worried about coronavirus (covid19) part 21

[usernameishistory]

Next thread

previous thread here

Symptoms:
Common signs of infection include respiratory symptoms, fever, cough, shortness of breath and breathing difficulties. In more severe cases, infection can cause pneumonia, severe acute respiratory syndrome, kidney failure and even death.

MERS came from camels, SARS from civet cats.

(Extracts from WHO)

Helpful links

The new PHE dashboard for monitoring covid-19 latest published UK figures
www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/f94c3c90da5b4e9f9a0b19484dd4bb14

updated data on this page every day at 2pm until further notice.
www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-number-of-cases-in-england/coronavirus-covid-19-number-of-cases-in-england
Numbers for Wales (unknown update time)
phw.nhs.wales/topics/latest-information-on-novel-coronavirus-covid-19/

Look after yourself, help with managing your mental well-being, including for self-isolation here.
www.mind.org.uk/information-support/coronavirus-and-your-wellbeing/

WHO media speech for world plan of action

updated data on this page every day at 2pm until further notice.
www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-number-of-cases-in-england/coronavirus-covid-19-number-of-cases-in-england

WHO advice for the public
www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public

Its not just like flu www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/01/yes-it-is-worse-than-the-flu-busting-the-coronavirus-myths

Why WHO not declaring a pandemic www.newscientist.com/article/2235342-covid-19-why-wont-the-who-officially-declare-a-coronavirus-pandemic/

Worldometer www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

BNO News bnonews.com/index.php/2020/02/the-latest-coronavirus-cases/

Link to WHO report www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019

The Lancet coronavirus hub - latest research and comment www.thelancet.com/coronavirus. Please provide updated link if possible, I haven't been able to make this one work.

JAMA coronavirus research centre jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/pages/coronavirus-alert

For research on CV and babies:
jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2761659

Please add in other links for any wanting to increase their understanding and decrease their anxiety!

       <strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong>**

Round up of one-liners gathered from the wisdoms across the threads, with links...

Work is progressing on vaccine, take 1yr -18 mths for safe use.
First human trials of vaccine started
www.livescience.com/us-coronavirus-vaccine-trial-recruiting.html

Advice for anxiety
www.cci.health.wa.gov.au/Resources/Looking-After-Yourself/Anxiety

WHO advice to the public
www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/advice-for-public

Specialist asthma sufferers advice here:
www.asthma.org.uk/about/media/news/Coronavirus/

In the coming days, guidance for healthcare professionals on Coronavirus (COVID-19) infection in pregnancy will be published by the RCOG, Royal College of Midwives, Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health, Public Health England and Health Protection Scotland
....
www.rcog.org.uk/coronavirus-pregnancy

A plea,

• to remember to help food banks stay stocked up
• to give older, or maybe lone, neighbours your phone number with offers to help with shopping and medicine collections

Life expectancy of virus on surfaces
www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0195670120300463#

sodium hypochlorite drum to kill virus

The stance on profiteering from CV
www.gov.uk/government/news/cma-statement-on-sales-and-pricing-practices-during-coronavirus-outbreak

A survivors story - only ONE story remember!
www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-asia-51714162/how-i-recovered-from-coronavirus-and-isolation

Irreversible lung damage? Aids/sars effects
amp.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/chinese-doctors-say-coronavirus-like-a-combination-of-sars-and-aids-can-cause-irreversible-lung-damage/news-story/f58f19c5eeae99b845c54e2d2b9305ca?__twitter_impression=true

The efficacy, or otherwise of sanitisers
www.bics.org.uk/coronavirus-dr-andrew-kemp-jp-phd-reports/

Sign the petition for action against CV19
petition.parliament.uk/petitions/300403

Travelling, making other decisions around
exposure
read up, noone can decide for you, but be aware...
Your mode of transport (train/boat/plane) is unlikely to be disinfected.
You may not be welcome back at work (forced isolation unpaid because you decided to take risk)
Getting stuck in quarantine in another country, subjected to their health service and govt restrictions on you.
What happens with your dc and school upon return.
Holiday insurance cover?

Positive ways of coping

Exercise daily, out where you won't be in close proximity (greater than 2 metres)

Eat well, healthy foods, plenty of liquid

Include natural antivirals in diet and good levels of daily vit c, vit d

Rest

Take steps to address any raised anxiety, above what might be reasonable and normal steps for keeping viral hygiene under control.
Its normal to feel more anxious, and normal to take steps to manage situation by being well prepared.

