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Conflict in the Middle East
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Jewishcraic · 02/02/2025 20:21

MumonabikeE5 · 02/02/2025 19:56

We are told holocaust Memorial Day is to make sure it’s “never again” but here we are watching genocide happen, people, so many children, being purposefully killed and maimed.

Israelilefty has a very good thread where you can go and discuss the war in Gaza.

While what is happening (hopefully over now) in Gaza is very sad, its not remotely similar to the holocaust.

Imagine if someone would turn up at your beloveds relatives funeral and start going on about the crimes (real or imagined) of one of your other relatives.

Dulra · 02/02/2025 20:27

OpheliaWasntMad · 02/02/2025 19:04

And maybe , unfortunately, because the Irish Jews are too small a minority to offer any electoral advantage . So their views don’t matter.

It’s particularly shocking that this should have happened on a Holocaust Memorial Day . It’s as though Higgins just saw this day as a political opportunity.

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It’s as though Higgins just saw this day as a political opportunity.

It definitely wasn't for any political opportunities. He's in his 80s been a politician since the 60s. He's on his 2nd term of a two term only presidency he's nothing to lose any more

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:27

It seems to me like people in Holocaust Education Ireland were keen that Gaza was mentioned. Otherwise why invite someone who would definitely mention it.

they could have invited someone else to speak this year.

Jewishcraic · 02/02/2025 20:33

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:27

It seems to me like people in Holocaust Education Ireland were keen that Gaza was mentioned. Otherwise why invite someone who would definitely mention it.

they could have invited someone else to speak this year.

tricky since an general election was in the offing when the invites went out, so they were perhaps not sure who to invite. I don't think thats a good excuse but it might be the reason. In general either the president or the taoiseach or Tánaiste are invited to speak at HMD.

Obviously in hindsight it was a terrible idea.

Still no statement from HEI regarding this that I have seen.

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:41

there was a comment in an article I read here.

Some protesting at the event was expected, according to Holocaust Education Ireland Chairperson Tom O’Dowd.

It turned out to be a very small protest. It didn't stop the President in his stride.
"And I think it is worth pointing out that the President has spent a lifetime fighting for civil and human rights, and I don't think he would object to people objecting either," he said.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0126/1492985-holocaust-commemoration-dublin/

Protesters removed from memorial while President speaks

A number of people left and others were removed from a Holocaust memorial event at the Round Room of the Mansion House in Dublin in protest over President Michael D Higgins' speech.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0126/1492985-holocaust-commemoration-dublin

Dulra · 02/02/2025 20:47

Jewishcraic · 02/02/2025 20:33

tricky since an general election was in the offing when the invites went out, so they were perhaps not sure who to invite. I don't think thats a good excuse but it might be the reason. In general either the president or the taoiseach or Tánaiste are invited to speak at HMD.

Obviously in hindsight it was a terrible idea.

Still no statement from HEI regarding this that I have seen.

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I know the Taoiseach was at Auschwitz.

Original poster
OpheliaWasntMad · 02/02/2025 20:53

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:41

there was a comment in an article I read here.

Some protesting at the event was expected, according to Holocaust Education Ireland Chairperson Tom O’Dowd.

It turned out to be a very small protest. It didn't stop the President in his stride.
"And I think it is worth pointing out that the President has spent a lifetime fighting for civil and human rights, and I don't think he would object to people objecting either," he said.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0126/1492985-holocaust-commemoration-dublin/

Thank you.
I found this from Lior Tibet powerful :

“And then someone came and grabbed me to leave the vicinity, which again, it's our event to commemorate. How am I, as a Jew, being kicked out of my event?", she questioned.
Ms Tibet, who is a tutor in UCD, said she was offended over the parallel between the Holocaust and what is happening with Gaza.
Lior Tibet accused President Higgins of 'hijacking' the event by mentioning the war in Gaza
"You don't know my political opinions about Israel. I'm very critical about the Israeli state and what is happening here. I'm not supportive of anything.
She added: "I would want to see the war ended 13 months before and all the hostages back, want to see the war ended, is not the case, I'm responsible to that.
"None of my Israeli and Jewish friends are responsible to that and to see Higgins hijacking our commemoration event is just unbearable."

