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Conflict in the Middle East

Heartbreaking news report from Gaza - Dr receives bodies of her children

786 replies

Applenation · 24/05/2025 23:27

Many of you will already have read about this. Paediatric specialist Dr Alaa al-Najjar was on duty when the bodies of nine of her 10 children were received by her in the hospital, after a strike in Khan Younis hit her home.

This report just stopped me in my tracks. I don't know what to say beyond this. I cannot stop thinking about this poor woman tonight.

er children killed by a strike in Khan Younis. Guardian link

OP posts:
Thread gallery
38
Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:16

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 16:58

Thank you.

The second article was very interesting. I tend to agree that Israel would be better to let journalists in with the IDF, though I can see why they don't.

The Spectator one I couldn't read as I don't have an account and am wary of subscribing to too many news sources. I just subscribed to Reuters the other day.

The problem is that it is hard to defend what Israel has done in Gaza. We can await till the ICC follow the necessary processes but this takes many years.

Most humans don’t see it in terms of what may be legal or otherwise, but see it through a lens of compassion for their fellow humans.

It might seem the reporting is antisemitic- but newspapers are just reporting what they witness from a human angle.

I don’t think they would aim to defend Hamas nor Israel - and that’s not really their job is it? It’s just to report what they see.

If people around the world hate what they see-
dont blame the messenger

Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:28

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 13:08

For the benefit of @Whatsinanamehey & @RandomWordsThrownTogether

Every time the media such as Sky News reports a story including says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry, that means it has come from Hamas.

27 Palestinians killed by Israeli fire while waiting for aid distribution, says Hamas-run Gaza health ministry

And the figures are thought to be an underestimate of all those who have died and remain under the rubble. Israel has previously considered the figures from the Hamas run health ministry as fairly accurate.

There’s even an article from Times of Israel.
You can also find articles prio 7/10 when it has been shown retrospectively that the Gazan / Hamas Ministry of Health figures have been accurate.
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/les-decodeurs/article/2024/10/13/why-the-gaza-health-ministry-s-death-count-is-considered-reliable_6729264_8.html

www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/idf-officials-15000-likely-killed-in-gaza-since-start-of-war-5000-of-them-are-hamas/

Why the Gaza Health Ministry's death count is considered reliable

Since the start of the war between Israel and Hamas on October 7, 2023, the credibility of the figures published by the Hamas-run administration has been regularly questioned.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/les-decodeurs/article/2024/10/13/why-the-gaza-health-ministry-s-death-count-is-considered-reliable_6729264_8.html

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 19:44

It is the current strategy to deny war crimes - attack the international press! The other day it was the children are child soldiers, before that they are human shields, now the press are all in bed with Hamas - liars the lot of them!

Deny - we didn’t do it, Fake news!!
Attack - Victims are all Hamas, child soldiers, human shields, international broadsheets and news channels are all biased
Reverse Victim and Offender - Anti Semitic, thousands of years of oppression, attacking Israel because everyone always singles out Israel.

Can you deny the countless photos of dead bodies, starving babies, children with missing legs??? The Economist estimate that 1 in 20 of Gaza’s population has been killed. They believe the death toll is grossly UNDER reported and is actually between 77k and 109k dead. This is because people aren’t included in the figures if they are still under rubble or are unidentifiable. These figures do not include people who succumb to their injuries at a later date, or get sepsis, or starve or die due to the embargo denying them medication like insulin. They explained how the analysed and compared data to arrive at these numbers.

How is it the multiple western governments, major international aid agencies, the UN, the ICC are all under the mistaken belief that people are being unjustly and cruelly slaughtered, that war crimes are being committed. But you have some insight that these major agencies didn’t uncover in the investigations - you should probably contact them and give them your overwhelming body of evidence. There is a genocide trial on the horizon, I am sure they would love to hear your proof!

Over a year ago Irish Barrister Blinne Ní Ghrálaigh gave a powerful speech at the ICJ, I know the figures are now higher but it gives an insight into the loss of life, dignity and human rights - here is an extract from the last section:

“On the basis of the current figures, on average 247 Palestinians are being killed and are at risk of being killed each day, many of them literally blown to pieces. They include 48 mothers each day, two every hour and over 117 children each day, leaving Unicef to call Israel’s actions a war on children.”

“On current rates, which show no sign of abating, each day over 3 medics, 2 teachers, more than one UN employee and more than one journalist will be killed, many while at work or in what appeared to be targeted attacks on their family homes or where they are sheltered.”

