Israel Gaza war: ICC prosecutor seeks arrest warrants for Netanyahu and Hamas leaders

[SerendipityJane]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3ggpe3qj6wo

From the ICJ thread yesterday @PeasfullPerson

Reaction from Hamas

Hamas official: ICC prosecutor’s decision ‘equates the victim with the executioner’

The decision by the ICC prosecutor to seek arrest warrants for three Hamas leaders “equates the victim with the executioner”, a senior Hamas official told the Reuters news agency.

Sami Abu Zuhri also said the ICC decision gives encouragement to Israel to continue its “war of extermination” in Gaza.

I am no expert and only repeating some fact sheet a news outlet posted.

I think it would have to be indirect via the UNSC as the UNSC can refer motions re war crimes to the ICC. The US will likely argue that because Israel is outside jurisdiction, no arrest warrants can be issued for the conflict. As in Hamas arrest warrants can’t be done, but neither can Israeli arrest warrants. That none of the conflict is anything the ICC can rule on. They would expect to get broader support that way.

They will argue Hamas leaders, once caught, should stand trial in Israel for their war crimes under their domestic terrorism laws (which carry the death penalty.) A few Arab nations might be ok with this, as they can whisk away Hamas leaders with no extradition and protect them too.

If the US loses this argument (high chance rn) and can’t get the UNSC on side to either agree or abstain, they will then whisk Nethanyu and Gallant away into exile in the US (US isn’t under ICC jurisdiction and there is no extradition agreement) and then say, oh look new leadership in Israel, let’s look to the future.

The US has a lot of soft power it can deploy to make states vote the way it wants them too. Economic sanctions, withholding of foreign aid, pledges to intervene or stay out of other conflicts. I wouldn’t put it past the US telling Putin we will let you have Ukraine if you vote for the ICC to drop this..

@Kendodd the other way US has threatened the process is to impose economic and travel sanctions on the Karem Khan the prosecutor, his team and the ICC itself - tho' possibly don't have a sufficient majority in the US senate to do this

Israel have already imposed travel bans and refuse ICC investigators entry into Gaza

Yeah, if you are innocent and have nothing to hide, why do everything in your power to stop an investigation? To even stop journalists? (They banned Al Jazeera- only reputable international news outlet in Gaza- bombing their offices was done the first week of the war)

The very people that could prove your innocence you treat like an enemy.

I feel the outrage is masking a sense of guilt.

You would have thought that the leading advocate of rules based order would at least be considering the use of rendition to get Netanyahu to the Hague. Not !

A very bare and disingenous statement as well implying an equivalence which isn't there unless you choose to find it. One feels that this 'support' from Biden is through very gritted teeth indeed.Bibi won't be getting any friendhip visits from his ex mates anytime soon and if Trump gets back though and Bibi hangs on there maybe a reconciliation where he gets to choose his plot on the Mount of Olives and/or his escape if he ever needs a refuge himself.

Objecting to The killing of over 15000 innocent CHILDREN is antisemitic??? I don't think so.... its called having humanity. How anyone can imply not supporting innocent children being bombed and starved to death is due to a religious hatred is beyond me.... what would God say to his beautiful innocent children being slaughtered and maimed in this way?

Yes America picks and chooses based on its preferred foreign policy, who the good and bad ones are... putin bad, nethinahu good, despite the fact we are having to over rule him and air drop food because he won't allow any in which equals genocide...

Can I just say the antisemitic line has worked in this country for a long time, when it's come to criticism of isrealli government policy and in some cases was likely justified but when I comes to what is being done to these innocent civilians, it just will not wash. You can say it as many times as you like, I've worried many times over the years about having an opinion on isrealli policy many times over the years due to not wanting the label, but no more. A line has been crossed by the government of Isreal and as human beings we should all stand up and be counted. Children actual children are being shot bombed and starved to death and I will not live in fear of an unjustified label. I don't see you arguing that the arrest warrent for hamas is islamaphobia? That's because it isn't. Crimes are being committed and all should be held responsible on both sides

You can't just keep throwing that word around like this, it's not a weapon to beat people with. It's being thrown around so much regarding this issue and People are becoming immune to its true meaning. Antisemitism is a hatred of all Jewish people. The holocaust was a genocide and it is now being suggested with evidence that a genocide is taking place. Therefore the comment is not antisemitic. Stop this throwing it around like this to justify the unjustifiable.

Absolutely. The days of shutting down any criticism of the Israeli government by claiming it is anti semitic are long gone.

Why is anybody not surprised.

https://www.thejc.com/news/world/uns-gaza-war-crimes-investigator-has-anti-israel-history-kf4301qn

Wrong court ICC has nothing to do with the UN that's the ICJ

As Steve Bannon famously said ;

“The real opposition is the media. And the way to deal with them is to flood the zone with shit.”

That’s the Bannon business model: Flood the zone. Stink up the joint. As Jonathan Rauch once said, citing Bannon’s infamous quote, “This is not about persuasion: This is about disorientation.”

Just establishing that the ICC and ICJ are institutionally anti- Israel.

Dear me, one swallow does not make spring.

Drawing attention to some failure of the ICJ/UN does nothing to establish that the ICC is institutionally anti Israel

Major logic fail

The Article is about the UN Human Rights Council that will be overseeing the investigation of the 2014 Gaza war - Operation Protective Edge.

“Israel has sharply criticised the UN Human Rights Council’s new three-person panel tasked with investigating possible war crimes committed during Operation Protective Edge.“

https://www.amnesty.org.uk/gaza-operation-protective-edge

It has nothing to do with ICC or ICJ or even the current Gazan conflict.

It's been a bit of a theme this morning PP posting links without bothering to read/ digest them first so that they actually undermine/disprove their point

.

Well said Biden. Continue at your peril, Khan, Clooney et al.

"Biden said that Israel is not committing genocide in Gaza."

And reported in Al Jazeera so no accusations that it is cobblers if it was reported in the DM or DT.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/21/no-equivalence-biden-defends-israel-after-icc-requests-arrest-warrants#:~:text=In%20January%2C%20the%20ICJ%20ruled,genocidal%20acts%20from%20taking%20place.

Who said there is any equivalence? Bar maybe PP on the internet/Hamas IDK

The 2 sets of warrants to be requested were made at the same time - nowhere did the documents say - oh look here's another one, they're as bad as each other

It's a diversionary tactic not based in fact and their chosen 'line to take'

It's so effective, it's hard to believe it's an accident ....

Race card?
"It is and it is very much the same as "playing the race card" . This is racial anti-Semitism equivalence.

Are Jewish people a race ? No. Are Muslims a race? No.

They are religions.

Sounds anti-Semitic.

Racial anti-Semitism .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_antisemitism

"
Racial antisemitism is prejudice against Jews based on a belief or assertion that Jews constitute a distinct race that has inherent traits or characteristics that appear in some way abhorrent or inherently inferior or otherwise different from the traits or characteristics of the rest of a society."

"Biden said that Israel is not committing genocide in Gaza."

Well if Biden said so......Not sure why you think Biden's word holds much weight in a ICC investigation? He may be the President of the United States but he doesn't rule the world and chances are he won't be in post past Jan 2025 anyway.