Is the green party starting to regret it's association with Islamists?

[mids2019]

The green party, ostensibly about climate protection and general progressive values seems to have gotten into bed with Islamist sympathisers and the amount of anti semitism and basic hatred of their own country is now obvious.

The green party now at least locally are known as a party that has sympathies towards all manner of Islamist causes including Hamas's objective to wipe Israel of the face of the Earth.

Wouldn't be surprised if they produce a motion declaring climate change a Jewish conspiracy........

Did you see the JNS debate where 9 of the mainstream Zionist parties were asked a yes or no question whether they would support a Palestinian state. The answer was a decisive no. Considering the next coalition government is going to be formed from these parties, there is absolutely no way Israel is going to allow a two state solution. No matter which of the two camps wins the mathematical race to 61 seats, the entire governing coalition will be composed exclusively of parties that just stood on a stage and shouted "no" to a Palestinian state. So what now? Just more bloodshed and suffering for the Palestinian people.
https://www.jns.org/news/israel-news/zionist-parties-unite-against-palestinian-state-in-jns-election-debate

Once again, it is pure antisemitism to blame Israel for protecting its borders but not Egypt.

You don't want a two state solution either do you Oranges?

I think you said that on another thread.

That is seriously clutching at straws. How can you possibly compare Egypt's guarding of its border to Israel's total blockade. Gaza is not occupied by Egypt, under the Geneva Conventions, Israel remains the occupying power of Gaza. The Rafah border crossing was nothing more than that, just the same as any other border crossing between countries. Prior to Oct 7th, it was the main gateway for Gazans to get to the outside world, whether for tourism, business, or education. Egypt does not control Gaza’s electricity, its water supply, its sewage infrastructure, or its fuel intake. Israel does. Egypt does not patrol or restrict Gaza’s airspace or its territorial waters. Israel maintains a total maritime and aerial blockade. Gaza cannot build a seaport or an airport because Israel blocks it, not Egypt. Egypt cannot even issue an entry or exit permit to a Gazan unless that person is already registered in the Palestinian Population Registry, which is entirely controlled and modified by the Israeli military. A sovereign nation managing its own border crossing is lightyears away from an occupying force holding absolute domain over every facet of a population's daily survival.

Accusing someone of bias for pointing out who holds the keys to the grid, the water pipes, the sky, and the sea is just a desperate attempt to avoid the actual history.

Absolutely true. I would love to see a single state solution as Herzl himself envisaged. A safe homeland for Jews but shared equally with the existing indigenous population, regardless of their religion. You should read his book, Altneuland. Problem is, if the idea of a two state solution is such an anathema to Israeli political parties, they are hardly going to accept a single-state solution based on total equality and freedom for everyone between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea.

You want a single state solution with the single state called Palestine.

In other words, the eradication of the existing country that is Israel.

Egypt does not control Gaza’s electricity, its water supply, its sewage infrastructure, or its fuel intake. Israel does.

Are you saying there is something special about Egypt's border with Gaza such that electricity, water, sewage, and fuel cannot cross it?

Or are you just antisemitic?

That is a malicious and deliberate misinterpretation of my post and my convictions which I have clearly expressed on numerous occasions as you well know. I explicitly referenced Theodor Herzl's own vision in Altneuland. The father of Zionism did not design a blueprint for the eradication of Jews. He explicitly designed a blueprint for a society based on coexistence, mutual prosperity and equal rights for both Jewish and Arab residents. If you believe that a single state based on equal democratic rights and safety for everyone regardless of their religion means the destruction of a country, then you are the one arguing that democracy and equal rights are inherently destructive to its existence, not me.

Why are you being so obtuse about this? Israel are the occupiers. They control what goes into Gaza, even down to peanut butter. It has nothing to do with Eygpt.

No I don't know that it's a deliberate misinterpretation of your post.

I just remembered that you are in favour of a single state solution, which you confirmed.

What would you see this country being called if not Palestine? And will Palestine not be where Israel currently exists?

I said nothing about the eradication of Jews in my post btw, just the eradication of the existing country that is Israel.

The above is what the recent Green party vote Zionism is Racism is about I believe.

No Jewish homeland (Israel). Instead of Israel a new state where Jews and Muslims live together called Palestine.

