Worries about the Coronavirus 29

[gnomeisland]

Last thread about to finish.
(Long time Lurker)

Info about flu jab at risk groups from someone who has knowledge of NHS & vaccines (OP is happy to share this post)
www.facebook.com/groups/leedsface/permalink/3063007833759843/

Hi all, I'm a school governor and we had a meeting tonight where we discussed covid-19. I realise many employers don't understand what the "flu at risk" groups that Dr Chris Whitty referred to are or how many of their staff may be unable to attend work.
This is my email to the school explaining my thoughts. Please note, this is my own original work based on my career in the NHS and the vaccine industry. There may be people who disagree or vary a little in their understanding of exactly who the government are asking to stay home and avoid social contact for 3 months. Feel free to share this post. If we get further clarification from Public Health I'll update it.

Hi all,
I thought it might help if I sent the list of high risk people for covid-19. The chief medical officer said:

over 70's, (some media are reporting over 65's but I've re-played the press conference and he says 70+)
high risk groups (eg the flu at risk groups)
pregnant women.

I have attached 2 screen shots. One covers the "flu at risk groups" - these are well known in the NHS as a description of people who have underlying health conditions and so are at higher risk of complications from flu (and also therefore corona viruses)
There are grey areas in the "at risk" groups, which I spent many hours of my life discussing during my career as a vaccine specialist! The important point is that staff who are in these groups already know they are. If you have a staff member with asthma who is on inhalers but who does NOT have a flu vaccine each year then they probably are not in a high risk group. Some asthmatics are slightly immunosuppressed due to being on high dose steroids.
High dose steroids cause immunosuppression - those staff members will have been instructed to carry a "steroid card" by their GP/pharmacist. Steroid cards may be issued to staff with bowel conditions or arthritis as well, plus other conditions. If a member of staff can produce a steroid card and states they usually have a free flu vaccine each year then they will be in the "isolate for 3 months" category.
The other screen shot is from a 70,000+ patient study in Wuhan. It shows the at risk groups who are at higher risk of dying from covid-19. You will notice that hypertension (high blood pressure) is on this list but it is NOT listed in any of the government categories for staying at home for 4 months. It may be that the NHS will issue further guidance about this group.
From a staff well being perspective it may be worth mentioning to smokers that they are more likely to suffer complications from covid-19. They should stop smoking as the death rate appears to be significantly higher in smokers. This is reflected in the Chinese data showing the death rate in men is much higher than in women. Smoking is far more prevalent among men in China. Smokers are not in a UK high risk group and should not stay at home for 3 months!

I’m assuming that schools will close in the UK soon and then eventually we’ll be in “lockdown” like other European countries to halt the spread.
Does anyone have have an ideas/would like to speculate how long we’ve got until “lockdown”?

Just about to leave to go into school. I am expecting fewer children in today. I hope we close soon but then I had the most awful thought, when this is over and we go back, will we and all my lovely parents all be there? 😢
It is a sobering thought.

People not going on my WhatsApp.
Throw a few teachers in and school is empty.

Imperial college graph that changed the government strategy.

We still run out if Intensive Care in July.

@MurrayTheMonk your posts have really concerned me your poor residents and you can’t do this all by yourself or just with a skeleton staff. Is the home part of a group / who is the owner? Can you put a crisis call out to them? Is there the possibility of agency staff?

As another suggestion what about the CQC? I have read they are suspending all inspections and redeploying as front line staff where possible - could you contact them?

@MurrayTheMonk if my family were being cared for by you and I was in a position to help, I would. Can you put a call out to any family you know? Even if they can just do the shopping for you and not have contact with the residents. Sorry, I'm not sure what type of home you are - my grandma is in assisted living and we would do that for them if/when needed.

Has anyone seen this? It's less draconian than the other lists I've seen.

www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/specific-groups/high-risk-complications.html

Also, can we ask for thread title to be changed in line with previous ones? It was hard to find you today!

CQC were less than useless last night.
We are a county wide not for profit organisation . Senior managers awake now and trying to help. (Tax too late really-again we could have seen this coming-had a meeting on Friday where I raised this exact scenario and was told to 'hope it didn't happen' But that said, to be fair no one has a magic hat they can produce trained care staff out of do they?).

