Ireland believe genocide being perpetrated

[username7891]

I'm surprised this hasn't already been posted but Ireland passed a non binding motion a few days ago that “genocide is being perpetrated before our eyes by Israel in Gaza”.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/micheal-martin-ireland-south-africa-gaza-people-b1192666.html

Well the current circumstances are that Ireland in view of its current past are supporting Palestine and people on this board are trying to rewrite Irish history and suggest Ireland is supportive of Palestine because they're antisemitic 🤨 Again this thread was derailed by posters misinterpreting Irelands past, I'm sorry it's so exasperating for you to read PP correcting them. You clicked into the thread did you have another comment to make on the topic or just to tell people to stop discussing Irish history?

Btw I never suggest the Irish were colonisers !
I just objected to the bigoted suggestion that only certain people were Irish .
Lots of the newer generations of Irish will have traumatic experiences from their countries of origin. Perhaps it is worth pointing out that the Irish are not unique in having experienced oppression and for some the oppression continues.

You agreed with PP bigotry then?You don’t think it needed challenging?

You don’t think I should challenge views like this

..
“Let's be very clear. English people who came to Ireland and took up land and property that the Irish had been evicted from were invaders.
Given the length of time that some of those families have been here, and in the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement they are considered to be a permanent fixture. Though most big up their Irishness now..
Addressing the nuances in posts is ridiculous as it is beyond multifaceted. But yes I do want my country all of my country for the Irish. I am a proud nationalist. Isn't everyone ?”
Im

Of course you didn't, I said PP were already responding to the suggestion that they were and should feel a kinship with Israel and that British people were victims of the Irish and had their lands and homes stolen by the Irish. You have then jumped in later down the discussion accusing a poster of racism completely out of context.

Perhaps it is worth pointing out that the Irish are not unique in having experienced oppression and for some the oppression continues.
Of course they aren't and I don't think anyone is suggesting they are. I'm sure we'll see you replying to other posters talking about their historical oppression with the same dismissive tone yes?

Paste their whole comment and the comment they were responding to. You are deliberately taking a slither of their post completely out on context to take offense on behalf of the British when they were colonising Ireland for some reason that isn't clear.
Are you ok?

Exactly- people should know that none of the political parties got more than 25% of the vote in the last election, so the majority who voted didn't want either FF or FG and, as only 7% voted for the Greens, hardly anyone wanted them in government!
But they formed a coalition and we got stuck with FF, FG and the Greens!
Since then, they've done a lot that the Irish people themselves haven't wanted them to.
And yes, a lot of Irish people do sympathise with the Palestinians for being occupied but in all my years here, I have never once come across any Irish person who hated Jews. TBH, I've not heard anything at all!
The Irish people I know from years of living in Ireland and visiting all my life before that, are not hateful!

To be clear people, English who came and took up land and homes of the Irish citizens were invaders. That is a factual statement. History and accuracy of history is what allowed my nation to retain it's culture.

So because it was only one bully, in numerous occasions which still has negatively impacted our nation, culture and language we should just forget? Nope.

Are you ok ? 🙄
I didn’t distort the meaning of the comments in any way .
So you think those comments were fine …
Are you ok?

You are distorting them though, you're implying that poster was a racist bigot? When they were responding to the suggestion that British people rightfully own properties and lands in Ireland that should be returned to them. They were explaining the context that they were invaders and there was a rude post suggesting it that poster wanted to kick them all out. They responded that everyone in the republic is Irish there's obviously a complexity with some people wanting to claim Irishness while using titles from the British which obviously still bears a painful history with the Irish. Your leap that they are a bigot is reaching.

I don’t agree . I think their views are clearly bigoted .

eg
“Let's be very clear. English people who came to Ireland and took up land and property that the Irish had been evicted from were invaders.
Given the length of time that some of those families have been here, and in the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement they are considered to be a permanent fixture. Though most big up their Irishness now

. But yes I do want my country all of my country for the Irish. I am a proud nationalist. Isn't everyone ?”

To be clear people, English who came and took up land and homes of the Irish citizens were invaders. That is a factual statement. History and accuracy of history is what allowed my nation to retain it's culture.

Well, hang on a moment - the 'English' people who invaded 800 years ago were French - they'd literally just conquered England (and continued to fight over it for the next while as well) - and they stayed, integrated, and became 'British' in exactly the same way that they did in Ireland and became Irish.

