"Some" disruptive social distancing to be in place till the end of the year

[Frompcat]

Says Chris Witty. Nothing unexpected but I really wish they would say what they're talking about when they say shit like this. What does "some" mean? Schools? WFH? Family visits?

it makes sense not to give details if they said blah blah in 8 weeks and then circumstances ie science meant that the blah blah could not happen then some folk would be outraged far better not to make a promise you can't keep !

People will die of cancer because of this, there is no doubt. Cancer isn't going to stop developing because of Covid.

About 1000 people are diagnosed with cancer each day in the UK. These diagnosis come from mammograms, smears and bowel cancer screenings, none of which are happening now. Plus all the people who will discover their own symptoms but either won't go to their GP or won't get referred if they do. By the time some of these people do eventually get diagnosed their cancer will have already spread and will be stage 4.

And of course the all the people whose active cancer treatment plan has been stopped or changed.

It's such a hideous balancing act, but lockdown might save some lives but cause other deaths.

I would be quite happy to use a contract tracing app.

They are not treating the general public like children, it’s because at this moment in time they don’t know exactly what shape it will take. They could say right we are going to do x y and z, but then later on when about to start x y and z the damn virus dies a curveball and a b and c heave to be done to great moans and insults from the public

Ehh... This is exactly what we mean when we say they're treating us like children.

Prime example: our holiday to disney got cancelled in March and they rebooked me for September. Have I told my children we rebooked for September? No, because I don't want to get my children's hopes up, because I, as an adult, know that this "damn virus" could throw a curveball and we won't be going in September.

I decided it was better to keep them in the dark because as children they don't really need to know the details, just that we will eventually be going to Disneyland at some date in future.

I generally thought adults could handle preliminary information with the caveat that it is subject to change.

We all understand it's an unpredictable situation. What I'd like to know is if X happens, we're going to do Y. Or we hope to do Z but this could change if W happens.

It's not that difficult for adults to understand, is it?

Firstly, @frompcat, I completely agree with you stance that if there IS NO plan at present, the best thing the powers that be could do is own up to that fact. Clear and honest information is the absolute least they should be expected to do. I don't know why so many posters have seemingly wilfully misunderstood you on this thread.

Secondly, @bluebeck, whilst your statement "I don't think I will be able to go on holiday, go to theatre, a gig, a cinema, possibly even a restaurant for that period of time", referring to 18 months, is gloomy, it is manageable. And more to the point, outside of all of our control.

What is not outside of control is how often we leave our homes and who we see outside of them.

"I give it until the 3 week lockdown is up (when is that again?) and then I'm done. Going out, visiting family, sitting in the sunshine, if any. I can't live like this"

@smokescreen, I am with you. I can keep it up for a little while longer, and then, in the absence of a firm plan with an end in sight, I am done. It is mostly social pressure which is keeping everyone inside and separated anyway. I can't be the only one feeling this way, and it won't take too long to figure out who else is feeling the same.

As @Packingsoapandwater said, "There really needs to be a plan of how we are going to exit this lockdown, and people need to know soon, because otherwise people are going to start breaking the terms."

Right now, I honestly don't see the point of living due to the situation with Covid19. Life has changed beyond all recognition. It looks to be that a future of social distancing, lack of freedom, regular school closures, no longer school assemblies, limited opportunity to travel, no mass gatherings of any kind, no concerts, no cinema, no theatre. The future looks so fucking bleak I just don't want it. I'd rather be dead than live such a miserable life. Thanks China for this.

Somebody will come along in a minute and say you’ve got no chance of Disney, ever.

And they know this because their son in law is a headteacher and he thinks it’s worse than we are being told.

Why don't they just get the bloody testing sorted? It's really beyond a joke now. Proper people are coming out of the shadows and I wish we had those adults in charge.

I think Raab seems a decent guy. But he can't do it all on his own.

I've listened to a few scientists speaking today on the tv and radio and they were positive that a vaccine will be found.
I had faith for the first time in ages. It won't be overnight but it will happen.
I'm not normally a positive person but I think things will change gradually.

Unless a vaccine or a treatment becomes available en masse, or unless the virus mutates to a point where it's no longer viable (this isn't a good thing by the way, as it would likely mean it's killing hosts before they can spread it), then the way we live is going to have to change.

I don't think it will be like this, but I don't think it will be entirely normal either.

No more crowded shopping centres or festivals, or football games or packed commuter trains.

I imagine most offices will work in shifts, rotating who can come in each week so that we're not working from home permanently.

Non-essential travel and visiting family and friends will be allowed again.

Shops and restaurants will reopen, but the number of people allowed in is likely to be restricted.

Similarly pubs could reopen if the numbers are suitably restricted and people are sat at tables a decent distance from each other with table service only. No more packed bars.

I imagine wearing masks will become compulsory in public.

People will be allowed out to parks to sunbathe and have picnics etc, but no mass gatherings.

