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Original poster

"lips must turn blue before an ambulance will come out"

213 replies

lljkk · 26/04/2020 09:09

I've heard that claim a few times, about probable cv19 cases not being allowed to go to hospital.

Is it true or just hyperbole? I think it might be a gross exaggeration. Does anyone have a link to a real named person or even an NHS staff person saying this has happened?

I'm happy to see a SAD face in tabloids where someone is willing to not anonymously say it happened to themself or their loved one or their patient. I can't even find a tabloid story like that, though.

OP posts:
Hagisonthehill · 26/04/2020 13:33

We've had patients over 100 admitted and recover in our hospital so age is not a barrier.People in nursing homes are there because they already need nursing care,taking them from familiar surroundings to die would not be a kind thing to do.

Buxbaum · 26/04/2020 13:33

Some Fitbits and Garmin sports watches have pulse ox sensors.

onlinelinda · 26/04/2020 13:35

I don't know. The day they came, they were ridiculously busy, I know that. I would think it isn't blanket. And that it's changed over tome , as they've got more organised. I took it as a reflection of the stress they felt under themselves, which may have been particularly bad at that time.

Lemonblast · 26/04/2020 13:37

Watcherintherye there has been widespread media coverage of patients in their 70s, 80s and 90s leaving hospital after surviving Covid. But sharing those stories on MN doesn’t really fit with the rhetoric.

Humphriescushion · 26/04/2020 13:43

Thanks for that information @BovaryX. The no.s in hospital have seemed very low to me in relation to thr death rate.

Gwenhwyfar · 26/04/2020 13:46

"Some Fitbits and Garmin sports watches have pulse ox sensors."

None of the basic varieties I think so that would be an expensive purchase and would you trust they were good enough?

Gwenhwyfar · 26/04/2020 13:47

"People in nursing homes are there because they already need nursing care,taking them from familiar surroundings to die would not be a kind thing to do."

I was told by someone who works in a nursing home (or could be a care home, not sure) that most of their residents/patients would not be eligible for the treatment anyway so would not be taken to hospital.

Buxbaum · 26/04/2020 13:59

I’m not suggesting that anyone goes out and buys a Fitbit or a Garmin specifically for the pulse ox sensor! Clearly I should have made this explicit but I thought as Fitbits in particular are very popular it might be helpful to mention in case anyone already owns one and doesn’t realise that it has this feature, in which case it would save them buying anything new.

I cannot comment on accuracy but I imagine you could start noticing the readings a few times a day to get a sense of what is normal for you so that if there is a drop you can notice it, even if the number isn’t exactly the reading you’d get on a medical-grade oximeter.

Meowstro · 26/04/2020 14:00

If you really think you are that bad surely you wouldn’t wait for an ambulance for hours and hours.

No, if you suspect you have Coronavirus, you can't take a taxi. In my case, DH couldn't go as we had our sleeping DC at home. In normal circumstances, I'd totally agree but I wouldn't wish it upon anyone getting the symptoms I had.

WatcherintheRye · 26/04/2020 14:07

People in nursing homes are there because they already need nursing care,taking them from familiar surroundings to die would not be a kind thing to do.

Well yes, of course I understand that may be so in many cases, but I suppose I was thinking of care homes in general, rather than nursing homes in particular, and not people who were on the verge of dying, but those who could benefit from non-invasive treatment such as oxygen. Not all care home residents are at death's door, or confused and distressed.

there has been widespread media coverage of patients in their 70s, 80s and 90s leaving hospital after surviving Covid.

Yes, but were they care home residents?

Gwenhwyfar · 26/04/2020 14:12

"If you really think you are that bad surely you wouldn’t wait for an ambulance for hours and hours."

What would you do then? Start crawling to the hospital? You shouldn't be in a taxi and if you don't have a family member who can drive you...

CrazyToast · 26/04/2020 14:14

I highly doubt this because if your lips are turning blue it is central cyanosis and pretty serious already. But that doesn't mean that some misinformed person, even paramedic, hasn't said it somewhere.

