I can't do this anymore

[Auvergne63]

Firstly, I am sorry if this is in the wrong thread because I am not Muslim.
I can't bear what is happening in Gaza.
Why is there so much hatred towards the Palestinians?
How can people justify what is happening?
I have marched, written to my MP and donated but I don't know what else to do.
I am not religious so praying is not an option.
What else can I do?

Did my post really deserve this response.

I wasn't talking about you? I was talking about posts I have seen on mumsnet over the past 6 months. You said that you think mumsnet is 'overwhelmingly pro Palestinian' I was explaining the things I have seen on mumsnet that are not part of the conversation in Ireland, that once I don't look at mumsnet I don't have to see or hear.

It is so, so hard to see the hatred and the disinterest towards what Palestinians are going through. And so hard to even create a space to talk about it without people jumping in to say how terrible other terrible things are, or that it's their own fault for letting Hamas exist, or that Muslims are evil, etc etc.

It's so hard to find any hope when children are being shot by snipers, families wiped out by AI-targeted missiles, people are being starved...

What keeps me going is a belief that it is always right to stand up and be counted when people are being oppressed. It may not make a difference today, but small acts today can help create bigger changes in the future. And one thing we can do today, for that future, is bear witness to what is being done to innocent people. Part of the aim of oppression is to silence victims and erase them from the world. It's our job to make sure the voices of the innocent are not silenced.

(And yes, before anyone goes "but what about xyz?", I've also been and continue to be active in other human rights concerns, I just don't tend to talk about them on this board because that would be off-topic)

Mumsnet has a large number of posters...of course you will hear a variety of opinions. In real life it's quite unlikely that you'd be discussing something with so many people at once. But generally I think this board in particular is more pro Palestinian than pro Israel

I've seen and experienced horrible Islamophobia and seen people denying and even praising the actions of the IDF and the Israeli government, all on this site. I really don't think users are particularly pro-Palestinian or supportive of Muslims.

I don't think it is disinterest but there is little that most people can do about it. A good friend of mine has literally lost her mind over this conflict and on one hand it is admirable but on the other she is using it almost as a way to check out of her own life and is becoming a kind of mental breakdown.

Sometimes its better to switch off even for a few days and focus on your own life then you can come back to it and be able to do useful practical things rather than just lose your mind over a war you can't actually change.

I'm on Irish forums with a large number of Irish posters too. It is very, very different to mumsnet, there are no excuses, there is no dehumanising, there is no talk of 'human shields'. Do you really think our taoiseach(prime minister) would say that the Irish people are 'repulsed' by Netanyahu and that our government would be intervening in South Africas genocide case, looking at recognising Palestine etc if the overwhelming majority of people didn't agree?

I think it's only natural that Irish people feel more sympathy for the Palestinian cause as they can clearly still remember the brutality of their own history. there are a lot of parallels here. it's easy to forget how Irish people were seen as subhuman not too long ago in the uk.
we also see support for palestinians from other nations who have similar histories of colonial or racial oppression.

Totally agree.

You are right, regarding taking a break from social media.
Going to Ireland is definitively on my bucket list!

as they can clearly still remember the brutality of their own history. there are a lot of parallels here.
And famine which many Irish people consider was a genocide

exactly. it WAS genocide. I recently read a few bits about the Irish famines and had to stop because of how awful it was. it should be compulsory teaching in schools in the UK.

the bengal famine which killed around 2 million people in the last century was also due to the brits (they diverted and stock piled food for the army while the farmers who had grown the rice starved. they even turned away ships of aid sent by other countries)

There is no point in teaching this in schools, unless they are going to be honest about Britain's involvement in what happened. It is like just teaching about how the British abolished slavery, while conveniently not mentioning how much wealth was created for this Country, including Royalty, and how they benefited from free labour of slaves. Tell the whole truth. The "famine" in Ireland, was caused by the British taking all the crops, to feed themselves, and leaving the Irish people to starve.