Isolation Issues

Getting sufficient shopping in on low incomes, and/or vulnerable / already isolated

Keeping on top of KEY METERS - need to top up yet in isolation - what measures are there to help

Paying mortgage/rent (private & housing associations) if not receiving sick pay

Legislation that enforced isolation = sick (for sick pay purposes)

       <strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong>**,

Primary mode of transmission is airborne droplets.

Sneeze or cough into elbow (or tissue and bin it). Droplets can travel 2m.

Secondary means of transmission touch.

Hand wash to
Break the transmission cycle from hand to mouth, eyes, nose, or to others, by 20 seconds plus thorough hand washing (soap and water).

Alcohol breaks down the outer layer of virus to effectively kill, other methods may not.
(Anti bacterial does NOT do this and overuse may risk bacterial resistance).

Use 70% vol alcohol to any other additive

         <strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong><strong>*</strong>*

Huge thanks to all contributors; for updates and trying to keep to trusted sources of information.

The community here has been supportive and respectful despite worries, and that can make a huge difference in unknown times.

thoughts go to all those affected, in whatever way.

I agree the PHE, CMO and govt are doing the best they can at the speed they can do it with tests. I also think they are basing decisions on expert information.

I’m in London a lockdown doesn’t make me want to do anything differently, I’ll still stay although it is silly and irresponsible for people on Twitter to just guess what’s next.

SubjectMatterExpert Wed 11-Mar-20 14:23:28

"If your normal temperature was 34-35, and it’s crept to 37 over 3 days, would you be worried? So still in normal range, but relatively high. With mild flu symptoms?"

37 IS normal body temp. If you are normally 34-35 your thermometer is seriously due an upgrade

The government plans are to protect the vulnerable and keep them in the 20% who don’t get it, I think.

There’s no evidence immunity only lasts a few weeks BTW

Please watch this from a doctor in Wuhan

twitter.com/BBCWorld/status/1233346403612659712

@suspended I felt like death for 3-4 days with flu and would say I was “over the worst” but I couldn’t stop sleeping and had a strained rib muscle that was causing stabbing pain for many days after. Could be similar with CV with feeling tired after!

You don’t agree they are planning to create herd immunity atomic rabbit? I don’t know, just reading between the lines of what has been said. I have heard it mentioned that a vaccine against a Coronavirus is very difficult to make. So a vaccine may be a long way off. Waiting for a vaccine may not be much of a plan either

Herd immunity only exists if enough catch and recover from the virus, it imparts some immunity in recovered people. This is the plan, enough people need to contract the virus, in all areas of the country for this to happen.
It is ultimately to protect people who would be killed or seriously disabled by it, largely by creating a big enough firebreak of recovered people that the virus dies down.
Without a vaccine, in the absence of imprisoning the entire population, it is the only way. This is what is being played out right now.

This interview is fascinating, and informative

"Michael Osterholm is an internationally recognized expert in infectious disease epidemiology. He is Regents Professor, McKnight Presidential Endowed Chair in Public Health, the director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy (CIDRAP), Distinguished Teaching Professor in the Division of Environmental Health Sciences, School of Public Health, a professor in the Technological Leadership Institute, College of Science and Engineering, and an adjunct professor in the Medical School, all at the University of Minnesota. Look for his book "Deadliest Enemy: Our War Against Deadly Germs"

AtomicRabbit The epidemiologists will be using statistical tools on the test sampl results

Anyone who LIES in a test is reducing the quality of information on which public health officials make decisions

That is a completely separate issue to whether there should be more testing

• which is probably a matter of building up resources:

trained people, test kits, labs etc

Bear in mind also that RNA viruses can mutate either way. So get weaker as well as stronger.

I’ve been at uni all day so missed most of what’s gone on and just catching up now on the train - but I am soooo pissed off with how our university are handling it. We have the returnee from Italy openly bragging about how her holiday was in lectures and out on placement - university still insisting no one on campus has recently returned from Italy... then we have our placement coordinator chirpily telling us she’s really happy to be sending us out into schools and care homes (schools - more OK than bloody care homes full of very frail elderly people) and that she doesn’t quite understand how the figures are getting bigger and bigger (turns out she doesn’t understand exponential growth). Chirpily going on about how it’s only the vulnerable need to worry - with the eternal assumption that it’s only 18 year olds on the course and not mature students with kids and ageing parents.

