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Conflict in the Middle East

IDF fixation with looting Palestinian women’s underwear

113 replies

Prrambulate · 04/03/2024 19:48

Can someone explain this disturbing phenomenon?

OP posts:
SpryAmberSeal · 07/03/2024 17:30

Pennina · 07/03/2024 17:18

That is absolutely not true, many babies were killed. One was even ripped from their mother's stomach and shot in front of her. Hamas filmed these things, and there are witnesses, and physical evidence. Of course someone will say the Israeli's made it up next. You'll just say what you want so no matter.

It is true. Israel aren't even saying that that is true anymore. It is well reported at this point. The youngest victim was 10-month-old Mila Cohen, shot and killed at Kibbutz Beeri.

Pennina · 07/03/2024 17:44

EasterIssland · 07/03/2024 17:22

There is more and more reports about how Zaka spread lies in order to financially benefit.

Absolute rubbish

EasterIssland · 07/03/2024 18:07

Pennina · 07/03/2024 17:44

Absolute rubbish

Do you have proof that what some Zaka members said weren’t lies ? Even Israel news talk about some 7/10 misinformation so not sure why you’d categorise that as rubbish but each to their own

Silence1 · 28/03/2024 12:23

Reuters have run an article on this today. IDF usual response

Israeli soldiers play with Gaza women's underwear in online posts | Reuters

ScrollingLeaves · 28/03/2024 13:03

Prrambulate · 04/03/2024 19:48

Can someone explain this disturbing phenomenon?

I think the reason will be to jeer and at Palestinian men. This will be not just underwear to Palestinians but all that is private and sacred. Distance abuse.

(Hope the underwear is not trophies from actual abuse but just taunting and banter suggesting it.)

ScrollingLeaves · 28/03/2024 13:16

EasterIssland · 07/03/2024 14:51

Do you know the whereabouts of the women whose knickers have been nicked by the idf??

theyre probably

  1. Arrested (illegally)
  2. Displaced in minimum conditions
  3. Killed

don’t think any of the options is desirable to be honest

Suffocating under rubble.

Have a limb missing.

Be burying their child.

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 09:39

I intensely dislike this behavior from some of the IDF soldiers. It's dishonourable, and I am of a mindset that no matter what is done to you, you should never stoop below a level of dignity.

That said, they watched their women, bleeding from their vaginas, loaded into cars and taken as prisoners where they are possibly (even likely) to be being raped. They also watched their women left murdered, with their underwear removed and their nude vaginas exposed, burned to a crisp. They also watched their women, dead, limbs bent unnaturally and paraded on the back of a truck while the crowd of Gazans cheered and spat on the corpse.

So, well...perspective.

Hoppinggreen · 03/04/2024 09:48

IF the images are genuine its just more of the Israeli dehumanisation of Palestinians.
They obviously learned lessons in the 30's (and before) about dehumanising a race/nation to make it easier to exterminate them.

EasterIssland · 03/04/2024 09:54

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 09:39

I intensely dislike this behavior from some of the IDF soldiers. It's dishonourable, and I am of a mindset that no matter what is done to you, you should never stoop below a level of dignity.

That said, they watched their women, bleeding from their vaginas, loaded into cars and taken as prisoners where they are possibly (even likely) to be being raped. They also watched their women left murdered, with their underwear removed and their nude vaginas exposed, burned to a crisp. They also watched their women, dead, limbs bent unnaturally and paraded on the back of a truck while the crowd of Gazans cheered and spat on the corpse.

So, well...perspective.

Have they also seen Palestinian girls being murdered ? And without limbs? And orphaned? And have they seen the women they’ve raped ?

btw I don’t think eye for eye works. One thing doesn’t make the other one right

Hoppinggreen · 03/04/2024 09:54

TwigletsAndRadishes · 07/03/2024 14:45

Presumably because of what Hamas did to Jewish women last October.