That is not what only I'm saying, it is international law. Under international law, including the Geneva Conventions, Israel is the occupying power. Because of that occupation, Israel holds exclusive legal and military control over Gaza’s infrastructure, territory, and borders. Egypt cannot simply dig up international borders to lay fuel pipes or electrical grids into an occupied territory.

Accusing me of antisemitism for the third time today simply because I am repeating international law is a blatant violation of the Talk Guidelines. It is a desperate smear because you have entirely run out of arguments.

Jesus, that would be easiest part of the negotiation. "Israel Falastina" sounds quite good or "Israel and Palestine", bit like Bosnia and Herzegovina. Perhaps "Abrahamia". Who knows. That would need to be discussed between them. I actually don't think the vast majority of Palestinians would give a damn if it stayed Israel as long as they could get some kind of a life.

We’re discussing the period after Israel withdrew completely in 2005 up until Gaza launched a war in 2023. Do try to keep up.

Once again:

Are you saying there is something special about Egypt's border with Gaza such that electricity, water, sewage, and fuel cannot cross it?

The reason for the blockade is Hamas not the Palestinians.
When Hamas won the election in 2006 they had the opportunity to develop a nation but they became belligerents instead.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/politics/articles/fact-check-investigating-claim-bill-110000595.html?fr=yhssrp_catchall

Are you claiming that Israel was the occupying power under international law from 2005 to 2023?

The Israeli government and the United States have historically maintained that the 2005 unilateral disengagement—which removed all Israeli military bases and settlements from inside Gaza—ended the occupation.
Israel argues that without a permanent physical military presence inside the territory prior to later escalations, it did not exercise the "effective control" required under traditional definitions of military occupation under the Hague Regulations. However, critics and international tribunals counter that external control over borders, movement, and critical supplies still constitutes effective control.
Therefore the area is disputed.

Every country with neighbours across land borders controls movement and supplies.

Egypt has a border with Gaza. Why is Egypt not criticised for preventing electricity, water, sewage and fuel crossing it?

Once you see the antisemitism in the double standard, you cannot unsee it.

Yes, that is what the Green Party motion calls for, and on that basis alone, I would not have voted for that motion if I were a member of the Green Party. While I agree with a lot of the motion regarding human rights and international law, calling for a single state named Palestine does look like the total eradication of the State of Israel. That is far too symbolic and deeply unfair to Israelis, who have a right to safety and a homeland. My point has always been about equality and human rights, which is why I referenced Herzl's original vision in Altneuland, a safe Jewish homeland that shares equal democratic rights with the existing non Jewish population.

It's a theoretical problem renaming the country that used to be Israel. I find it quite a chilling prospect.

Won't happen of course.

As unlikely as a two state solution is, it's still more likely than replacing the current state of Israel with a single state called something else.

I'm not claiming it. It is an internationally recognized fact. The UN calls it occupied territory. The clue is in the name.

Egypt are spooky about opening their border to anything.
Cairo is deeply concerned that a large, unvetted influx of people—including potential Hamas members or militants—could cross into Egypt's Sinai Peninsula.
Egypt has fought a long-term counterinsurgency against Islamist militants in northern Sinai. Allowing armed factions or large-scale spillover from the Gaza conflict could destabilize the region and complicate Egypt’s peace treaty and security cooperation with Israel.
If Palestinians were resettled in Sinai, it could make the Egyptian territory a new base from which to launch resistance operations. This could drag Egypt into a military conflict with Israel.
In addition, Sisi has only just managed to clamp down on Islamist insurgents in North Sinai in recent years and is presumably concerned that an influx of refugees could be destabilising.
Between 2014 and 2016, the Egyptian military bombed and flooded tunnels linking Gaza with Egypt, at the same time as accusing Hamas of colluding with the Muslim Brotherhood against the state. It has also enforced Israel’s blockade of the Gaza Strip
Finally, Sisi likely believes Hamas could mount opposition to his regime.
This is just self protection.

At this moment in time, I agree with you. There would have to be a massive paradigm shift in the way the international community interacts with Israel in order to force a reform as it did with South Africa but i don't see that happening anytime soon. By the way, many countries have changed their name without issues. It is the people that matter, not a name.