No vaccine please

[Scienceisgreat76]

I have decided not to have the vaccine for coronavirus when it is rolled out. I don’t trust the government and will not be used as a pilot. It seems this will be a rushed vaccine (tested-yes) but we will not know the long term side effects until years down the line. I will politely decline the vaccine until I feel fully informed. Anyone else declining it?

@ChateauMargaux
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2018787/ because flu is a cause of a small proportion of cases

www.bmj.com/content/368/bmj.m810/rr-0 this is a letter. An opinion. Not peer reviewed.

www.narcolepsy.org.uk/resources/pandemrix-narcolepsy again, not a scientific paper. 6 million were vaccinated against a potentially fatal illness. I have seen some evidence based reports on this but this is not one. By which I mean unbiased and peer reviewed.

Doesn't change the fact that we are talking about a global pandemic. Unprecedented. A percentage of those who catch it will die. I have never seen a vaccine that could do that. I genuinely do not understand the reticence. We don't even have a vaccine yet!

Chances are children will be last in the long queue for this vaccine so you won't need to worry about it.

Doesn't change the fact that we are talking about a global pandemic. Unprecedented

We've had plenty of pandemics before, the latest was only in 1968 and killed one million worldwide.

Given that WHO say there may be no immunity from catching CV, how would a vaccine work?

Despite 40 years and billions spent, we are no nearer getting an AIDs vaccine and that has killed millions more than CV-19 ever will.

I think its highly premature to be talking about a vaccine as if its a given, perhaps the focus should equally be on treatments?

HIV is classed as a pandemic. which is way more recent.

WHO say they don't know if you are immune once you've had it. If not, all bets are off.

Oops saw aids just mentioned..

They got close to having a vaccine for SARS, so a lot of the work creating the potential COVID vaccine has already been undertaken.

However, the safety testing standard for all vaccines will need to be followed.

The mutation rate of the virus and the length of immunity are also currently unknown. Therefore herd immunity and vaccination may be pie in the sky.

Antivirals may indeed be the way.

It's too early to say for sure but I doubt il have it. I'm up to date on vaccines apart from the flu one, my children have had the lot including flu one. Just wary of the virus type illnesses.

An AIDs vaccine was always going to be problematic simply because it's a disease that destroys a person's immunity. There have been life changing developments in treatments however, meaning that HIV carriers can live a symptom free life, normal life expectancy, have children and so on.

I agree, it's premature to be debating a "rushed" vaccine that's not actually available. I suppose anti vaxxers want to start their weird brainwashing conspiracy theory bullshit nice and early.

most vaccines are for virus type illnesses

So it's not the only pandemic. It's pretty unprecedented in the way it spreads, the speed of spread and the consequences.

HIV is horrendous but it's not difficult for a majority to avoid. Covid is a wholly different thing.

Treatment would be great. We need that and a vaccine. I really don't think it's one or the other.

Interesting thread:

"I’m a virologist & investor... & I’m hearing people say it’s impossible to make covid vaccine because we haven’t been able to make one to any coronaviruses. Not true. We have veterinary vaccines for dog & cow strains. Human one’s not been investment worthy, until now. here’s why..."
mobile.twitter.com/PeterKolchinsky/status/1240498037958545410

Will everyone be expected to have it or just vulnerable people?

Fine. But please don't darken the doors of a hospital when you get it. It should be on your knobhead alone. Not the NHS's

Vaccines do not kill 1% of people who have them. Covid-19 tends to though.

I’ll be jumping for joy the day someone offers me a vaccination and I can see my mum again.

There are 2 options; stay inside forever to protect people or let this virus cull vast swathes of the population in an horrific survival of the fittest scenario.

That’s about the size of it.

There are several countries doing the experiment to see how the second option works out, e.g. Brazil (and possibly soon the USA). Then, if the no immunity scenario turns out to be right, we’ll discover how much of a genetic element there is to whether you get it mild or severe.