OP posts:
Dulra · 02/02/2025 20:56

LetThereBeLove · 02/02/2025 17:55

Not nearly as much as antisemitism/anti Zionism. And when I used to visit Dublin DD would tell me not to speak loudly as obv English people weren't liked by some Irish people!
People gonna hate ...

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And when I used to visit Dublin DD would tell me not to speak loudly as obv English people weren't liked by some Irish people!

Your dd was being overly cautious my dh is English been here 20 years he loves it here never had any issues with being English other than the usual Irish vs England rugby banter

stomachamelon · 02/02/2025 21:36

@MumonabikeE5 in your opinion.

LetThereBeLove · 02/02/2025 22:06

OpheliaWasntMad · 02/02/2025 19:53

I’m really glad you’ve been listened to respectfully here . You’ve put forward your feelings really movingly .

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Unfortunately there are some posters who aren't listening respectfully.

LetThereBeLove · 02/02/2025 22:08

MumonabikeE5 · 02/02/2025 19:56

We are told holocaust Memorial Day is to make sure it’s “never again” but here we are watching genocide happen, people, so many children, being purposefully killed and maimed.

There is no genocide happening currently.

Liv999 · 02/02/2025 22:11

LetThereBeLove · 02/02/2025 22:08

There is no genocide happening currently.

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No there isn't in the last few weeks now that the aid trucks have finally been allowed through 🙏

Jewishcraic · 02/02/2025 22:22

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:41

there was a comment in an article I read here.

Some protesting at the event was expected, according to Holocaust Education Ireland Chairperson Tom O’Dowd.

It turned out to be a very small protest. It didn't stop the President in his stride.
"And I think it is worth pointing out that the President has spent a lifetime fighting for civil and human rights, and I don't think he would object to people objecting either," he said.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0126/1492985-holocaust-commemoration-dublin/

Not impressed by the shocking lack of apology by Tom O'Dowd for the disgraceful overreaction of the security. And his dismissing of the protest.

LetThereBeLove · 02/02/2025 22:34

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 20:41

there was a comment in an article I read here.

Some protesting at the event was expected, according to Holocaust Education Ireland Chairperson Tom O’Dowd.

It turned out to be a very small protest. It didn't stop the President in his stride.
"And I think it is worth pointing out that the President has spent a lifetime fighting for civil and human rights, and I don't think he would object to people objecting either," he said.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0126/1492985-holocaust-commemoration-dublin/

For heavens sake give it a rest. Most Jewish people I know, as well as some who aren't Jewish were appalled by Higgins comments.

Jewishcraic · 02/02/2025 22:35

Just to note: Tom O'Dowd is not Jewish.

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 22:44

i think Simon Harris made a good bash at his statement- standing by the president while being as inoffensive as possible basically

“I believe yesterday’s event was a very moving occasion, obviously for survivors and their families, most particularly, and Minister (Paschal) Donohoe was there on behalf of the government.

“I understand there were a small number of people who protested, and of course people have a right to protest, but I think the president was very clear, as is the government, as are the people of Ireland, in calling out the horrors of the Holocaust and making sure we remember that we record that, that we acknowledge that each year, and of course, people have a right to protest.”

Asked whether he believed it was appropriate for the president to raise the issues in Gaza during his speech about the Holocaust, Mr Harris said: “I think the president was very clear in relation to, obviously specific issues regarding the Holocaust and his absolute condemnation of the horror, the murder of the Jewish people, but also, I think, rightly mentioning the situation in the Middle East as well. Also calling very much for hostages to be released. I am conscious, though, that this is a very, very sensitive time, and I don’t want to say anything to distract from that.
“Today is the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz, today is International Holocaust Memorial Day. I think it’s really important that we keep the focus on that.”

