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Conflict in the Middle East
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35
EasterIssland · 20/05/2024 16:25

will be Interesting to see what USA has to say. USA was trying to hold off so that Israel would agree to a ceasefire. As this hasn’t been agreed now hopefully it won’t block a future ceasefire deal.

it’s had not made any impact on putin as some have mentioned here.

but, in my opinion it’s good to see a countries leader been prosecuted for things that are war crimes. I think it sends a message to others : for defending your country you don’t have to starve and kill the population of another country.

EasterIssland · 20/05/2024 16:26

In case anyone wants to read what icc has said

https://www.icc-cpi.int/news/statement-icc-prosecutor-karim-aa-khan-kc-applications-arrest-warrants-situation-state

EasterIssland · 20/05/2024 16:40

EasterIssland · 20/05/2024 16:25

will be Interesting to see what USA has to say. USA was trying to hold off so that Israel would agree to a ceasefire. As this hasn’t been agreed now hopefully it won’t block a future ceasefire deal.

it’s had not made any impact on putin as some have mentioned here.

but, in my opinion it’s good to see a countries leader been prosecuted for things that are war crimes. I think it sends a message to others : for defending your country you don’t have to starve and kill the population of another country.

Just seen a USA senator is already threatening icc

https://x.com/LindseyGrahamSC/status/1792535545249165506

mactire · 20/05/2024 16:44

Glad to see Netanyahu tagged as what he is. I doubt it will have an effect on any of them - from either side - but the messaging is powerful.

Dulra · 20/05/2024 16:46

This reply has been deleted

Removed for repeating deleted post

Dulra · 20/05/2024 16:48

EasterIssland · 20/05/2024 16:40

Just seen a USA senator is already threatening icc

https://x.com/LindseyGrahamSC/status/1792535545249165506

Lindsey Graham 🙄

Auvergne63 · 20/05/2024 16:51

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:25

OhMaria2 · 20/05/2024 14:33

Everything like terrorism is bad but not as bad as genocide, ethnic cleansing and forced famines?

You mean in the Sudan:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw4dk2kzy5wo

The only genocide in Israel was the attack BY Hamas on innocent Jews.

Israel continues to dismantle the Hamas battalions whom use their civilians as human shields.

A boy sits atop a hill overlooking a refugee camp near the Chad-Sudan border, November 9, 2023

Sudan conflict: Possible genocide committed in Darfur, HRW says

The RSF is accused of committing ethnic cleansing against Massalit and other non-Arab communities.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw4dk2kzy5wo

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:26

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

The ICC is anti-Semitic.

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:29

Dulra · 20/05/2024 16:48

Lindsey Graham 🙄

Very well said:

This outrageous decision is truly a slap in the face to the independent judiciary in Israel, which is renowned for their independence.

We must not forget as a nation the International Criminal Court threatened to bring action against American forces in Afghanistan – and we are a non-member.

I will be issuing a detailed statement regarding the outrageous actions by the ICC against the State of Israel and I will feverishly work with colleagues on both sides of the aisle in both chambers to levy damning sanctions against the ICC.

However, these are my initial thoughts.

Most importantly, I want the world to know that I, along with my Republican and Democrat colleagues, and members of the Administration engaged the ICC on this issue weeks ago.

We were told there would be discussions with Israel before any actions were taken. We stressed that the principle of “complementarity” should be applied in this case. Complementarity requires the ICC to let the nation in question’s legal system move first before any action is taken by the Court.

Prosecutor Khan’s team was supposed to be in Israel today to arrange a meeting for next week with the prosecutor’s office about the allegations. I was told by ICC staff that the investigation would likely take months and not weeks, and that there would be meaningful consultation with the State of Israel.

Instead of the ICC following through with scheduled consultations with Israel, they announced the warrants.

I feel that I was lied to and that my colleagues were lied to. Prosecutor Khan is drunk with self-importance and has done a lot of damage to the peace process and to the ability to find a way forward.

Lying prosecutors never bring about just outcomes.

Auvergne63 · 20/05/2024 17:47

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:26

The ICC is anti-Semitic.

Of course it is. Care to provide evidence to back up your claim?

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:59

Auvergne63 · 20/05/2024 17:47

Of course it is. Care to provide evidence to back up your claim?

So glad you agree.

Polka83 · 20/05/2024 18:03

Dulra · 20/05/2024 16:48

Lindsey Graham 🙄

This is the same senator who said that the IDF should use an atomic bomb in Gaza.

Auvergne63 · 20/05/2024 18:11

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:59

So glad you agree.

Evidence, please.

Mummy2024 · 20/05/2024 18:12

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 13:38

No chance mate. Your hopes will be dashed.

Very notable that you did not mention getting the Hamas leaders. Tells us everything.

They should all be locked up, both sides. 35000 civilian deaths in gaza with over half of them innocent children in months not years. 1200 innocent young isrealli people slaughtered in broad day light.

They been bombed and starved to actual death for an atrocitie they did not commit. Its genocide on both sides and we need a better system than this icc rubbish.

This should be stopped today, demanded by every country in the world. Stop or we will stop you, both sides.

OhMaria2 · 20/05/2024 18:34

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

gloriagloria · 20/05/2024 19:14

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:29

Very well said:

This outrageous decision is truly a slap in the face to the independent judiciary in Israel, which is renowned for their independence.