Will those who got it mild first time continue to get it mild, so it’s an annoying thing like a cold which people get every now and then? Until you get old, or develop a comorbidity - but then, you have to die of something, don’t you?

Perhaps Covid will thin the herd of all the old, sick and fat people (particularly men), and then the human race will continue with the less susceptible people, but with a lower life expectancy because Covid finishes them off when they’re too old.

Or, we develop a vaccine, and most people have it, because they will have seen what happens to those who don’t.

puzzled that’s about the size of it. I went through this thought process today. Could this send medicine back decades? Centuries?

Will life expectancy lower again? Will covid be like malaria in Africa? We learn
to live with it through a combination of vaccines/extra care?

It is the time for lifestyle medicine to take hold. Prevention, food and nutrition and lifestyle interventions instead of medicalising preventable disease and obesity

I'm no anti vaxxer but it would be a barave politician that allowed an untested (by usual standards) vaccine into the general population and a brave company too.. Its quite likely that any company bring this vacc to market would require indemnity against lawsuits further down the line too.

I think the future for CV will rely on treatments rather than a vaccine, at least for the foreseeable future.

Not c19, but the brother of a friend of mine (mid 60s) caught mumps at a Christmas party, along with two 15 year old boys.

The two boys were very ill but both recovered after having a liver transplant.
Friend's brother was too ill for a transplant. He was transferred from a hospital in Wales to Birmingham but died not long after.

Have the vaccine.

'HIV is horrendous but it's not difficult for a majority to avoid.'

This sort of thing bothers me.

Around the world HIV has resulted in a huge amount of suffering and death. In the UK back in the 80s/90s it was a big problem in some groups of people, again resulting in a lot of death. Then there were all the people infected through blood products.

So depending on who you are/ were and where you live and what your position is in society etc it wasn't/ isn't that 'easy to avoid'.

Why are so many people so locally/ personally focussed? I suppose it's natural but statements like the above are only true for certain groups in certain parts of the world at certain times.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/18/dont-bet-on-vaccine-to-protect-us-from-covid-19-says-world-health-expert?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

Doesn't matter anyway - looks like the memory B cells are having none of this one. Best Case scenario - looks like annual flu style vaccine.

Scienceisgreat76
'Yes true. I guess I can sit back and see how it affects those groups first.'

What an abhorrent thing to say, these 'groups' are peoples mothers/fathers/sisters/brothers/children... Think before you speak, I'm seriously disgusted with such a flippant comment.

I'm surprised by the nastiness on here

I would agree with you if the op had simply said 'I am concerned a vaccine is going to be rushed out, is anyone else?'

But instead the op chose to say they will smugly sit back and see what happens to the guinea pigs who need to get vaccinated first to enable them to leave their homes again, to protect NHS staff etc......

You cannot see why this got peoples backs up?

Given that the WHO said yesterday that a vaccine may not be achievable as antibodies may not give extended immunity, this thread is all a bit ahead of itself.

Personally I can't wait till they achieve a vaccine ,- would love to be able to see elderly relatives again. And know they were protected.abd that I was.

I am somewhat sceptical of the apparent rash of anti- Vaxxers on this thread. Never met any in real life. But pushing the lie that vaccination is more dangerous than the disease itself would be in the interest of foreign powers trying to attack our wellbeing and economy.

Is very interesting that it is not hugely immunogenic despite being quite dangerous! Sneaky!! You may need three doses like for one of the Heps, or it could be annual. Is not hugely mutative - so it could be the same vaccine - just many times.
It will be based on the spike protein (on outside, how virus 'docks to cells for entry') not a live attenuated thankfully.

There are currently 4 main coronaviruses in circulation. This will be the 5th & will become a virus that circulates widely, including in people who have had it before because immunity probably won't last (it doesn't for the others). In most people it won't cause severe disease but in a small minority it will, like the other 4. If there is a vaccine I would have it, but I suspect inducing look lasting immunity may be difficult.