At the garden centre....on home oxygen

[Clemmieandareallybigbunfight]

Went to buy plants. Lady in the queue looking frail and with husband carrying her home oxygen tank. Life is for living

I'm sure many would say she should stay at home but I applaud her.

I hope she has many happy visits to buy plants.

BamboozledandBefuddled ha ha imagine living with some of these posters? My God. Dementors indeed sucking all the joy from life one cats bum mouth at a time

Understanding what the virus can and cannot do and managing risk intelligently with informed personal responsibility is the only way forward now with this damn thing. Down the other route madness lies and it looks like it has infected some already.

Her decision
She is no more likely to pass on the virus than anyone else going out

I don't judge people who are very cautious, or those who take what they consider reasonable risks

I'm 63, healthy weight and no health problems
retired, no family anywhere or other resposibilities

So I have returned to the gym 5 days per week (in Germany)
and will go to outdoor restaurants several days too

BUT
. I wear a mask outdoors
. I haven't been in a supermarket or any other indoor shop since mid-march; just use outdoor farm shop or online
. I have cancelled all my retirement plans for day cruises, museums, galleries etc

So I suppose I'd get yelled at by both sets of extremists:
those who think I should stay home
and those who think I should dump the masks, spend money as usual and get the economy going

Too many people sticking their beak in other people's business
You do you

Dementors on both sides - I ignore them all and do what works for me

I can see both sides of this, but for me it comes down to what @Sparklywolf said

Yes of course we all have the right to make a personal risk assessment about our actions but we also have a responsibility to consider the consequences for other people, especially when those consequences could be a cluster of deaths

If people just have family care, then fine, but if they're having carers coming in to help and those carers are going to help other vulnerable people then I think I think the person does have a responsibility to do all they can to avoid catching it & infecting others. I don't think a Garden Centre is the best choice to get outside in that situation.

I kind of agree with this sentiment. I'm a doctor and have treated many a covid patient. But if I was elderly or had limited time left on this earth anyway, I may just say screw it and go outside!

My grandparent went to buy a paper after months stuck inside their retirement flat, my dad and his siblings went ballistic at her. Yes she shouldn't have done it, but I do have some empathy for her and how lonely she must be. I self isolated for 7 days and started to lose my mind, I can't imagine how hard it must be for those who are shielding or very elderly.

@Campervan69 I used to live with one - my nan lived with us when I was a kid and she was definitely a dementor! She'd be in her element if she was alive now

Also if she is home home oxygen therapy from my experience the most common reasons would be: End stage COPD, pulmonary fibrosis or advanced cancer. I'd hedge my bets that this woman is likely to be terminally ill.

We don't resuscitate people with the above conditions (except in exceptional circumstances) and she would not be artificially ventilated (it wouldn't bloody well work and would be a very undignified death). So the most that would happen most likely is she would be admitted to hospital and sent to the covid ward for some oxygen to see if she recovered. She wouldn't be hogging an ICU bed.

@flapjackfairy

” If you are on oxygen you are in the shielded category who should still be in until the end of June. Lockdown relaxation does not apply to this category . If she wants to ignore that then if she gets ill I hope she stays home and doesn't expect hosp treatment if she contracts the virus or indeed spread it to others ( like her husband ) who then pass away as well. The shielding measures are in place for good reason .”

Shielding is to protect the individual, not the wider public. If she chooses to ignore the guidance, that’s her decision.
Shielded people are no more likely to pass on the virus (if they have it) than non shielded people.
Shielded people are more likely to get complications if (and only if) they catch the virus.

Shielded people aren’t germ vectors who only have to look at a covid positive person on TV, catch the virus through the TV and pass it on to everyone in a 5 mile radius. Some people are acting like they are!

When you develop a life limiting disease with organ failure, you can tell us about your life and we’ll all judge you, eh?! I hope this doesn’t ever happen to you.

