually your personal circumstances will be affected anyway however you choose to act personally.

Well if we all don’t comply they have explained what will happen so at least we know where we are heading.

Just read in the BBC news report on NS latest briefing to Scotland that there is to be a COBRA meeting tomorrow morning.

@Hollyhead

If they provided realistic guidance - like mix with no more than 3 households, and as minimally and infrequently as possible, I think people would stick to it. So my Mum (not old she's 52) has my DC after school once a week. I'd happily have this has my only arrangement. We actually could just stick to that household contact. 3 households would enable most people to see most of their grown up children/very close relatives.

I think a set number of households mixing overall would make sense.

I'd say no more than 2 households mixing at any one time, and households limiting to mixing with 3 other households at any time so that over a week/month families can see both sets of GPs and one other.

I also think Scotland's rule of no more than 2 households mixing socially makes much more sense than allowing groups of 6 different households to mix. Especially when you consider that when you say "only x number" a lot of people will always add on 2/3 more.

I also think that schools need to be given money to allow them to use facilities to bubble properly to minimise closures. The HT of DS and DD's school, and the other local primary, put together a great plan, working together, using a community centre on the school site to have properly separate bubbled areas, but they weren't allowed to use other buildings and don't have the budgets to take on the 3 members of staff that would have made the plan perfect.

[quote Atalune]**@diggadoo

I like what you said a lot. Can you please get a reposting job with the Beeb so you can say the immortal words “fluffing us for a bumming from Boris”

I think this sums it up perfectly.[/quote]
"fluffing us for a bumming from Boris"
(credit to @diggadoo)

7 words that sum it up perfectly !

@Oaktree55 and can you tell me about how you would lose half your income in that scenario please? And how it’s ok for me to lose that and my house - that’s fine by you is it?

@tappitytaptap

Then I am simply saying that I (and several other families I know) will not comply. However much people on mumsnet froth about it. In the real world, I don’t know people who are willing to sacrifice their earning potential for this, not one. On mumsnet however, everyone is perfectly happy to entirely screw their futures apparently. Sounds like a really sensible plan 👍

And this is the problem. Because Tappity can't comply and still feed her kids, and because the risk of serious I'll health / death by covid is less than risk of serious ill health /death by being homeless, she'll break the rules. Then someone else will say well if Tippity is doing what she wants, so will I and I'll have my best mate over, and that breaking of rules is contagious. If the Govt said look, the risk if you're over X is 75% really bad, but we accept not all people can live on infinite savings and family money, so well make a reasonable set of rules, Pele would comply and the thin wedge of dissent would disappear.

So saying "3 households max but ideally 2, no physical contact except to provide care" and just making the facts about vulnerability clear would have, imo, higher compliance rate and lower contact with other people across the board

@tappitytaptap obviously it’s not fine no. However the economy is intrinsically linked to health. Without getting the virus under control the economy will take a bigger hit. If hospitals get overwhelmed, crying nurses/Dr.s/families on TV people won’t be out spending. There isn’t one without the other.

The most advantageous thing for all of us to do is pull together stop the spread.

i didnt see the point of that today no everyone is jut guessing what the new lockdowns will be

they should have had a minister straight after on to tell us

Of course that’s not fine but if this virus takes hold people will be ill and unable to work , businesses will go bust , some people will sadly die . I am not sure what you do for a living but if it requires people then you could be in trouble, we need to find a balance. We need to try to preserve the health of the nation so that people can keep working as much as possible

"There is no evidence at all for T-cell immunity induced by other coronaviruses making a major contribution to the seriousness of the disease."

Willem van Schaik, Prof of Microbiology and Infection: microbial genomics, metagenomics & evolution of antibiotic resistance and director of the Institute of Microbiology and Infection at Birmingham University.
mobile.twitter.com/WvSchaik/status/1307991518960144384

But pulling together for me would mean only seeing my parents for childcare reasons. It might be a lot simpler for a family for example with older children to not mix, but for us, and countless of our friends, we just cannot stop mixing entirely. Even if you deem my job replacable, I can think of 3 NHS families off the top of my head who can’t work without grandparent childcare. Two are nurses- should they resign in the interests of pulling together?

Plus if you get ill who is going to look after your family then?

We moved in with my parents for the last lockdown. This was expressly permitted by the government. We will do so again if needed (and we may need to anyway in the event that we can’t find another house to buy as have just sold ours). I mean maybe if we can’t find another house we should live on the streets just to ensure households aren’t mixing

If schools close again that's the end of my career.

I'll still be seeing my family. I'm not doing that again.