BovaryX · 26/04/2020 14:19

@Humphriescushion

This paragraph is particularly relevant from the Times article.

News2 allocates a score to vital signs including breathing rate, oxygen saturation, temperature, blood pressure, pulse rate and level of consciousness. Originally a score of five indicated a need for hourly monitoring.From March 12 paramedics in the capital were told that suspected Covid-19 patients scoring as high as six might not need to be hospitalised

SuspensionWithoutSuspense · 26/04/2020 14:21

I'm glad some people have had positive experiences but I haven't. Had a similar experience but through 111 not 999.

I'd been ill for about 2 weeks, over the Easter weekend peak unfortunately, and my DH called 111 as I was struggling to breathe. The lady on the phone asked to speak to me and asked for my details but I couldn't finish giving her the information as I was so breathless, delirious and shaking all over with severe chest pains. Passed back over to my DH and he was asked if my lips had turned blue. He said no, and the 111 lady said the ambulance service was extremely busy and to be really sure an ambulance was absolutely necessary... DH felt guilty and started questioning his judgement. He said he thought it was pretty serious, but was told to just bring me up himself if he was worried as they were very busy. We had two young children in bed and I couldn't walk! He explained this and she said she'd speak to the Covid team and ask them to call us back.

They took around 2/3 hours to call back and by that point I was just about managing to breathe a little bit. The Covid team said the reason for my chest pain was from the coughing - I didn't have a cough! They said it's not Covid then and to speak to my GP on Monday...

SuspensionWithoutSuspense · 26/04/2020 14:23

I'm in south east London.

BovaryX · 26/04/2020 14:33

The lady on the phone asked to speak to me and asked for my details but I couldn't finish giving her the information as I was so breathless, delirious and shaking all over with severe chest pains. Passed back over to my DH and he was asked if my lips had turned blue. He said no, and the 111 lady said the ambulance service was extremely busy and to be really sure an ambulance was absolutely necessary... DH felt guilty and started questioning his judgement

Your experience is corroborated by the report in the Sunday Times which I linked earlier in the thread. It is interesting that you say your husband felt guilty as he was challenged about the severity of your condition. Patients who require medical treatment should not feel guilty about trying to access it. I hope you are feeling better now.

Choccyp1g · 26/04/2020 14:34

Thing is though, all the people posting that they were refused hospital, are on here posting, so they did survive without going to hospital.

Original poster
lljkk · 26/04/2020 14:36

@WatcherintheRye
What is the difference between a care home and a nursing home? (sorry, I am foreign so honestly don't know).

OP posts:
Lemonblast · 26/04/2020 14:36

Suspension did you get to hospital safely? Has anyone else in your household been infected and what have their experiences been?

Choccyp1g · 26/04/2020 14:37

That said, I've told my son to say I am turning blue if it get to that question.

circusintown · 26/04/2020 14:37

@Meowstro

"In my case, DH couldn't go as we had our sleeping DC at home"

Your husband couldn't drive you to hospital because of a sleeping child? Am I reading that right?

Complexico · 26/04/2020 14:41

@SuspensionWithoutSuspense I am sorry but if you were that bad, you put your children in the car and your DH drives you to hospital and drops you off / gets someone to help you in the door. They gave you good advice - come to hospital if you feel you need it.

You ignored that advice and now you are blaming 111.

Porcupineinwaiting · 26/04/2020 14:47

Yeah @Choccyp1g and what about the ones who didn't survive- where will they post? I'm surviving COVID despite the NHS, not because of it. Hopefully I'll continue to survive cause there's no help to be had.

EllaPaella · 26/04/2020 14:47

A close family member who lives in London was basically told this when she phoned for help back in March when she had the virus. She was struggling to breathe and had terrible chest pain and called for help. She was told it would take in excess of 2 hours for a crew to come out to her so to call back if her lips went blue or she became unresponsive (although how she would manage to make a call under those circumstances is anyone's guess).
Her husband just drove her to A&E which was very busy and full of suspected covid patients but she was seen and treated very quickly once there.

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