Is the green party starting to regret it's association with Islamists?

[mids2019]

The green party, ostensibly about climate protection and general progressive values seems to have gotten into bed with Islamist sympathisers and the amount of anti semitism and basic hatred of their own country is now obvious.

The green party now at least locally are known as a party that has sympathies towards all manner of Islamist causes including Hamas's objective to wipe Israel of the face of the Earth.

Wouldn't be surprised if they produce a motion declaring climate change a Jewish conspiracy........

You have zero proof that the Hannibal Directive was responsible for more than a tiny fraction of the casualties on October 7th, yet you decided to bring it up, pretending that we don’t really know who killed the majority of people on that day.

You are right. I have proof it was used though as Gallant admitted it. This article is quite telling though.

"Another message given to Israel’s Gaza division at 11.22am, about five hours after the attack began, ordered: “Not a single vehicle can return to Gaza.”

A southern command source told the paper: “Everyone knew by then that such vehicles could be carrying kidnapped civilians or soldiers … Everyone knew what it meant to not let any vehicles return to Gaza.”

Haaretz said it was still unclear whether civilians or soldiers were harmed as a result of these orders, or how many, but documents and testimonies of soldiers, as well as mid-level and senior Israel Defense Forces (IDF) officers, suggested the practice was used in a “widespread” manner on 7 October amid a lack of clear information as the IDF struggled to respond to the attack."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jul/07/israel-idf-hannibal-protocol-hamas-attack-haaretz

It's that sentence "Not a single vehicle can return to Gaza" and the word "widespread" which makes me wonder about the actual numbers. Also the fact that the official casualty figures had to be adjusted down from 1400 because the bodies were so badly burned, there was no way to tell which were Hamas and which were Israeli so they could only be identified via DNA testing. How on earth did the bodies get into that state from small arms fire.

There is no way we can definitively say how many as only the IDF know the actual number. I guess we will never know.

But despite your claims to be looking at logic and facts you are wilfully one sided. Most posters can see both sides, there is sympathy for Palestinians but an understanding that a one state solution would mean death for Israeli Jews.

You mention the olive tress and I can understand their symbolic importance and agree many of the settlers on the West Bank behave in an awful way. But Israeli is the most agriculturally productive country per hectare in the world. There willingness to introduce new agricultural methods and their success is what many in the ME should be doing but don’t. If Palestinians and others in the ME worked with Israel there would be food for all.

This is a complex issue and refusing to see that and focusing on victimhood rather than fighting for a productive peaceful future is one of the many reasons Palestinians find themselves in this mess.

That’s irrelevant to my post and to the fact that had Hamas and their civilian helpers not attacked on October 7th, nobody would have been killed that day, by the Hannibal Directive or otherwise.

That is actually what I was going to say to you.

I think you missed my point. It is not about how advanced Israel is when it comes to intensive farming. I have no doubt about that. I am questioning the destruction of olive groves and the connection that people from that land have to the olive trees. Even during the Turkish/Cypriot war which was incredibly brutal, neither side would have ever damaged the others olive groves.

The other point you make is what interests me though. I honestly do not believe a single state solution would lead to the death of Israeli Jews. I believe that if the vast majority of Palestinians were given the option, they would grab it with both hands. I actually know a lot of Palestinians. Ironically, I think it is Israel itself that would be a bigger problem. I have seen more than one video of young Israelis being interviewed and declaring there is no such thing as an innocent Palestinian, even the babies as they are taught to hate Jews from day one. I watched them literally ask why the army hasn't simply wiped them all out. After all these years of hate on both sides, of course it won't be easy but it has to be better than this. "If Palestinians and others in the ME worked with Israel there would be food for all". I absolutely agree but how are the Palestinians supposed to cooperate peacefully when they have no rights, are imprisoned in Gaza or are being driven off their land in the West Bank. It's a great idea and I believe more than doable but there has to be progress on peaceful coexistence first.

?

Evidence of a Palestinian desire for peace is limited to words.
They were offered 73% of their claim at Camp David with Clinton - I’m not repeating Clinton’s 96% as it is overly generous - and they turned it down. They were not prepared to give up anything.

Israel has been attacked at least 7 times, being invaded on several occasions and every country surrounding it invading it. No, Israelis don’t trust peace offers. Hamas, who the people of Palestine voted for, have declared they wish to destroy Israel. Why would young Israelis trust Hamas?