No agency to be had, either self isolating or booked elsewhere as obvs staff off all over the shop care wise. And there weren't enough anyway even before this

Valencia confirm 'around 35%' of squad has coronavirus after Champions League trip to Atalanta
t.co/2bgFYEPXnb

@MurrayTheMonk that’s awful that the CQC are so useless. Who is the “responsible person” at group level? They really need to be lobbying the CQC hard and documenting everything. They will have blood on their hands if they continue to be “less than useless”. They’ve got to be doing something with their vast resource and expertise.

The suggestion re residents families is a good one. I know you are stuck between a rock and a hard place not wanting to bring unnecessary people into the building but at some point people are either going to suffer/die from unintentional neglect or contract the virus.

I wish I could help in some way.

Morning all. I'm in the surreal/waiting for the tsunami to hit camp.

CQC don't often sink in more than advise or inspect to be fair.
It's the local authority that have the ultimate responsibility and so far I've seen no planning from them... hopefully they will kick into gear this morning.
The only plan PHE have to reference is that for normal flu in a care home which would be fine except of course it relies on the rest of society functioning normally which it currently isn't in terms of health and social care/staffing/ppe and food delivery.

Will some of your usual workers come in, if they are well and feel that the gentleman with the cough is unlikely to have CV?

it is really weird.
weather is so nice, 'nature waking up' time.
here all restaurants are closed, but most have switched to home deliveries.

I feel like my brain just keeps exploding with shock at every new turn. And yet if I look away things have got so much worse the shock is even bigger. And without MN there are so many important things I would miss that are helping.

Valencia confirm 'around 35%' of squad has coronavirus after Champions League trip to Atalanta

Athletico Madrid game in Liverpool went ahead as planned last week.

Hospitals in Madrid are struggling and turning people 'not sick enough' away.

Liverpool might have an issue in a couple of weeks.

Two of the 19 have agreed to come in and god bless them are staying til 9 tonight.
I need at least four per shift to make it even vaguely safe. Plus throw in the extra cleaning that needs doing and it's impossible.

The rest of the staff dare either self isolating or ignoring all calls.
Good will only goes so far when you can only pay people £8.47 an hour

Not surprised about the Valencia team. We watched the match incredulously last week.
@RedToothBrush, your post about waiting for the Tsunami...I want to thank you, and ofwarren and numerous others for informing us over the past weeks.

It's horrifying that most of Mumsnet is now realising they've been lied to and are being used as a bumbling scientific experiment. There's no gratification in seeing the seachange of threads, which has gone from "stop with the scaremongering " to "I'm scared"
I don't think anyone who has been on these threads for a while ever wanted to be right.

How the fuck did they not manage to predict it until now? I did better modelling ON MY PHONE while looking after my kids... And I'm just a bog standard science teacher, not an epidemiologist....
I'm so glad I stocked up on food and medicine and shoes and toothbrushes etc BACK IN EARLY FEBRUARY. While everyone laughed it me.....

@MurrayTheMonk can you pay those doing extra hours a premium as the pay budget should be under from all those off? It’s so tough.

Oh yes I will do. But none of them want t risk their health or their families. Carers are nearly always women and they been Nearly always have family to care for as well. That's the rub-Hardly anyone will our work before family.

That’s understandable to an extent, but exposes the fragility of the system. Fuming at the ‘irony’ of care workers being classed as ‘unskilled’ when it comes to immigration etc but look what happens in a crisis. They’re needed more than ever.

I don't think anyone who has been on these threads for a while ever wanted to be right

This is so true. I have been on them from the beginning. Not posted a huge amount but read them all. I couldn’t confide in anyone in RL for fear of being labelled paranoid and over the top. I truly wish that we had all been wrong, and would far rather be reading threads right now laughing at us all than the reality. All I feel now is very very sad.

Yes, I’ve been on the threads since the first few and we were definitely in the exception to start with. Now the boards are full of CV19 topics (although I’ll confess this remains my first port of call so I hope we keep it going despite the other conversations). Such a useful and valuable source of information and support.