Ireland is militarily neutral and is not involved in the arms trade- it has no vested interest in supporting Israel at a strategic geopolitical or economic level. Culturally the country is Christian The official Roman Catholic Church has distorted and abused these values and been pretty much abandoned. But the vast majority of the population believe that people are created equally, that we should feed the hungry, care for the sick and imprisoned, give people water, not kill etc etc Basic humanitarian values not unique to Ireland but definitely not what we’re seeing applied to Gaza. These values are part of our national identity. We condemn the Hamas atrocities and want to see the hostages freed, but it’s clear this can’t be done militarily. We find the slaughter in Gaza abhorrent. It is offensive to our moral compass as a nation.
Irish people understand the complexity of how peace and dialogue work. We find it frustrating that Israel keeps doing the same thing over and over and expects different outcome.The “what do you expect us to do argument” is irksome
There is also a huge diaspora and an outward looking aspect, with much intermarriage with non Irish. For instance, in our family we have an English Jewish cousin and one whose work involves preparing Iranian opposition for democracy
Anyway @Auvergne63 , I think some the debate over the last few hours was very close to a personal attack. Some of the individuals involved seem close to the victims of the 7/10 or have family in Israel so I assume hurting a lot. Take care💐

Acknowledge your pain, take a break, come back stronger and don’t give up.

It seems the hostages have been forgotten, its devastating. To think of the barbarity of the attack on 7 october is unbearable. To think that the horror of this situation would not have happened if Hamas had released the hostages rather than continuosly rejecting deals for their release. And ordinary civilians in Gaza pay the horrendous price.

And civilians in Israel too. As @PurpleChrayn said in parts of Israel they too are under constant fire, though their government chose to protect them by building air defence systems & shelters while hamas built tunnels for themselves, but not civilians.

What a nasty tone deaf post. Israel have killed thousands of innocent children, displaced 2 million and is currently starving a population and all you can respond is to suggest the Israeli government are great to protect their own citizens. Shame they have zero regard for others.

As you well know, the only reason more Israelis haven't been killed isn't because of lack of trying from the likes of Hamas, Hezbollah and other terrorists in the region. They just haven't been as successful as they would've liked to be. It's ok to admit that while also mourning the dead innocent civilian Palestinians, as well as the injured and displaced. You don't need to minimise Israeli suffering in order to feel for Palestinians.

How is it nasty to mention Israelis when discussing the civilians who are suffering in this war? I find that really odd - and revealing. The post immediately above referring to Palestinian civilians was also me. I do think its pertinent when discussing impact on civilians to point out that Israeli casualties are far lower because of decusions they have made. Hamas could have done a lot more with the billions in aid it has received over the years. It committed a grotesque act of war, knowing exactly what would happen (though I suspect over estimating how much help they would get from Iran) & did nothing to protect its citizens. I do desperately wish for Palestinians to be free - free of Hamas & free of the ideologically motivated & racist agents who use them to get at Israel but actually don't really care about them, or about peace.

@Humdingerydoo @SharonEllis

You don't need to minimise Israeli suffering in order to feel for Palestinians.

Whether intentional or not that is exactly what I thought you were doing in relation to Palestinians which is why I responded the way I did.

How is it nasty to mention Israelis when discussing the civilians who are suffering in this war?
It's not nasty but it was the way it was done which I found nasty and tone deaf, in effect blaming Palestinians for their situation

I do desperately wish for Palestinians to be free - free of Hamas & free of the ideologically motivated & racist agents who use them to get at Israel but actually don't really care about them, or about peace.

@SharonEllis I agree with what you’ve said above but I would also add that in order for there to be any lasting peace, they also need to be free from the appalling way they have been treated by Israel over the past decades. There is institutionalised racism and dehumanisation in the way they have been treated by the Israeli government, the IDF and the far-right civilians (ie the settlers) that needs to stop.

Thank you.

I agree.

Might I suggest that you go back & read what I said? which was not what you heard.