27 children have been murdered by the IOF every day for 650 days in Gaza (UNICEF)

[Wedonttalkaboutboris]

Facts:

• At least 15,000 children have been killed since the war began in October 2023.
• Many have died in airstrikes, building collapses, or stampedes at aid sites.
• Thousands more have been injured, often with life-altering wounds, burns, or amputations.
• Gaza is facing famine-like conditions.
• Children are eating grass, leaves, or going days without food.
• Severe malnutrition is widespread, especially in northern Gaza. Babies and toddlers are dying of hunger-related causes.
• Nearly all children in Gaza are now considered to have signs of acute psychological trauma:
• Nightmares
• Bedwetting
• Non-responsiveness (shutdown/dissociation)
• Panic at loud sounds
• Many have lost one or both parents, siblings, or entire families.
• Most hospitals have been bombed or shut down.
• Children can’t access basic care, vaccines, or treatment for chronic illnesses.
• Wounded kids are operated on without anesthesia in some cases.
• Over 1 million children have been displaced—many multiple times.
• Families sleep in tents, rubble, or outdoors with no clean water or toilets.
• Nearly all schools have been shut down, destroyed, or turned into shelters.
• Many teachers and schoolchildren have been killed.
• A whole generation risks growing up with no access to education or safety.
• Children are drinking dirty water, leading to diarrheal diseases and infections.
• Outbreaks of hepatitis, lice, and scabies are widespread.
• Even in declared “safe zones” or aid areas, children have been shot, suffocated in stampedes, or killed by nearby strikes.
• Some have died while queuing for water or food.

“There is no safe place left for children in Gaza. They are being killed, starved, maimed, and psychologically shattered. This is not a humanitarian crisis—this is a crisis of humanity.”
— Save the Children, July 2025

Not at all. I feel the horror, don’t get me wrong.

Could you please post a link, because when I search for what you’ve described I can’t find anything.

Yes. This is what should be centred, always.

Pointing out that there is catastrophic suffering on both sides is not "deflection"

Acknowledging suffering on both sides is important, but it becomes deflection when it’s used to shut down or dilute urgent focus on a vastly disproportionate crisis.

Right now, one side is facing starvation, mass displacement, and tens of thousands of civilian deaths (including nearly 20,000 children). That scale of devastation demands focused outrage and accountability, not immediate redirection.

I understand that, but don't see anyone proposing any viable solutions on here that wouldn't put Israel at risk of 7 Oct +++ ad infinitum.

Perhaps a start would be not starving 2 million people, including infants? Letting in baby formula, medical aid, food?

Starvation isn’t self-defence. It’s not a “lack of viable solutions.” It’s a war crime.
If your safety plan involves letting babies starve, it’s not security- it’s brutality.

If your safety plan involves letting babies starve, it’s not security- it’s brutality.
This

I'm actually quite stunned by that comment. There are no other viable options to keep israelis safe so keep starving Palestinians? You might want to clarify what you mean @Beachtastic because I'm sure that's not it.

What’s one-sided is 90% of the casualties being Palestinians. What’s one-sided is tanks and fighter jets against refugee camps. Asking for basic human rights isn’t bias, it’s the bare minimum.

The idea that pointing to October 7th justifies starving 2 million people, denying baby formula to newborns, and burying tens of thousands under rubble is not self-defence. It’s collective punishment and it’s illegal.

Yes, Hamas has committed atrocities. No, that doesn’t give Israel a free pass to bomb refugee camps, shoot civilians trying to collect aid, or block food, water, and medicine from entering Gaza. International law doesn’t say “if they’re bad, you get to be too.”

There are viable solutions. Ceasefire. Hostage exchange. Humanitarian access. War crimes investigations on all sides. Those calling for that aren’t ignoring Israeli suffering, they’re just refusing to pretend that mass death is a path to justice.

What’s truly “one-sided” here HUN is the death toll. Tens of thousands of Palestinians killed (over 70% women and children). Aid sites attacked. Journalists and doctors targeted. Entire neighbourhoods wiped off the map. If 1,200 Israeli deaths must never be forgotten, why are 40,000 Palestinian ones treated as acceptable losses?

