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Original poster

When do we end lockdowns and let people live a full life

334 replies

frasersmummy · 31/08/2020 21:20

It's looking ever more likely more cities including Glasgow will go back into lockdown..

Mainly from what I can see to stop people meeting indoors

There has to come a point when mental health is as important as physical health.. Keeping loved ones apart does noones mental health any. Good

So where do we draw the line.. There has to be a point when lockdown is just wrong.

For me it's wrong now.. Enough of keeping friends and families apart

OP posts:
StealthPolarBear · 31/08/2020 22:16

@AHippoNamedBooBooButt

I'm guessing you don't know anyone that has had covid severely then? I love my parents dearly and would rather suffer 6 months of not seeing them closely then risk them spending the rest of their lives with lung damage.
How about a year? Two? Five?
Schmeebles · 31/08/2020 22:17

@TheAdventuresoftheWishingChair

Do you really think everyone would just feel so much be happier and less stressed if we just say “sod it” and let it kill people????

We don't fall apart as a society knowing that cancer kills huge numbers of people year in, year out. We don't spend any significant time thinking about the many people injured in car accidents let alone the vulnerable children who die of malaria and things like diarrhoea around the world. I'm not wanting lots of people to die of this virus, obviously, but I don't think it's as simple as that. Am I distressed by the fact maybe 60k have died of Covid in this country? Yes, in some ways when I stop and think about it although I only know of one person personally who died and he was elderly and counts as one of the people who would have likely died in the next year anyway (and he had a good life. Dying at that age is natural). A couple of stories of deaths locally have made me stop in particular to think how very sad for those families, but what has made a very significant impact on my life is lockdown so it isn't black and white. Death is a part of life. If you are, in fact, sitting at home day after day feeling personally traumatised by things like malaria or deaths from terrorism in the Middle East, then obviously that's different but I can't think for most people that's their reality. I am at low risk if I catch the virus (if I haven't already had it - I was on the tube a lot in March in London so who knows). I am at pretty high risk with my mental health if I have to put up with much more isolation, however. That is a significant issue for me. I am spending an absolute fortune on private mental health support to keep myself going but I'm still vulnerable.

As a society we take precautions about all of those things though. Screening, seat belts, vaccines.... So not really comparable to just saying sod-it with COVID?
Northernsoullover · 31/08/2020 22:20

But what are our choices? The virus is still there. If they say just run with it people are going to get sick. If learning to live with it means accepting that I could give me father a premature send off then I don't think I'm prepared to do that. That's all our choices are at the moment.
I'm not hysterical, I'm not 'living in fear'. Tomorrow I'll go to work outside the home as normal and go to the gym as normal but I won't sit in my parents house Sad. I think people are getting carried away by the whole low numbers/low deaths thing at the moment and forgetting that we are still unsure if the low severe case rate is caused by the low figures. We don't know if the hospital admissions back in March and April are because it was a small percentage of 100k plus infections, now it is a small percentage of a small number of infections.
Unfortunately due to the lack of testing in the spring it is difficult to compare. That's why the increase in infections that we WILL see soon will be a more accurate predictor of how this virus is behaving and only then should we consider letting our guard down completely.

latticechaos · 31/08/2020 22:20

@yawnsvillex

Now! ....

It has to end now.

It's really not going to end now. The majority of the voting population won't be ok with the numbers of deaths this would risk.
Eng123 · 31/08/2020 22:21

Get over yourself! Beat the virus first. I've got vulnerable parents who haven't seen their grandchildren in a long time. I realise this is necessary and I hope that we all come through it together. People using MH as an excuse just extends the pandemic and risks my children never seeing their elderly grandparents again.

Desperado24 · 31/08/2020 22:25

@Eng123

Get over yourself! Beat the virus first. I've got vulnerable parents who haven't seen their grandchildren in a long time. I realise this is necessary and I hope that we all come through it together. People using MH as an excuse just extends the pandemic and risks my children never seeing their elderly grandparents again.
At what point have we achieved "beat the virus"?

People cant live like this for years.

Northernsoullover · 31/08/2020 22:26

I need to add that I do have sympathy with poor mental health. I had a severe 'episode' (I don't like to call it a breakdown) mid lockdown. I had to have a lot of help from my GP to get back on an even keel.

amicissimma · 31/08/2020 22:33

" I have an extremely clinically vulnerable family member - unfortunately they just won’t be seeing my children again this year in person, certainly not close up. "

And if that family member becomes ill from some cause that isn't Covid and dies one day this year, as 1500 people do a day in the UK, will you be pleased that s/he went without seeing your children? Will you think that was a good thing?

Eng123 · 31/08/2020 22:34

22:25Desperado24
People can live like this for many years if needed , it's not so restrictive. The point is if people truly observe the guidelines we won't spend years this way.

Derbygerbil · 31/08/2020 22:35

I get ending lockdown doesn't mitigate the physical risk.. But it mitigates the mental risk for all of us..which I think is a greater risk at the moment

I understand your frustration, but I’m pretty sure ending restrictions wouldn’t remove everyone’s
mental issues, on the contrary as many of the vulnerable will suddenly feel a lot more vulnerable!

Unless you are brazenly flouting restrictions, there is little to stop you from meeting who you want, when you want, anyway. Those who are more anxious and carefully socially distancing are hardly likely to throw caution to the wind just because someone in Government says “we bored of this now... let’s get completely back to normal.”