Theatres and cinemas may reopen but have gaps in seats. Museums will probably reopen, but with restrictions on numbers and will need to discourage crowding at certain popular exhibits.

People will be allowed to travel for holidays again.

I have no idea how international travel will look after this. I imagine it will pick up again but we might all get a bit more space on planes for a while.

I think we can strike a balance between normal and socially-distanced. It will be fucking weird, but I don't think it's impossible.

What about weddings etc. We have rearranged our wedding until late autumn which was supposed to be this week. Ok, there may be some differences to what we have planned currently if social disancing is still in place but at the moment all churches and registry offices are closed indefinitely. Surely they cant stop people from marrying for the foreseeable future. If I was to die tomorrow, quite frankly my fiance would be f**ked as there is lots of things in my name. So would a lot of people who need to be married to be protected. I cant believe the govt would basically take away the right for people to be married.

Lockhart, I don't understand why the virus mutating until it's no longer viable is a bad thing? Can you explain? Thanks

Lockhart, I don't understand why the virus mutating until it's no longer viable is a bad thing

If a virus is so deadly that it kills its host before said host has the chance to spread, it will no longer be particularly viable as it is difficult to catch.

The80sweregreat because to do that, it would have to kill its host before they had chance to spread it. So basically everyone who did catch it would die, and very quickly after catching it.
Viruses don’t tend to mutate like that though precisely because it would mean the end of the virus. The aim of a virus is to infect as many hosts as possible.

People will have to realise the trade offs between having the virus slowly passing through the population in a manageable way, with deaths sadly and unavoidably, against crashing the economy and causing so many more avoidable deaths. It’s a trade off. But the young must be educated to get out in the world one day and pay off this debt.

To let the virus pass through the population, the vulnerable must be strictly shielded, leaving NHS resources to care for avoidable Covid deaths. This message must be made as strongly as possible, the vulnerable must play their part in helping the economy get back. The rest of the population must come out and work and play, not straight away but gradually over the course of the next 12 months. How to define vulnerable is up to the data collected from the infections and deaths.

@The80sweregreat because, as I said in my post, that would mean it has become so deadly that it kills its host within hours, before the host can spread the virus.

A virus cannot live without a host. It relies on the host to spread it. That's how it reproduces. If it kills us too quickly, it kills its own way of reproducing.

If a virus mutated to that hyper-deadly stage, the virus would die out but not before it took an awful lot of people with it.

As human beings are naturally socially creatures and we NEED to be in close proximity of other human beings for our physical and mental wellbeing. I just do not see how a future of social distancing will be sustainable, I just cannot see it. We've had pandemics in the past and never have they lead to permanent social distancing measures. I'm naturally rather an introvert but the prospect of a future with carefully controlled social distancing measures like those described by "Lockheart" is my absolute worst nightmare and fills me with dread. Honestly the future that Lockheart describes is one that I don't want to be a part of for certain. Is this what others are prepared to accept?

Thank you. Bit tired and didn't read your first post properly.

👇 Blissful1 is talking sense.

Hallelujah. I've been reading some really batshit comments on this site lately , so am grateful for a sensible post. 👍

The general public are quite irrational and unthinking hence we ran out of toilet roll etc and couldn't be trusted to be sensible.

Hence there is no way he is going to come out and say your life will not go back to normal until we have all been offered the vaccine. Think of the civil unrest that truth would cause.

I don't care if I never touch anyone again as long as I don't get this virus.

I don't care if I get this virus (in fact I think I've already had it, in January), as long as I don't have to live like this too much longer.

I heard that we could be living this way ages ago on the news then it appeared to disappear. Same with a daily mail headline today that soon disappeared.
The media tend to play games with us.

@Wannaflyaway I'm not the government, I was just throwing out a few ideas of how it might look.

I don't really see what's so awful about what I've described. In my imaginary world you could still visit family and friends, go out to restaurants, go shopping.

The main difference would be wearing a mask and having to queue to get into a clothes shop. And if you're someone working in the service industry, spending let's say half your time working from home.

I can't speak for everyone, but personally I've never felt the "NEED" to be in close proximity to strangers.

How can you have measures where you have to wear a mask in public and also be able to go to a restaurant?!

I'm absolutely fed up of it all. It's so hard, there's the fear of catching it, or someone you love catching it, and the fear of living like this. I'm furloughed on full pay which is fine, but if this goes on much longer than June I'm sure I'd be made redundant. We had loads of lovely things planned this year and were supposed to go to Vegas on Sunday, summer holidays with the kids, my hen do, and then our wedding in December.

Who knows if any of it will go ahead? And having absolutely nothing at all to look forward to amongst so much fear and uncertainty is soul destroying.

What are you more worried about @Wannaflyaway, the ability to see your friends / family or availability of leisure activities, travel opportunities etc etc?

Is this what others are prepared to accept?

My answer is no. The former is easier to solve than the latter though.