You want security? You don’t get it by creating more orphans and corpses. Safety doesn’t come from siege. It comes from justice.

And no, sharing images of bombed toddlers or starving infants isn’t the problem. The problem is what caused those images to exist.

If your only answer is “but Hamas,” then ask yourself why so many of your arguments collapse the second we start talking about dead children.

We all agree that the 2 state solution would have been the best solution. However, it was rejected in 1948. Hopefully with time and effort we might get there again.

Yes it was very questionable chanting death to the IDF! Sorry if this is not emphatic enough for you.

My main doubt is whether CPS will go ahead with a prosecution and what the charge will be. It’s not easy question apparently. Not my opinion - but from a lawyer:

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1521764/

No. Unfortunately, the two-state solution hasn’t just been “rejected” once in 1948- it’s been systematically undermined ever since. Israel’s ongoing settlement expansion, military occupation, and strict control over Palestinian life make a viable, sovereign Palestinian state impossible.

If Israel truly wanted peace, the conditions for a two-state solution would already exist. The harsh truth is that Israel’s current policies actively prevent it. So hoping for a two-state solution without addressing these realities is just wishful thinking that delays justice and prolongs suffering.

It might be an effort to put pressure on Hamas to release the hostages. Hamas also intercept supplies. What would I know, I really am in no position to comment!

Whether the CPS prosecutes or not, dodging accountability won’t erase the brutal reality:

27 children murdered every day in Gaza- 20,000 children killed by the IDF.

The focus on chanting and legal technicalities is a convenient distraction from the war crimes happening right now. If we really cared about justice and humanity, we’d be demanding an end to the slaughter.

@Beachtastic I appreciate your honesty about not feeling in a position to comment, but starving over 2 million people (many of them innocent children) isn’t a legitimate strategy; it’s collective punishment and a violation of international law. Using civilians as pawns to pressure Hamas only deepens the humanitarian catastrophe without guaranteeing any positive outcome. Real security should never come at the expense of starving newborns or blocking essential aid. There have to be better ways.

Release the formula !

I appreciate your passion. However, everyone needs to come to the table with a clear mind and head, or the continuous cycle of violence goes on. The Palestinians deserve so much more.

As I've said, I'm really more concerned with the way things are going here in the UK. What's happening in Israel and Gaza is shocking and incomprehensible. But seeing the peace'n'love crowd at Glasto chanting along with death threats because they visualise the IDF as Israel's version of the Gestapo, and the stratospheric rise in antisemitism since 7 Oct, is really alarming.

I was really shocked by the reaction here on MN in the immediate aftermath - literally, thread after thread after thread saying Israel always had it coming to them, saying the IDF killed more of their own that day than Hamas did, denying the sexual violence because rape testing kits were not used when piecing together charred and mutilated bodies, poking fun at the traumatised rescue teams... the list goes on.

Plans for the central London pro-Palestinian demo were submitted on 7 Oct for the marches the following weekend, suggesting a narrative that has been tightly controlled from the start. Wars always come with propaganda and this one is no exception, perhaps even outstrips any other we have ever known in terms of the way it is so directly and vividly fed into our social media.

This, of course, is not to say that the suffering in Gaza is not intolerable. But demonising Israel for it is neglecting Hamas's role in how things are unfolding. Do any of us really have any certainty about what is going on and why? No. But we can look around us here in the UK and clearly see a mounting wave of antisemitism that I feel the need to voice concern about.

The fact that simply saying children and babies shouldn’t be starved to death has become controversial is horrifying. Protecting CIVILIANS, especially the most vulnerable, is a basic human right, not a political debate. Starving newborns and children is a war crime, plain and simple. If that shocks anyone, maybe it’s time to reflect on what kind of world we’re letting happen.

If a state can do this, bomb homes, starve civilians, and destroy entire communities, literally wipe entire families out- with near-total impunity, do you honestly think anyone is safe from this kind of violence?

Imagine losing your home, watching your family slowly starve, all while the world watches it happen in real time and does virtually nothing. This isn’t just a tragedy for Gaza- it should concern all of us.

I agree. It should.

