To be worried about Coronavirus - Part 8

[KenAdams]

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Chardonnay don’t get worked up over the wild animals bans. They will make a law and no one will adhere to it. Animals are very divisive and easily distract people’s attention. Worrying about wild animals in China is like worrying about the rain, pointless.

I do worry about the wild animals and the dogs, but it's not just that. That's how epidemics start, and they should have learned their lesson with SARS.

Also, the Chinese government seems to have its ways of persuading people to adhere to bans.

DD has a school trip to mainland Europe at the end of June. We have nearly paid the monthly instalments for her to go but as she herself was saying, it's quite possible the trip will be cancelled, don't you think?

I don't think schools will close/school trips will be cancelled unless PHE instructs them to do so.

It's up to us to make the decisions to protect our kids based on the information we have. The Government is not going to shut schools unless all the staff are sick and they have no one to teach.

I’ve been reading these threads for a while now, really helpful.
I’ve been wondering though, the total number of cases in UK keeps including those who have recovered and this makes it sound as if there’s more active cases than there are. I’ve also wondered why haven’t any of the survivors in the UK haven’t been in the news, I would have thought some of the tabloids would have gone looking for them and their stories.

@Bercows I wouldn’t if I were you.

I was in outer London yesterday and it was heaving still. Lots of people trying to get hand gel. I bought mine last week.

Looking on Twitter and FB there is just so much shit about so many basic scienctific facts. That people are getting phenomena from mucus dripping into lungs etc.

I dont believe in nanny state but imo there needs to be more honest, high level facts published by phe about this. People still think it's the flu and can not get there heads around why schools are closing in China. Like China are overactive. It's even making me doubt myself.

We will see a big change come next weekend. I'm ready as I can be but I get the impression that 80% of people will be fighting in the shops on the day if things start getting locked down.

People have lost the ability to think critically for themselves or research facts.

I was out shopping yesterday in a busy local high street environment (usually annoyingly so on a Saturday). Some of the shops (Poundland and TKMaxx) were virtually deserted - most unusual.

Same experience. I am a High Street early shopper two weeks in four. It was wet yestgerday but had a post-New Year sale feel with only a few people about.

I was just thinking that this might be the final nail in the coffin for some travel firms/airlines which have already been struggling.

Totally agree about the communication of it @meredithgrey1. Currently the retired doctors thing is pretty much all they have disclosed!

Requesting that people in the very worst affected age brackets position themselves directly in harms way is a HUGE ask. It's all very well people saying, 'oh, they can all deal with non CV regular patients' but the reality is that all medical environments will likely end up touched by the virus.

As you say, perhaps it would seem a more reasonable measure had it been announced as part of a wide and proactive range of measures to limit spread, rather than it appearing that retired medical staff are deemed sacrificial collateral damage.

The school at the centre of the Swansea case has been named as Bishops Gore Comp. Theyre not closing and haven't been cleaned over the weekend 🤷🏻‍♀️

I believe there is already legislation in place that could permit mass lock down in the UK.its been around for some time.
In terms of hospitals being full, if we get to a full triage system, there will be a number of patients who won’t get treatment anymore however unpalatable that is. There are a lot of people in hospital who basically need social care - these may be sent to new centres with non qualified staff, who knows?
Harder uestions are around non CV illness - do you still treat appendicitis, give chemo, deal with very prem babies who take up months of one to one time? I don’t know, I had 3 prem babies and am aware of how much nursing time they took maybe they have to decrease staff ratios for this sort of thing. What about severe heart attacks?
I can see under triage that non cv conditions that would normally get treated will not be treated. I am thankful it’s not me who is going to have t make those decisions.

Lots of retired medical staff may no longer be registered to practice though.

I think this is a big part of what people are struggling to understand Tunbridge. It’s NOT just about the virus, but the knock- ons to the NHS that almost all of us rely on.