“The risk of famine will increase each day. Each day, an average of 629 people will be wounded, some multiple times over as they move from place to place desperately seeking sanctuary.”

Each day over 10 Palestinian children will have one or both legs amputated, many without anaesthetic. Each day, on current rates, an average 3900 Palestinian homes will be damaged or destroyed, more mass graves will be dug, more cemeteries will be bulldozed and bombed, denying even the dead any dignity or peace.”

"Each day ambulances, hospitals and medics will continue to be attacked and killed. The first responders who have spent three months without international assistance trying to dig families out of the rubble with their bare hands will continue to be targeted. On current figures, one will be killed almost every second day, sometimes in attacks launched against those attending the scene to rescue the wounded.”

“Each day yet more desperate people will be forced to relocate from where they are sheltering or will be bombed in places they have been told to evacuate to. Entire multigenerational families will be obliterated.”

Speech at the ICJ:

Economist Article on the Real Death Toll:
https://www.economist.com/interactive/middle-east-and-africa/2025/05/08/how-many-people-have-died-in-gaza

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RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 20:03

Twiglets1 · 03/06/2025 17:41

It's an interesting article, I hope people on here read it.

You are free to point out it could be biased which you have done. However, I didn't notice any obvious misreporting in that article.

I do wonder did you not study the difference between a quality newspaper/broadsheet and a Tabloid - the difference between news reporting and opinion pieces? I learned these distinctions first in Primary school, and then in more detail secondary. These are opinion pieces and would not be printed in a broadsheet.

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:22

Hope you all seen the interview on ch4 news tonight with Krishnan Guru-Murthy and an spokesman for Israel. Krishnan absolutely roasts him. The spokesman is initially but hamas but hamas...then eventually saying should Israel be treated differently because it has a jewish population. Exactly the sort of rhetoric we hear on here all the time.

It's well worth a watch, it was on ch4 at 7pm.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:41

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:22

Hope you all seen the interview on ch4 news tonight with Krishnan Guru-Murthy and an spokesman for Israel. Krishnan absolutely roasts him. The spokesman is initially but hamas but hamas...then eventually saying should Israel be treated differently because it has a jewish population. Exactly the sort of rhetoric we hear on here all the time.

It's well worth a watch, it was on ch4 at 7pm.

It is a disgrace. Quoting deaths numbers without validating, broadcasting Hamas-affilated video, claiming that this is the third shooting by the IDF this week despite the denial, claiming that Israel lies and is lying as a fact at so on. Doing Hamas's work for it. Hamas wants the aid process to fail as they have been cut out of it.

But dear god, the Israeli spokesperson was terrible and I can see why people don't believe him.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:51

Stripes56 · 03/06/2025 19:16

The problem is that it is hard to defend what Israel has done in Gaza. We can await till the ICC follow the necessary processes but this takes many years.

Most humans don’t see it in terms of what may be legal or otherwise, but see it through a lens of compassion for their fellow humans.

It might seem the reporting is antisemitic- but newspapers are just reporting what they witness from a human angle.

I don’t think they would aim to defend Hamas nor Israel - and that’s not really their job is it? It’s just to report what they see.

If people around the world hate what they see-
dont blame the messenger

  1. For some reason, people feel compassion for the Palestinians killed by Israel but not for Palestinians killed in Syria. Or people dying in Yeman. Or so on. It is almost as if they care only when Jews do it.
  2. The reporting should apply some journalistic integrity rather than just broadcast Hamas propaganda as Channel 4, for example, did today.
ssd · 03/06/2025 20:54

No, i thought the Israeli spokesman was brilliant. He parroted everything Krishnan expected him to say and couldn't answer any questions Krishnan put to him eg. If the IDF opened fire on people trying to get aid because these people were acting in a threatening manor, did the people have weapons? No? Then what exactly constitutes a threatening manor? Of course the spokesman couldn't answer because there is no answer.

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:59

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:51

  1. For some reason, people feel compassion for the Palestinians killed by Israel but not for Palestinians killed in Syria. Or people dying in Yeman. Or so on. It is almost as if they care only when Jews do it.
  2. The reporting should apply some journalistic integrity rather than just broadcast Hamas propaganda as Channel 4, for example, did today.

Ha, so now ch4 news is broadcasting hamas propaganda...this is exactly what the spokesman tried saying to KG-M and he completely closed him down.