You ask if any of us really have certainty about what’s going on and why, but I think that question only serves to cloud what is clear. We do have certainty about many things:

We know tens of thousands of civilians have been killed, including over 20,000 children.
We know 80+ children have already died of starvation in the last few DAYS, and that aid - including baby formula and medical aid- has been deliberately blocked.

We know journalists, medics, and UN staff have been systematically targeted and killed.
We know survivors in Gaza are living without clean water, food, medicine, or shelter.
We know the Israeli government has openly stated it is waging a “complete siege.”

That’s not a narrative. That’s documented, corroborated fact.

Of course propaganda exists on all sides. But “there’s no certainty” can’t be a shield against moral clarity. We don’t need perfect information to know that mass death, starvation, and displacement on this scale is unjustifiable.

We should be worried about antisemitism here and also about the normalisation of collective punishment, ethnic cleansing, and the erasure of an entire people. If we’re going to talk about what truly shocks the conscience, that needs to be central to the conversation.

I agree that the Palestinians deserve so much more… let’s start with food, water, medicine, and the right not to be bombed in their sleep!

Asking people to “come to the table with a clear head” while they’re being starved, displaced, orphaned, or made to dig their children from rubble… feels like a demand for quiet suffering, not peace.

Look, I'm just a wanker on MN and nothing I think makes any difference. I suppose I am just wary of the way terms like "ethnic cleansing" and "the erasure of an entire people" are reserved for Palestine without acknowledging that that's precisely what Hamas (and not just Hamas) have in mind for Israel and, more generally, Jews.

I don’t think anyone is denying that antisemitism exists, or that there are real fears within Jewish communities. I’m also worried about the rise in anti-semitism in the UK as a result of this. But when we talk about ethnic cleansing or erasure, we’re not theorising about intent, we’re looking at actual outcomes.

Over 38,000 (?) people in Gaza have been killed. Over 70% are women and children. More than half the population is displaced. Entire families have been wiped off the civil registry. Babies are dying from hunger and dehydration. That’s not speculative. It’s happening now and it’s not happening in Israel.

You say you’re “just a wanker on MN”, but we’re all responsible for the narratives we endorse. Dismissing mass civilian death as just both sides wanting to erase each other, minimises the scale and asymmetry of this crisis. This isn’t about ignoring Israeli fear, it’s about refusing to look away from Palestinian reality.

I also disagree that terms like ethnic cleansing or erasure are “reserved” for Palestine. They’ve been used in countless global contexts; Bosnia, Rwanda, Myanmar, Ukraine- when mass displacement, indiscriminate killing, and systematic targeting of civilians occurred.The reason they’re being applied to Gaza now is because the scale and nature of what’s unfolding meets those very definitions.

This isn’t about denying Jewish fear or history. It’s about looking at what’s happening in front of us now. The starvation, the destruction, the killing of tens of thousands.

Being wary of language is fair…But surely we should also be more wary of a world where words like “ethnic cleansing” no longer shock us? because we’ve become too afraid or too worn down to use them when they apply.

Apologies, have been busy listening to Syrian minorities talking about what is happening right now in Syria.

I have just checked this and the link that I posted from Ramy Abdu (Assist. Prof of Law & Finance. Chairman EuromedHR) a Palestinian with family in Gaza was posted at 8:47am UK time around the time of the incident. Other videos posted around the same time from Palestinians showed the little boy with blood on him.

The TRT world (a Turkish media outlet with close ties to Erdoğan) video (here: https://x.com/trtworld/status/1947382236715667636) was posted at around 8:44pm UK time, 12 hours later and is 9 seconds shorter.

If you also look closely at the trt video they have blurred out the name of the person who released the video : abdulramin. W zard, which is clearly visible in the link from Ramy. They've also added their logo to the video.

I don't know where TRT sourced their video from (there are groups who deliberately edit videos in order to say that Palestinians are lying or allege "Pallywood") or why they posted it 12 hours after everyone else or whether they used a video editor but this link from another Turkish news site posted at 4:45pm UK time yesterday clearly shows the boy with blood.
https://x.com/anadoluagency/status/1947324658866331805