We must not forget as a nation the International Criminal Court threatened to bring action against American forces in Afghanistan – and we are a non-member.

I will be issuing a detailed statement regarding the outrageous actions by the ICC against the State of Israel and I will feverishly work with colleagues on both sides of the aisle in both chambers to levy damning sanctions against the ICC.

However, these are my initial thoughts.

Most importantly, I want the world to know that I, along with my Republican and Democrat colleagues, and members of the Administration engaged the ICC on this issue weeks ago.

We were told there would be discussions with Israel before any actions were taken. We stressed that the principle of “complementarity” should be applied in this case. Complementarity requires the ICC to let the nation in question’s legal system move first before any action is taken by the Court.

Prosecutor Khan’s team was supposed to be in Israel today to arrange a meeting for next week with the prosecutor’s office about the allegations. I was told by ICC staff that the investigation would likely take months and not weeks, and that there would be meaningful consultation with the State of Israel.

Instead of the ICC following through with scheduled consultations with Israel, they announced the warrants.

I feel that I was lied to and that my colleagues were lied to. Prosecutor Khan is drunk with self-importance and has done a lot of damage to the peace process and to the ability to find a way forward.

Lying prosecutors never bring about just outcomes.

I totally understand the wish to defend Israel's right to existence and to defend itself. And horror at 7/10. But can you really not see that criticism of what the Israeli government is doing now is rooted in genuine belief that it is morally and legally wrong, not antisemitism?

HelenHen · 20/05/2024 19:17

This is wonderful news. Hopefully it will be a wake up call for Israel to stop the genocide. Most countries will support the ICC, and Biden should be very careful with how he responds. We all know he has no choice but to support Israel, but it's time for that unconditional support to come to an end. He cannot belittle international justice in his unwavering support of Israel

TheFirmBiscuit · 20/05/2024 19:24

I doubt that there will be any trial involving Israel, more likely that the ICC will be dissolved and restructured to stop Western leaders being prosecuted again .
Western leaders will stand with Israel on this issue.

This was the Putin charge which was rightly and widely supported.

Mr Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin, born on 7 October 1952, President of the Russian Federation, is allegedly responsible for the war crime of unlawful deportation of population (children) and that of unlawful transfer of population (children) from occupied areas of Ukraine to the Russian Federation (under articles 8(2)(a)(vii) and 8(2)(b)(viii) of the Rome Statute). The crimes were allegedly committed in Ukrainian occupied territory at least from 24 February 2022. There are reasonable grounds to believe that Mr Putin bears individual criminal responsibility for the aforementioned crimes, (i) for having committed the acts directly, jointly with others and/or through others (article 25(3)(a) of the Rome Statute), and (ii) for his failure to exercise control properly over civilian and military subordinates who committed the acts, or allowed for their commission, and who were under his effective authority and control, pursuant to superior responsibility (article 28(b) of the Rome Statute

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 19:27

gloriagloria · 20/05/2024 19:14

I totally understand the wish to defend Israel's right to existence and to defend itself. And horror at 7/10. But can you really not see that criticism of what the Israeli government is doing now is rooted in genuine belief that it is morally and legally wrong, not antisemitism?

No I don't. It is rooted in anti-Semitism. Plain and simple.

EmeraldsAreForever · 20/05/2024 19:28

"This should be stopped today, demanded by every country in the world. Stop or we will stop you, both sides."

@Mummy2024 what exactly does "we will stop you" look like to you? How would it happen?

TakeMe2Insanity · 20/05/2024 19:28

keenforhelp · 20/05/2024 17:25

You mean in the Sudan:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cw4dk2kzy5wo

The only genocide in Israel was the attack BY Hamas on innocent Jews.

Israel continues to dismantle the Hamas battalions whom use their civilians as human shields.

35000 Palestinians dead and that’s not a genocide in your mind? They are trapped with nowhere to go, no food, no water, no healthcare, no education. If they leave they lose their right to return. They are being systematically eradicated but that is still not enough of a genocide for you. So typical of some posters.

Dulra · 20/05/2024 19:31

TheFirmBiscuit · 20/05/2024 19:24

I doubt that there will be any trial involving Israel, more likely that the ICC will be dissolved and restructured to stop Western leaders being prosecuted again .
Western leaders will stand with Israel on this issue.

This was the Putin charge which was rightly and widely supported.

Mr Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin, born on 7 October 1952, President of the Russian Federation, is allegedly responsible for the war crime of unlawful deportation of population (children) and that of unlawful transfer of population (children) from occupied areas of Ukraine to the Russian Federation (under articles 8(2)(a)(vii) and 8(2)(b)(viii) of the Rome Statute). The crimes were allegedly committed in Ukrainian occupied territory at least from 24 February 2022. There are reasonable grounds to believe that Mr Putin bears individual criminal responsibility for the aforementioned crimes, (i) for having committed the acts directly, jointly with others and/or through others (article 25(3)(a) of the Rome Statute), and (ii) for his failure to exercise control properly over civilian and military subordinates who committed the acts, or allowed for their commission, and who were under his effective authority and control, pursuant to superior responsibility (article 28(b) of the Rome Statute

the ICC will be dissolved and restructured to stop Western leaders being prosecuted again. Western leaders will stand with Israel on this issue.

And with it all credibility will be dissolved. They'll be rightly told where to go when they try and preach to and work with other developing nations about human rights. Western governments support for Israel is already having a negative impact on equality and human rights work.

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