Serious-fucking-ly. It’s going to take the government laying down it fully to get uni to listen and close early because they really do not give a shit.

I have a headache and cough - I’m not worried - the headache is because I always get one as the heating in the building I was in sets me off and the cough I’ve had from the last chest infection I had way before Christmas (I get one and the cough takes up residence till about mid-Spring) - but if we get told to isolate at the sign of a cough - I’m outta there as I do not trust our uni to put health and safety first.

You can re-catch it too. Your immunity to any coronavirus only lasts a few weeks at most. It's a joke to suggest herd immunity. You're consigning thousands of people to death.

This sort of speculation is unhelpful. We don't know how long (or how complete) CV immunity is after infection. There is no evidence in China of widespread reinfection and there were questions over whether apparent reinfections were in fact testing issues or some other anomaly.

I’m less bothered about the number of cases (they were always going to go up) if there are heaps wandering around infected but unaware then this could be interpreted as it’s a milder and less impactful disease than first thought

It would be good to think so - at least for those who do have it mildly. Less good for the vulnerable ones they infect.

You can re-catch it too. Your immunity to any coronavirus only lasts a few weeks at most. It's a joke to suggest herd immunity. You're consigning thousands of people to death

Where is the evidence that this would be any different from any other cold-type virus - you get it and you don't get it again (though you may well get a mutated type). This isn't flu.

However, weeks ago I read an article by a UK scientist who was already working on a vaccine in the US, and she thought they were quite close back then. Of course it has to be tested and authorised so even if they think they have a solution now, it will take along time to come to market.

I don’t understand your argument atomicrabbit? We know this virus is more deadly than flu. What’s your alternative suggestion here?

If UAE are closing schools until summer term we should impose flight restrictions on them because I would imagine they will start coming here for holidays earlier than the summer months.

Ever been to Harrods in the summer?

And no, I don't believe this govenment would set out to kill off the age group that votes about 70-80% for them

Seems thermometers are also hard to come by. All are sold out at Argos, has anyone seen any?

The number of deaths that they seem to be preparing us for is 100000, so if the 1% CFR is accurate then they only expect 20% of us to catch it...I think.

They’re choosing what they think will be the most effective method to protect people overall. They have to do that really.

The problem is testing does need to be restricted at this stage. I can think of a dozen people at least who currently have symptoms of coronavirus (including myself - currently in the dressing gown of doom, aching, temperature and out of breath). I'm sure most posters on this thread can, too.

I'm quite sure that a huge proportion of them (including me) have nothing more than the usual virus/infection/general lergy.

We will always be limited to the number of tests we can do. I am sure they are able to estimate how many in addition to those tested may or may not have it and this will inform policy accordingly.

TO be fair though the Government themselves have no more of a clue really as to what to do than we do. They have no training for this - they are taking the lead from train scientists who unlike politicians I suspect dont feel the need to justify decisions.

Its so hard because this is a completely new situation in this century with all the technologies it brings. There will be a certain amount of missteps by different governments because no one knows the best way. Italy was the changing point I think that took it from something that could be contained to something that cant be and now we just had to go through the 3 phases of pandemics and hope for the best

You can re-catch it too. Your immunity to any coronavirus only lasts a few weeks at most. It's a joke to suggest herd immunity. You're consigning thousands of people to death

Where is the source for this. There were a couple of cases of this but I havent heard anything for awhile

@spencer I just bought a thermometer on Amazon. Ordered yesterday, arrived today :)

There is no hard evidence that someone can catch the same version of COVID-19 again

However, I don't know if they could catch another variant
e.g. have immunity to S but not L

This is what worries me about a vaccine:

Could it tackle all the variants, or only work for some, like a flu vaccine ?

Would we need a new COVID vaccine every year, if it cannot be wiped out and mutates ?

@AtomicRabbit

Well, since you know such much more than the people who have been trained for this and are advising the government, perhaps you should go and have a word with them?

Alternatively. ODFOD

My son has a virus and I was adviseEd by 111 to get him checked at our local a and e. The doctor said it was a typical child’s winter virus and not CV and to return if he worsens. I told work what was going on and I have been asked to self isolate at work by having minimum contact with colleagues and staying in my office, also cannot attend HO training day.
Is this a proportional response? We have a lot of people coming in and out of our building so seems a bit OTT. I have not been in contact with anyone affected.