I believe the bed hogging might be down to wrangling over finances for the elderly?
so perhaps they can be fast tracked with promise of later payment?

@NewModelArmyMayhem18 I hope all school trips will be cancelled. Both of mine have one in July.
Worst still dd has theatre trip on Thursday to London and dh and I have concert in a1500 venue.

eat well, up your vitamin c

This is so sad (from The Guardian)

The condition of Nazanin Zaghari-Ratcliffe, the British-Iranian woman detained in Iran, is getting “worse and worse” but the Iranian authorities are still refusing to test her for coronavirus, her family has said.

Speaking to BBC Radio 5 Live, Richard said his wife’s guards were “keeping away” from her in case she has caught the disease. He said her “cold like symptoms that have got worse and worse and they’re not going away.”

He said: “I’m sure the prison is not testing partly because there’s not many testing kits and partly because they don’t want to know”.

I believe the private sector will also be called in to accommodate

Any suggestions for general immunity boosting recipes

Not a recipe but I have been adding raw garlic to everything.

The key is to crush the clove(s) (I aim for around 4 a day) about 10mins before you wish to eat it to maximise its allicin content.

It's a natural anti viral amongst other things.

I spread it on toast, add to dips, tuna/egg mayo or stir through something like a spag bol just before I serve up.

I don’t know if this is common knowledge but has sort of freaked me out a bit, I know of a paramedic who has been fitted for a face mask and protective suit and have found out a dr at a local hosp mentioned she was being fitted for a face mask tomorrow. Whether they know something we don’t or not, they are preparing for more cases 100% and I am in the north of Scotland where we have no cases yet

My dc never appreciate me protecting them as it is. It's one of the worst things about being a single parent as there's no one to back up my decisions.

City centre was heaving as usual yesterday - as was Morrissons. TK maxx full as well. Payday weekend seemed normal.

I’m loving the idea of bigger classes. I don’t have enough physical space for even one more child - it will be babysitting not education.
I also liked the, close the schools now instead of summer idea. Not sure who will pay for everyone’s pre booked holidays- teachers and children. If we have to close then we can’t just be told to make the time up.
Also I cannot see me teaching primary children remotely- their parents won’t be enforcing it at my school

In the Royal College of Physicians conference video which we had on an early thread (the CMO being the last speaker in a 2+ hour session) one of the points made by a speaker was that pandemic planning had mistakenly been done on the assumption that any pandemic would necessarily be of influenza, rather than any other virus type. It’s interesting to see how the assumptions in the 2011 preparedness strategy fail to match the reality of a novel coronavirus pandemic:

Responding to an influenza pandemic

The UK will continue to maintain stockpiles and distribution arrangements for antiviral medicines and antibiotics sufficient for a widespread and severe pandemic. (There are - can be - no stocks of antivirals targeted at this virus).

Health services should continue to prepare for up to 30% of symptomatic patients requiring assessment and treatment in usual pathways of primary care, assuming the majority of symptomatic cases do not require direct assistance from healthcare professionals. (In the present situation usual pathways of primary care can’t safely be used, hence an unplanned need for hospital assessment pods, & drive-by testing).

Between 1% and 4% of symptomatic patients will require hospital care, depending on how severe the illness caused by the virus is. There is likely to be increased demand for intensive care services. (These assumptions based on the impact of flu do not appear to provide adequate planning for a novel coronavirus - or at least this one).

@Sassenach85 sounds very sensible - everyone needs to beprepared. I spoke to a paramedic this week and they have a full on CV protocol for their ambulances and already have the suits and masks etc.

I'm really worried about the potential effect on HCP, and I'm very grateful for the jobs they do. Just today, a doctor in China has died from overwork and another from Covid19. When people criticise the NHS, I think it is mainly a criticism of the funding cuts to the NHS, rather than the people working in it.

We do need to find a way to allow HCP to work safely - can the admin side be outsourced to volunteers, perhaps?