Desperado24 · 31/08/2020 22:37

@Eng123

22:25Desperado24 People can live like this for many years if needed , it's not so restrictive. The point is if people truly observe the guidelines we won't spend years this way.
People won't want to live like this for years. The fallout will be massive in so many other areas of life.

2 people died n the whole UK of this virus today. I bet more people died from Bank Holiday DIY accidents, its stupid and we need to start getting back to normal.

Derbygerbil · 31/08/2020 22:38

At what point have we achieved "beat the virus"?
People cant live like this for years.

It all depends on the vaccine.... If one doesn’t come next year, we’ll just have to live with it.

Desperado24 · 31/08/2020 22:41

@Derbygerbil

*At what point have we achieved "beat the virus"? People cant live like this for years.*

It all depends on the vaccine.... If one doesn’t come next year, we’ll just have to live with it.

There won't be a vaccine next year, and if there is it will have been rushed and I won't be going anywhere near it.

Let's just put stuff back to normal now, let people make their own risk assessments, and "if" we end up with a massive spike in hospital admissions then take a step back again.

Should have done a Sweden from day 1

cherryblossommorningstoday · 31/08/2020 22:41

Unbelievably selfish attitude!

Would thousands more dying, including those that could well be part of your family /friends, really improve your mental health.

If we all abided properly by the lockdown rules in the first place, more would be relaxed now!

minnieok · 31/08/2020 22:43

To be honest I think many people stopped following "the rules" months ago. I'm seeing my kids and stayed with family and friends

minnieok · 31/08/2020 22:44

@LaurieFairyCake

I've had covid. Like most people I didn't get sick. 80% + don't get sick

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 31/08/2020 22:45

Some people truly will not know what to do with themselves if they don't have all the drama of bloody lockdowns and rulz and guidelines to wet their pants over.

Lazypuppy · 31/08/2020 22:47

The death rate is ridiculously low, people on ventilators is the same and cases are low, with most asymptomatic.

I agree it needs to end now, 'if' there is a big rise again then thry can put restrictions back.

Honestly i have no idea what the rules are anymore and most people i know are back to normal with seeing friends/family

Desperado24 · 31/08/2020 22:47

[quote minnieok]@LaurieFairyCake

I've had covid. Like most people I didn't get sick. 80% + don't get sick[/quote]
So have I . Barely noticed.

My wife who shared a bed with me throughout didn't get it. My kids didn't get it. My elderly Mum who I had seen three days before the positive test didn't get it (or if she did she didn't notice)

Triangularbubble · 31/08/2020 22:48

“And if that family member becomes ill from some cause that isn't Covid and dies one day this year, as 1500 people do a day in the UK, will you be pleased that s/he went without seeing your children? Will you think that was a good thing?“

Pleased?!!!?! Of course not. Don’t be so crass. Nobody wants this situation. There are no neat perfect cost free answers and no one can predict the future. But the chances of them dying otherwise are low - they’re not elderly, they have generally good health and the condition causing the extreme vulnerability is temporary. Would I risk what is hopefully another 20+ years of that relationship for the sake of meeting in person rather than via video for a few months? Hell no. I regard it as equivalent to they’ve emigrated to Australia for a year (a not implausible scenario for them) - tough but very manageable. If they were very elderly or terminally ill I might feel differently, but under those circumstances I’m not sure the absence of permission from politicians would be what was stopping me either.

GetKnitted · 31/08/2020 22:51

It's just depressing and there will come a point when depression. Is a bigger killer than this virus

Depression is no where near being as big a killer as coronavirus, not close in any way shape or form. Also it is not either we get coronoavirus or we get depression. We think what we have been through is bad, but so far we have actually been saved from the worst of it. Actually losing your family to coronavirus is (in my opinion) more likely to give you depression than having to talk to them on the phone instead of in person.

I really do understand that it is hard at the moment and you are letting off steam. But it doesn't help us bring this virus under control if people are continuously second guessing whether they think we aught to actually fix it.

CrazyToast · 31/08/2020 22:51

This is a shit situation. No two ways about it. And there is nothing we can do about. This sadly is the way it is. Totally reasonable to feel bad/scared/angry and vent. It will pass.

amicissimma · 31/08/2020 22:51

"People can live like this for many years if needed"

It depends what you mean by 'live'.

Many people may not have that many years left. They, like me, would like to be truly alive while we're still on this earth, interacting properly with other members of the human race, accepting that being alive carries all sorts of risks and that only death is certain. What right does anyone have to tell others they must simply exist in semi-isolation for many years, to allow other people to claim extra years of existance? Anyone has the option of hiding away themselves, if that suits them and they can persuade others to service their needs.

I agree with taking action if there's a threat that the NHS will be overwhelmed. We've avoided that once and know how to do so again, but after the big wave, or between them, if that's how it plays out, IMO it's reasonable to enjoy life to the full, and, importantly, keep earning enough to pay for the NHS when needed and keep working on getting the next generation ready to take over the reins when we're gone.

Triangularbubble · 31/08/2020 22:52

And I don’t think it’ll be years, even in the unlikely scenario there is no vaccine. Faster, easier, very widespread testing and/or good therapeutic drugs (inhaled interferon, monoclonal antibodies etc etc) could make a big big difference.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 31/08/2020 22:52

No Deal Brexit is going to be so much fun with all the doom mongers almost praying for a 'second wave' of Covid to go with it just to jump up and down screeching, 'I told you so!'