Original poster
OpheliaWasntMad · 02/02/2025 23:28

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 22:44

i think Simon Harris made a good bash at his statement- standing by the president while being as inoffensive as possible basically

“I believe yesterday’s event was a very moving occasion, obviously for survivors and their families, most particularly, and Minister (Paschal) Donohoe was there on behalf of the government.

“I understand there were a small number of people who protested, and of course people have a right to protest, but I think the president was very clear, as is the government, as are the people of Ireland, in calling out the horrors of the Holocaust and making sure we remember that we record that, that we acknowledge that each year, and of course, people have a right to protest.”

Asked whether he believed it was appropriate for the president to raise the issues in Gaza during his speech about the Holocaust, Mr Harris said: “I think the president was very clear in relation to, obviously specific issues regarding the Holocaust and his absolute condemnation of the horror, the murder of the Jewish people, but also, I think, rightly mentioning the situation in the Middle East as well. Also calling very much for hostages to be released. I am conscious, though, that this is a very, very sensitive time, and I don’t want to say anything to distract from that.
“Today is the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz, today is International Holocaust Memorial Day. I think it’s really important that we keep the focus on that.”

This response is typical of politician’s meaningless weasel words . Completely vacuous.

OP posts:
Original poster
OpheliaWasntMad · 03/02/2025 00:11

It looks as if Holocaust Education Ireland might have a few questions to answer according to some of the posts on here
https://x.com/rachelmoiselle/status/1885660278836097333?s=46

x.com

https://x.com/rachelmoiselle/status/1885660278836097333?s=46

OP posts:
Jewishcraic · 03/02/2025 11:10

mollyfolk · 02/02/2025 22:44

i think Simon Harris made a good bash at his statement- standing by the president while being as inoffensive as possible basically

“I believe yesterday’s event was a very moving occasion, obviously for survivors and their families, most particularly, and Minister (Paschal) Donohoe was there on behalf of the government.

“I understand there were a small number of people who protested, and of course people have a right to protest, but I think the president was very clear, as is the government, as are the people of Ireland, in calling out the horrors of the Holocaust and making sure we remember that we record that, that we acknowledge that each year, and of course, people have a right to protest.”

Asked whether he believed it was appropriate for the president to raise the issues in Gaza during his speech about the Holocaust, Mr Harris said: “I think the president was very clear in relation to, obviously specific issues regarding the Holocaust and his absolute condemnation of the horror, the murder of the Jewish people, but also, I think, rightly mentioning the situation in the Middle East as well. Also calling very much for hostages to be released. I am conscious, though, that this is a very, very sensitive time, and I don’t want to say anything to distract from that.
“Today is the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz, today is International Holocaust Memorial Day. I think it’s really important that we keep the focus on that.”

not very impressed. No apology.

He is just covering himself - I think it is his office who is responsible for vetting MDH's speeches.

mollyfolk · 03/02/2025 16:19

No he’s not covering himself at all, he wouldn’t have seen the speech- his speeches are not vetted by anyone. There is very little constitutional restriction on what he can say.

Jewishcraic · 03/02/2025 16:26

mollyfolk · 03/02/2025 16:19

No he’s not covering himself at all, he wouldn’t have seen the speech- his speeches are not vetted by anyone. There is very little constitutional restriction on what he can say.

ok this is what someone who seemed to know what he was talking about told me. But maybe he is entirely wrong. :)

Either way not expecting all that much from Simon Harris.

mollyfolk · 03/02/2025 17:34

It’s my understanding that only addresses to the Oireachtas or address to the nation have to get prior approval. But I’m not an expert.

Original poster
OpheliaWasntMad · 03/02/2025 17:59

Jewishcraic · 03/02/2025 16:26

ok this is what someone who seemed to know what he was talking about told me. But maybe he is entirely wrong. :)

Either way not expecting all that much from Simon Harris.

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An apology would have helped…
but there’s probably not enough votes in it for Simon Harris

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