Daughter 24 wants to come home

[AinJD]

DD loves London but is working from her little room in a shared house currently as office is closed - life so different from normal and says she just wants to come home (to North Yorkshire) where she can have more space and will feel somehow safer with family. DH reluctantly (is it essential?) said he’ll fetch her tomorrow if she’s sure she wants to be here till the end of the lockdown. He will go there and back, no interactions with anyone but her. We all feel guilty already at going against the spirit of the guidance, but she’s taken care to walk everywhere for the past two weeks, is not ill and will self-isolate in her room here for seven days on arrival. It is probably not essential but feels natural for her to want to be here with us and of course we don’t really in our hearts want to say no. We almost wish there was a form to fill in for this mission!

It must be to do with whether you're a parent or not. I'm not and I think London people should not be spreading their viruses around

I am with two young adult DDs in London who I want to hug. But I can't. They know that. I know that.

We have always been in contact a lot but that's been ramped up in this difficult time. We are in constant contact because I am worrying endlessly about them.

@Gwenhwyfar no, it's not to do with being a parent. I have children and I think the op is being astonishingly selfish, callous and wrong.

@RedGirl99
Honestly, I don't think you needed to come here to ask for this advice - do what you need to do for your family and take every precaution necessary but be prepared for potential consequences.

But the potential consequences might not affect OP and her family but some other poor person who dies of coronavirus. That is the whole point of not making unnecessary journeys.

@Gwenhwyfar I don't think it's entirely parent versus non parent, more a reflection of how selfish people can be and think the rules are for everyone else.
People I love are on the frontline of this. I don't think it's too much to ask the citizens to do their bit.

Go get your girl

There is a huge amount of difference between a family relocating to their second home, and a singleton coming home in circumstances where she can self isolate for 7-14 days.
The first case is clearly unnecessary travel. The second one is not so clear. By having her move back to the family home, you are then eliminating all the journeys out in London that she will make to shop etc, as mum will then shop for the whole family. So we have just exchanged one journey from London to Yorkshire in car, for daily journeys out in London to shop (and in London they do need to be almost daily, there is not enough food in the shops for less frequently). In addition, if the singleton does get sick, she is going to be the one going out anyway, as it is not as though there is anyone to share the job with, so far more likely to infect more Londoners, and put more pressure on the NHS in London. And if she does get sick, she is more likely to end up in hospital, sooner, or at all in London, as there is nobody at home to nurse her. Home care is keeping a lot of people out of hospital. If she has a flatmate that functions like a family, that is one thing, but if she doesn't, and they are both shopping for themselves, looking out for themselves, as singletons generally do, then the balance of risk is not as clear as people on this list want to make out. People who move to a second home, one of them goes out to shop etc and spreads it. A singleton who self isolates, and her mum shops and leaves food outside her door, is far less likely to spread it in North Yorkshire than she is in London, where she does not have that service, thus putting more pressure on the NHS in London. They are two completely different cases, and the balance of risk is different.

I am a parent - ds3 is 21. We got him home from University before the lockdown came into force. If we hadn’t, and he was asking us to get him now, we would refuse. Our two older dses have t asked to come home, but if they did, the answer would be No.

I do understand parents wanting their children - even adult children - safe at home, but I think it is wrong to play roulette with the lives of your neighbours and your local NHS staff.

And yes, I do know that sounds very dramatic, but the virus doesn’t move, people move the virus. @AinJD‘s dd could bring the virus to North Yorkshire, and set it going in the population there. It is irresponsible and selfish to take that risk, when it is not absolutely vital.

People can berate for you for being 'disgusting' or 'selfish' etc., but probably didn't think twice about packing out the supermarkets to fight over loo roll a couple of weeks ago hmm

I was one of the first on this thread to oppose the collection of OPs daughter, but I can say with sincerity that I haven't behaved irresponsibly or stockpiled groceries at any point during this emergency - it doesn't really make sense that those who are trying to uphold the spirit of the lockdown would be the same people brawling over loo rolls, but nice try.

I'm not a parent and my opinion stands.

I've always found MN strange because apparently everyone's opinion other than their own is 'shameful' or 'disgusting'. It's not. It's an opinion. I don't agree with many of the posts on this thread (and on Mumsnet as a whole) but most of them aren't 'shameful' or 'disgusting'.

I was in the situation we went to get her go do the same

So why did Boris say don’t mix households? There is still the risk of bringing the disease to an area that doesn’t have it. Putting strain on the NHS system in the area where OP lives. Extra food needed. There is hardly any food where I live and we are hundreds of miles away from London and one small hospital. If all adult children moved back here we would be in serious trouble.