Arabs live, work, vote and thrive in Israel.
No Jews live in Gaze, few Jews live in other countries of the ME and they are all persecuted.

I do worry attitudes are hardening in Israel, especially after Oct 7th, It is a concern that Palestinians may have lost the chance of peace, but I hope not.

Meanwhile in the UK 'green' party...
https://david-collier.com/inside-occupied-territory-at-the-green-party-conference/

@quantumbutterfly that is chilling.

I see it on MN, that superior sneering as a replacement for debate.

I agree with you. I am an argumentative bitch but I'm agreeing, if there was no attack by Hamas, there would have been no civilian casualties. How they died is irrelevant. Innocents lost their lives for a reason beyond their control and that is always fucking awful.

Seriously. I have answered all of those points in previous posts. I'm not being rude or disrespectful but I really don't want to go through all that again. All I'm going to say is that Israel has never seriously made an honest declaration for peace, as I have explained before. At this moment in time, if things don't change, antisemitism, not just antizionism, is going to go through the roof which is terrifying. I get that when Israel was first 'established', the Palestinians fought tooth and nail to oppose it. Multiple Israeli prime ministers like Ben Gurion and even Erhud Barak acknowledged that they wouldn't have accepted it if the shoe was on the other foot. The Palestinians are just tired now. They know the idea of kicking all the Israelis out of the land is ridiculous. Of course you are going to have extremist nutters like hard line Hamas terrorists who will need dealing with but you also have the same on the Israeli side and they will need dealing with too. I believe there is still a possible future for the country along the lines of Hertzl's original dream but it is going to need an effort on both sides.

Thank you for posting.
A chilling insight into the takeover of the Green Party.

The article attempts to position itself as a genuine piece of investigative journalism, but it quickly degenerates into a partisan polemic focused on character assassination with no cited evidence to back up the assertions. The author claims “My work is hard-hitting, fact-based and unapologetically independent.” Is it hell. It is unapologetically pro-Israel propaganda designed to vilify the Green party for having the temerity to stand up for Palestinian rights. He claims to be fighting prejudice, but his own casual racism slips through in lines like “It is hard to imagine white people” exposing the hypocritical undertones of the whole piece.

It's incredible that the Green Party, which has existed fir decades, has ditched the environment for Palestine. This has become the cause du jour, the fashionable cause and the Greens have lapped it up.

Crazy situation. I read the above article and was pleased that there was at least one section of the Greens (Women Greens) who could see the entryism and fraud that's been inflicted on their party.

Thank you for sharing this, very insightful.
I remember a little while back someone on here was wondering what David Collier was doing at the Green Party conference, that will be the reason then.

I think it’s pretty obvious and widely accepted that the Green Party have been infiltrated and taken over by Corbynistas/ Marxists and Islamic extremists .

I absolutely disagree. The Greens have always been left wing, probably more so than Corbynistas. The only reason pro-Israelis are saying it has been infiltrated by Islamic extremists is because of the Zionism is Racism motion. Although I believe the motion was poorly thought out and worded, the premise is true when you look at the Likud's version of Zionism which is not limited to the Likud party.

Not so. It was already obvious before the vote that it had been infiltrated by extremists but now it’s clear to even their most naive supporters.

Obvious to who? So being anti Genocide now means you're an extremist. I get it.

Obvious to anyone with a brain that the Green Party had been infiltrated by extremists that want to destroy the state of Israel.

It’s disgusting and very clear now what the supposed “Green” party has become.

Exactly. Their deputy leader posting ‘White supremacist European settler colonialism must end!’ and arguing that "indigenous people have the right to fight back’ in the wake of October 7th certainly didn’t help.

You see the issue is, for decades, anyone who is pro-Palestinian would say that Western governments haven't just been infiltrated by Israeli lobbies, they've been either bought or coerced. That is obvious to anyone who has a brain and knows anything about AIPAC, all the 'whichever political party you want to mention' friends of Israel. And yet the Green party has been 'infiltrated'? What a joke. What is impressive though is the coordinated Islamophobic attack to try to discredit them. Israel must be furious that the amount of money they are spending on a global media smear campaign against Muslims is really not having the desired effect of gaining them any support for their Genocide. It must be infuriating that they can't gaslight the world anymore.

There is no global smear campaign against Muslims.

Your views are so extreme I can’t see the point of debating with you anymore. So I’ll leave it there.