I recommend watching this interview, excellent journalism by an experienced professional.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:59

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:54

No, i thought the Israeli spokesman was brilliant. He parroted everything Krishnan expected him to say and couldn't answer any questions Krishnan put to him eg. If the IDF opened fire on people trying to get aid because these people were acting in a threatening manor, did the people have weapons? No? Then what exactly constitutes a threatening manor? Of course the spokesman couldn't answer because there is no answer.

I suspect that the IDF simply has not told him. I know you won't believe this, but Israel doesn't really prioritise this type of media handling. But he was terrible even taking that into account.

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:02

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:59

I suspect that the IDF simply has not told him. I know you won't believe this, but Israel doesn't really prioritise this type of media handling. But he was terrible even taking that into account.

Oh right so he didn't realise then...

Pull the other one, its got bells on.

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:02

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:59

Ha, so now ch4 news is broadcasting hamas propaganda...this is exactly what the spokesman tried saying to KG-M and he completely closed him down.

I recommend watching this interview, excellent journalism by an experienced professional.

So juvenile....

Somebody filmed that footage from within the Gaza Strip. That person is affiliated with Hamas. The Gazans being interviewed would have known it is for foreign consumption.

So tell me how it is not Hamas progaganda?

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:03

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:02

Oh right so he didn't realise then...

Pull the other one, its got bells on.

Edited

Think the worse of Israel and mindlessly consume Hamas progaganda. Says it all

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 21:03

ssd · 03/06/2025 20:22

Hope you all seen the interview on ch4 news tonight with Krishnan Guru-Murthy and an spokesman for Israel. Krishnan absolutely roasts him. The spokesman is initially but hamas but hamas...then eventually saying should Israel be treated differently because it has a jewish population. Exactly the sort of rhetoric we hear on here all the time.

It's well worth a watch, it was on ch4 at 7pm.

God that spokesman was obnoxious, he really should get some PR training! Lashing out, accusing the interviewee of anti semitism and being pro Hamas - really unprofessional. Attacking the interviewer when he couldn’t answer the questions really doesn’t paint him in a good light. Israel is going for the media today!

The thing that strikes me too is that Israel are boasting that they distributed 7million meals in a week to the starving population- that is half a meal per person per day! That’s not exactly going to stave off hunger!!

For those that missed it, you can just scroll down to find individual segments if you don’t want to watch the whole thing. Unicef interview is worth a listen too!
https://www.channel4.com/news/programmes/2025/06/03/1900

Tue 3 Jun 2025

For a third day, Israel is accused of killing and wounding Palestinians trying to collect food. Thames Water's future continues to be in doubt. And the UK’s missing cancer nurses.

https://www.channel4.com/news/programmes/2025/06/03/1900

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 21:04

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:59

I suspect that the IDF simply has not told him. I know you won't believe this, but Israel doesn't really prioritise this type of media handling. But he was terrible even taking that into account.

He's the Israeli government public spokesperson David Mencer he's always on different media channels. Google him he's not some blow in that hasn't been briefed fgs

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:05

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:02

So juvenile....

Somebody filmed that footage from within the Gaza Strip. That person is affiliated with Hamas. The Gazans being interviewed would have known it is for foreign consumption.

So tell me how it is not Hamas progaganda?

So rude. You do yourself no favours, do you?

And proof of what you claim is true would be appreciated?

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:06

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:05

So rude. You do yourself no favours, do you?

And proof of what you claim is true would be appreciated?

You want me to prove that the person filming the footage was affiliated with Hamas?

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:07

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 21:04

He's the Israeli government public spokesperson David Mencer he's always on different media channels. Google him he's not some blow in that hasn't been briefed fgs

Edited

They asked him whether the Palestinians were armed. Reasonable question. Unbelievable he couldn't answer. Then says that Israel complies by international law not channel four law. An absolute shambles

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:10

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:06

You want me to prove that the person filming the footage was affiliated with Hamas?

You said this @Biscuitsformeandyou
"Somebody filmed that footage from within the Gaza Strip. That person is affiliated with Hamas. The Gazans being interviewed would have known it is for foreign consumption."

I am asking where is the proof for this claim?

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:13

There is no proof, it is purely your opinion.

Which means nothing.