I agree that 'shameful' and 'disgusting' are thrown around too liberally at times - but when your choices put the lives of others at risk those terms become objectively true.

A singleton who self isolates, and her mum shops and leaves food outside her door, is far less likely to spread it in North Yorkshire than she is in London, where she does not have that service, thus putting more pressure on the NHS in London.

The daughter could spread it to her dad in the car, who spreads it to the shopkeeper, who spreads it to everyone in Yorkshire. And how many ventilators does North Yorkshire even have?

There is a huge amount of difference between a family relocating to their second home, and a singleton coming home in circumstances where she can self isolate for 7-14 days. The first case is clearly unnecessary travel. The second one is not so clear.

Given the government's recent instructions that students (even domestic students) who are still in term time accommodation must remain there rather than traveling home, I think the situation is actually perfectly clear. This is clearly an analogous situation.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.standard.co.uk/news/education/stay-where-you-are-university-students-living-in-halls-are-told-a4399421.html%3famp

"@Gwenhwyfar I don't think it's entirely parent versus non parent, more a reflection of how selfish people can be and think the rules are for everyone else."

I just thought I would get it out there that I'm not a parent before people throw the 'you don't understand at me', but I am pretty shocked at the reactions on here and that may be because I don't have such a bond that would make me break the law and my own moral code.

Do none of you listen to the rules? It's not one rule for everyone else except you - and poor DD all alone etc. I'm a parent, but however upset we are in the current situation, they are saying NO non-essential travel - and certainly not 100s of miles to London and back! If everybody in the country did this we might as well ignore the restrictions! STAY IN!

A similar thread yesterday was about going to a holiday cottage and everyone was up in arms - but the risk here is the same. No-one should leave their local GP practice area. What if DH needs petrol or supplies on the journey? What if he breaks down? What if DD comes home and is ill and clogs up your local hospital? FFS......

I hope you can now see that's not the case.

All those saying to go and get her, no question - do you think we should all leave London if we can?

I've always found MN strange because apparently everyone's opinion other than their own is 'shameful' or 'disgusting'. It's not. It's an opinion. I don't agree with many of the posts on this thread (and on Mumsnet as a whole) but most of them aren't 'shameful' or 'disgusting'.

Indeed. Lots of dehumanising abuse dressed up as morality and The Right Thing To Do. I'm fascinated in a horrified way at how this situation has allowed so many have given themselves permission to contemptuously abuse people on the internet for not thinking exactly the way they do. MN is by far the worst place I have seen for it...apart from the DM that is.

Totally agree Ygritte

@Camopetals that's great that you didn't, however the vast majority of the population were behaving like absolute fools up until as recently as last weekend - many I know of personally, who now have too much time on their hands and think because they have behaved themselves for 4 days that they can sit on social media giving it out left, right and centre on matters such as this.

I'm fairly certain that not every single person throwing about the 'disgusting' label on this thread can say that with the same sincerity as you unfortunately - the empty shelves speak for themselves.

I think all areas of the country have many more cases than they realise, and if OP and her whole family isolate after fetching her DD then they won't be threatening any containment efforts. I can't see how walking from the car to the front door will put too many at risk.

All those saying to go and get her, no question - do you think we should all leave London if we can?

Yes, would be interested to know this because I am in London. Are we regarded as a leper colony...genuinely wondering?

@AinJD

I suspect that you've already made up your mind but but I would also say that she should stay put.

I think you know, if you're being honest with yourself, that the only way to guarantee that your daughter won't bring the virus with her is to leave her where she is.

Even if you were all to self isolate, there is still the possibility that one or more of you may become ill enough to require hospital treatment, during the course of which you could expose medical workers, their families, other patients and anyone they come into contact with, to the virus.

I know it's difficult and in times like these we instinctively look to our loved ones for comfort. However hard being apart will be tough, it's still the right thing.

This is your family's opportunity to (potentially) save lives. Please stay home and tell your daughter to do the same.

Apologies for the typos.

My DD is a student in a shared house with 2 international students. She is about an hour away on the train and is staying put for now. I wish she had come home before lockdown but she wanted to get essays written.
If she comes home now she would have to risk public transport then spend 7 days at least in her bedroom. DH is at risk.
These are difficult times and there are no easy choices.

@Gwenhwyfar maybe you're just a person with a strong moral code but yes I can see why you put it out there.

I guess the parents of frontline workers might think differently to the OP.
Plenty of parents making huge sacrifices themselves going out to work in awfully difficult circumstances and I feel we collectively owe it to them to be a bit less selfish and not look for exceptions to pretty clear rules about unnecessary journeys.