Brits in general have a bit of a problem with the concept of a native brit, having been invaded so often from all sides over the centuries.

@Usernamesareboring1
Personally I think it would be better to say this poster’s views are not representative of most Irish people’s views ( as other posters have implied)
I don’t believe most Irish people think like this but there are pockets of ultra nationalist sentiment that I object to as I do think it’s bigoted.
But you choose to defend these views and call me out for challenging them.

I'm calling you out for challenging selective sentences of the post out of context to imply she's a bigot at the same time as you trying to shut down discussion of Irish history even when the poster has clarified her post. If you're going to challenge it, challenge it and not by smearing them as a racist bigot. If you have an actual problem with that they said, what is it? Because it reads that you are taking offense to the British accurately being described as invaders of Ireland.

@Limesodaagain
I don’t believe most Irish people think like this but there are pockets of ultra nationalist sentiment that I object to as I do think it’s bigoted.

Will we see you challenging Zionism and Israeli nationalism as bigoted other threads then?

“Reads that you are taking offense to the British accurately being described as invaders of Ireland.”
This happened hundreds of years ago. The pp was talking about current generations who are “considered a permanent fixture “ and who “big up their Irishness”
I think that’s discriminatory as it suggests they’re not really Irish …
Perhaps you agree with that view and therefore don’t find it bigoted

Well quite. And then there was another round of French invaders who were in fact refugees, but also 'invaders' when it came to Ireland. When do invaders get accepted? Intermarriage is a good clue.

💯 I’ll challenge bigotry if I see it and if no one else is calling it out

Again did you just not actually read the conversation you jumped onto or are you deliberately misinterpreting it?
A previous poster referred to the a British that invaded Ireland as "Anglo Irish" people who lost their homes as they were taken from the Irish. It was corrected that they were not Anglo Irish they were British colonialists who certainly didn't want to be "Irish" they wanted to make that place British. They were asked if the Anglo Irish exist now and if they wanted to kick them all out and she said they're all Irish now and you won't hear them calling themselves Anglo Irish and they big up their Irishness now I.e.. they identify and are proud to be Irish.
I see you're now trying to imply I'm a bigot too. Based on what? What's wrong with you ?

There is no point in this discussion.
You keep implying my interjection was in bad faith. It wasn’t. I was trying to be fair.
You must know there is ultra nationalist bigotry in Ireland. ( a small minority admittedly)

To be clear - the reference to the Good Friday Agreement does suggest this poster was talking about people who live here NOW.
As does the present tense in the following about
“Invaders”
..”It's literally what they are. Exactly how would you describe? We didn't have a dispute about land, they didn't overstay a visit”

You were implying bad faith from PP and calling them someone with racist bigotted views while at the same time being quite rude and aggressive about people talking about their families painful histories "FFS move on".
Anyway, I'm sure we'll all seeing you as aggressively challenging the anti Arab racism on these boards with as much vigour going forward and challenging any posters who hold Israeli nationalist views.

When they were responding to the suggestion that British people rightfully own properties and lands in Ireland that should be returned to them.

Curious about this…do British people still own properties in Ireland that should be returned to them? Can’t remember who made the suggestion at this stage.

I’m assuming the implication is that lands and properties were seized during the War of Independence. I wasn’t aware this happened - did it? ( I do know that a number of Great Houses were burned. There was compensation paid for this, perhaps inadequate.)

Otherwise I thought that people sold their properties etc., especially as large estates became much more expensive to run during the 20th century. For example. I know the local Great House was sold to the Irish Land Commission and Forestry Commission in or around the 60s and is now run as a state park.

The Land Acts ran from 1870 and continued after Independence I know and they led to a huge difference in the ownership of land in Ireland. (‘In 1870, only 3% of Irish farmers owned their own land while 97% were tenants. By 1929, this ratio had been reversed with 97.4% of farmers holding their farms in freehold…economic disadvantage continued.’ Wikipedia)

So I’m surprised at the implications above. Can anyone fill me in on them please, genuinely curious, thank you.

Ffs move on - yes I stand by that
🙄

Good I'm glad you clarified that you think people mourning their dead families members killed by the army or terrorists should FFS move on 👍🏻 Is that across the board?