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 21:14

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:07

They asked him whether the Palestinians were armed. Reasonable question. Unbelievable he couldn't answer. Then says that Israel complies by international law not channel four law. An absolute shambles

Well this is his credentials

David Mencer, a former director of Labour Friends of Israel, described himself on his LinkedIn page as a "communications specialist".[1] By March 2024 he was an Israeli Government Spokesman[2], often reported in the commercially-controlled media, where he "expressed grief" about the killing of aid workers by an Israeli airstrike in April 2024.[3]

It's clearly getting harder and harder for him to lie convincingly

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:18

ComeAsYouAreAsAFriend · 03/06/2025 21:14

Well this is his credentials

David Mencer, a former director of Labour Friends of Israel, described himself on his LinkedIn page as a "communications specialist".[1] By March 2024 he was an Israeli Government Spokesman[2], often reported in the commercially-controlled media, where he "expressed grief" about the killing of aid workers by an Israeli airstrike in April 2024.[3]

It's clearly getting harder and harder for him to lie convincingly

What do you think he lied about in that interview?

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:32

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:13

There is no proof, it is purely your opinion.

Which means nothing.

https://thearabweekly.com/hamas-signals-intent-gag-media

Hamas has an extensive media operation. They employ cameramen, have relationships with international outlets, and actively produce content for foreign consumption. They run the Ministry of Information, issue permits, and monitor all filming. No one films for broadcast without their knowledge.

For Gaza footage to appear on UK channels, it goes through established channels - either Hamas's own media networks, or local stringers who work with Hamas permission and oversight.

Hamas facilitate access to grieving families and survivors specifically because they want this footage broadcast internationally.

The alternative would require believing that UK television channels are somehow receiving footage from Gaza through channels that bypass the governing authority. That's impossible given the security situation and Hamas's documented control over the territory.

Hamas signals intent to gag media | | AW

Under the now rescinded restrictions, sponsors were told they must accompany the journalists during their reporting and will be held responsible for what they produce. 

https://thearabweekly.com/hamas-signals-intent-gag-media

RandomWordsThrownTogether · 03/06/2025 21:34

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 20:51

  1. For some reason, people feel compassion for the Palestinians killed by Israel but not for Palestinians killed in Syria. Or people dying in Yeman. Or so on. It is almost as if they care only when Jews do it.
  2. The reporting should apply some journalistic integrity rather than just broadcast Hamas propaganda as Channel 4, for example, did today.

The thing is I have not heard anyone say “oh Assad is a great man” if they did I would be posting data and links to articles that show that he is a war criminal who brutally murdered his own people. If anyone said “all the rebels in Syria are great” I would explain how there are 20+ different groups and some of them are pretty awful too. Happy to talk about Syria and the blatant human rights abuses there, the complexity of the situation etc…

Again if anyone defended the Taliban in Afghanistan or indeed the British and US governments who abandoned people to the Taliban, many of whom had been employed by the UK and US and were certain to be executed. Honestly I have had huge rants and cried tears for those poor people and am still very angry at how the west abandoned them.

It is largely agreed in the west (apart from a small number of extremists) that Assad is a criminal, the Taliban are criminals etc… we don’t have boards dedicated to debating it as we would all just be agreeing with each other. The figures from these conflicts are not disputed, the murdered are universally recognised as innocent victims. The thousands of images of people tortured to death in Syria was never called fake or Syriawood. The problem lies with Israel’s manipulation of the media, shutting off a war zone to international press and then denying the testimony of doctors, amputees, UN workers, journalists, victims… The problem lies in justifying the death of children, debating the death tolls and attacking the UN, Amnesty International, most major newspapers. Israel is committing war crimes and spending millions on gaslighting anyone who calls them out on it.

ssd · 03/06/2025 21:37

Biscuitsformeandyou · 03/06/2025 21:32

https://thearabweekly.com/hamas-signals-intent-gag-media

Hamas has an extensive media operation. They employ cameramen, have relationships with international outlets, and actively produce content for foreign consumption. They run the Ministry of Information, issue permits, and monitor all filming. No one films for broadcast without their knowledge.

For Gaza footage to appear on UK channels, it goes through established channels - either Hamas's own media networks, or local stringers who work with Hamas permission and oversight.

Hamas facilitate access to grieving families and survivors specifically because they want this footage broadcast internationally.

The alternative would require believing that UK television channels are somehow receiving footage from Gaza through channels that bypass the governing authority. That's impossible given the security situation and Hamas's documented control over the territory.

Again, this is your opinion based on finding an article that supports your views.
That isn't proof.

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