My grandparent went to buy a paper after months stuck inside their retirement flat, my dad and his siblings went ballistic at her. Yes she shouldn't have done it, but I do have some empathy for her and how lonely she must be. I self isolated for 7 days and started to lose my mind, I can't imagine how hard it must be for those who are shielding or very elderly.

I completely agree. My elderly uncle has been to the paper shop, Tesco, the bank and is planning trips to M&S and a garden centre. I'm sorting out shopping for him but he's had enough of being cooped up - he was indoors for 6 weeks before lockdown after a hip replacement. Maybe I should try and talk him out of it but he's an adult capable of making his own decisions.

I may be being thick, but I don't understand the rage on this thread. The shielding advice is advice. And as pp said, people who are on the shielding list are not somehow more infectious than anyone else. The only difference between a person on the shielding list and everyone else is that the virus is more likely to kill them.

If you are on oxygen you are in the shielded category who should still be in until the end of June. Lockdown relaxation does not apply to this category

It does if the person on the shielding list decides they don't wish to shield or decides to adopt a looser form of shielding.

This thread’s mind blowing. Dementor central. As a wise pp said, you do you - and then mind your own business.

@Hunnybears If she needs oxygen to go to the shop, she won't be put on a ventilator if she catches Covid-19. She probably won't even be taken to hospital. She wouldn't be a suitable candidate for a ventilator.

Ah sorry @Hunnybears I hadn't seen that others had already said the same thing as me!

I Get quite angry that people are putting their lives and their children’s lives on hold and turning their worlds upside down, loosing jobs and businesses as well as freedom to protect the elderly. And they aren’t helping themselves but going out for inessential shopping and not socially isolating. Grow plants from seeds like I did this year. Typical boomer generation that doesn’t care that us and our children will be paying for this for years to come long after they’ve shuffled off this mortal coil.

No one is turning their lives upside down to protect the elderly.

The idea of saving the nhs from the very people who need it is ridiculous yes she will be using a much needed bed - needed by her.

I think the drunks and time wasters who usually overrun a and e but who are now mysteriously absent pose more of a risk to the smooth functioning of the nhs

Damn those pesky elderly people....we should lock them up for their own good...thinking they know what's best for them..it's a bloody outrage

Or we could, of course, let them make their own decisions about whether they go out or not, seeing as they're adult humans and not 3 year olds. So how about we do that instead.

I Get quite angry that people are putting their lives and their children’s lives on hold and turning their worlds upside down, loosing jobs and businesses as well as freedom to protect the elderly

Bollocks. That is NOT what this is about.

If she is irresponsible then everyone else there is too. She is no more likely to infect others than anyone else.

Was she staying 2 metres from everyone?
It's all outdoors yeah?

I Get quite angry that people are putting their lives and their children’s lives on hold and turning their worlds upside down, loosing jobs and businesses as well as freedom to protect the elderly

Not everyone in the shielded group is elderly. And you haven't been told to protect the elderly or the shielded - everything your whining about is being done to protect the NHS. The people you and others are bitching about aren't going to be taking up the ICU beds and ventilators - so the pitiful excuses for human beings on this and other threads can stop getting hysterical.

And DH - who's in the shielding group but not shielding - said you can take your 'protection' and shove it.

I Get quite angry that people are putting their lives and their children’s lives on hold and turning their worlds upside down, loosing jobs and businesses as well as freedom to protect the elderly.

How many times? This is NOT why we're on lockdown. We're on lockdown to try to slow the progress of the virus, and protect the NHS from being hit by lots of people needing it at once.

Old people do NOT have to stay indoors. Old people have not been instructed to shield. Those of any age who've been advised to shield due to medical conditions still get to choose whether or not they do. And if they have a terminal condition they've been clearly told that shielding doesn't have to apply.

Your blatant ageism is both misdirected and very unpleasant @FoodologistGirl

Nothing to applaud here?

These silly short sighted posts really get on my nerves.... are you really that thick that you can't see the repercussions from this woman's selfish behaviour?

Scratch that. I already know the answer.