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UK's daily death rate is now the highest in the world

184 replies

effingterrified · 26/05/2020 18:04

"The UK now has the highest rate of confirmed deaths from Covid-19 worldwide, averaging close to 5 in every million people per day.

Figures from the last seven days show that the average death rate in the UK is now more than that of France and Italy combined."

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/coronavirus-uk-death-toll-rate-world-map-tracked-a9532286.html

OP posts:
palacegirl77 · 04/06/2020 21:09

Haven't read the whole thread. Got to first page and saw too many "yeah but" posts. Give it up. We've been failed.

XingMing · 04/06/2020 21:23

@noostrich, I agree that the UK is not batting well here, but we have an antiquated and disjointed health care apparatus built to deal with acute care rather than a pandemic. Of the countries that have succeeded in containment, most are in Asia and most have experienced previous flare ups of viral conditions. We tried to play the wrong ball, and haven't done it very well. The NHS preparations were looking in the wrong direction. But I don't blame the government, except for not locking down sooner. If there's not a decent track and trace operation very soon, I shall revise my opinion.

How did other countries do better? They have more diverse health care environments. They make use of private health facilities, rather than insisting on a purist state funded system, and ensure both public and private systems do what each does best. When you send tests to the US for checking and they're lost or compromised in transit, and you could have used private labs in Aberdeen or Bangor or Canterbury, it makes the system look stupid.

XingMing · 04/06/2020 21:27

I take your point @trending. As a family we were watching it closely by end January because DS is friendly with people in China from school. But politicians weren't and nor were NHS procurement.

trenndingnow · 04/06/2020 22:03

They make use of private health facilities, rather than insisting on a purist state funded system this isn't true either... (sorry!) google healthcare in south korea, france, australia, etc etc - often universal care is provided with some private thrown in... in substance much the same as the UK just better funded by taxation and better managed....nowt to do with "purist state" anything...

XingMing · 05/06/2020 10:03

France has universal care provision, but it isn't free unless you are dependent on benefits, because adults contribute to the state medical scheme according to earnings/income/pension. Then you pay for GP appointments, and for medication, and recover most of what you paid. If you see a nurse (perhaps to have dressings checked) there's a nursing centre you attend for the care, and you pay for that too!

A similar system exists in NZ (don't know about Australia or S Korea). When we needed a doctor in NZ the cost of an appointment was $60 15 years ago!

venetianblue · 05/06/2020 10:15

@trending sorry, but you are wrong. have you lived in these countries? all the employed and working population has a mutuelle = private health insurance. it is nothing like nhs. 100 % coverage is only in limited circumstances such as pregnancy care and for those on benefits

trenndingnow · 05/06/2020 10:33

France has universal care provision, but it isn't free unless you are dependent on benefits, because adults contribute to the state medical scheme according to earnings/income/pension this is the same as the UK - in the UK you pay via NI - the French equivalent "cotisations" - which are a significantly higher proportion of an individual's income which is a key difference and a part of the reason why the NHS and other public services are a mess in the UK. In france if you are working you also pay for a top up private insurance - in the UK many subscribe to BUPA. It isn't the same, but the differences is not to do with "purist state" in the UK - anything but in fact.

Then you pay for GP appointments, and for medication, and recover most of what you paid. If you see a nurse (perhaps to have dressings checked) there's a nursing centre you attend for the care, and you pay for that too! as you say, you recover most of what you have paid....the state sends you a cheque... and the top up insurer if you have one, a small percentage.

@venetianblue i have lived in other countries, yes. And while in the UK I would often go to a private doctor because the NHS gp was so inadequate - it was cheaper for me to pay 45 euro to get some antibiotics than to spend several hours in a nhs surgery waiting only to be told that I would have to go back and wait in a couple of days again if I wanted antibiotics - the argument about whether antibiotics were required aside... but anyway, as we are all agreeing that the NHS is not fit for purpose - my point was that the failure is to do with underfunding and poor management, not anything to do with "purist state". About being free at the point of use - if a non resident uses it they are sent a bill afterwards. It isn't a free for all.

LastTrainEast · 05/06/2020 11:09

ToffeeYoghurt of course "'second in the world per million" is not great, but that doesn't make it ok to twist the figures as some are doing. Also you do realise that someone has to be second and indeed first?

It's the way any list works. If we put you in charge of the world someone would still be living in the worst country, but then it would be your fault they were.

XingMing · 05/06/2020 13:02

I think we all agree that the UK's healthcare system is not as all-embracing as some would wish it to be, or the envy of the world. But how a better system should be or would be funded, and what it should cover while remaining free at the point of use is an endless series of questions and answers that is always politically polarised and divisive on MN and everywhere else. Meanwhile the poor old NHS tries to do everything. Some of it, like acute care, is brilliant but there's a lot of areas where it creaks and leaks.

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