Exactly. As a comparison, I really can't get very worked up about Israeli soldiers larking about in a Palestinian woman's bra.

Yeah, but it’s not Hamas underwear, is it? It belongs to innocent Palestinian women who Israel has decided are going to pay the price, along with all the other innocent civilians.

And the women who were stripped, raped, shot and stabbed in the vagina, murdered, then paraded through the streets naked on the back of trucks, to the delight of baying Palestinian mobs were just innocent Israeli women, whom Hamas had decided should pay a price. The babies who had their throats cut were just innocent babies whom Hamas decided should pay a price.

Given the choice, would you rather be one of the Israeli woman raped and killed by Hamas on 7/10, or one of the Palestinian women having her underwear nicked by the IDF?

You seem to be saying that because a small number of Palestianian men treated some Israeli women very very badly (which I utterly condemn) then the IDF have carte blanche to do what they want to any Palestinian women?
Its that "they started it" attitude that means the wordl just watched as over 30000 Palestinians were killed by Israel and now more are being starved to death while dying of perfectly treatable things if they had access to medical care.
Israel WAS provoked but their actions now have gone beyind fighting back and are closer to genocide

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 10:52

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Hoppinggreen · 03/04/2024 11:17

There is also no equivalence in killing a few hundred people and genocide.
Are we saying that if a small group from any nation commits atrocities than that whole nation deserves to be wiped out?

EasterIssland · 03/04/2024 11:32

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to be honest I’d rather be a twit than be happy with 30k killed and 70k injured just because it’s a war.

EasterIssland · 03/04/2024 11:49

@LemonyTicket I hope you’re as outraged of those things as about the innocent civilians deaths in West Bank where there not a war going on but where people are being killed.

Kuji · 03/04/2024 11:53

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 09:39

I intensely dislike this behavior from some of the IDF soldiers. It's dishonourable, and I am of a mindset that no matter what is done to you, you should never stoop below a level of dignity.

That said, they watched their women, bleeding from their vaginas, loaded into cars and taken as prisoners where they are possibly (even likely) to be being raped. They also watched their women left murdered, with their underwear removed and their nude vaginas exposed, burned to a crisp. They also watched their women, dead, limbs bent unnaturally and paraded on the back of a truck while the crowd of Gazans cheered and spat on the corpse.

So, well...perspective.

so you’re “against it” but yet still manage to make excuses for it. Shameful!

Pancakee · 03/04/2024 11:57

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The Hamas attack in October wasn't exactly starting it.
Israel has created a pressure cooker.
These are not guys who have grown up a leafy British suburb.
IDF has murdered Palestinian children playing in their own garden for years and years. You must know that.

HeidiInTheBigCity · 03/04/2024 12:14

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You are absolutely right - there is no equivalence whatsoever!

For Israelis, armed men entering their homes happened exactly once - for Palestinians that is just pretty normal!

Israelis are utterly horrified at the notion that their fellow citizens could be taken captive. Whereas for Palestinians, some ~25% of men will, at some point, end up imprisoned and often brutally tortured - either held with no charges at all or convicted by military kangaroo courts with a 99% conviction rate!

Israelis stare at pictures of destroyed homes in complete shock - while seemingly having absolutely zero awareness that home demolitions are "par for the course" for the Palestinians whom they occupy!

Israelis believe that ~1200 dead Israelis, thereof some ~700 civilians, give them the right to flatten an entire strip of land, kill, maim, injure, rape, torture, and abduct tens of thousands of people while starving and thirsting out more than 2 million!

"Normal" for Israelis is that they get to have happy-clappy dance parties in the immediate vicinity of an open-air prison where their government and army keep 2 million people in an economic and military stranglehold!

Israeli "normal" is getting to pretend that "there was a ceasefire on 6 October" - because only Palestinians were being killed and abducted, only their villages terrorised by fanatics with assault rifles, only their homes destroyed!

Israeli "normal" is being top-dog in a depraved, morally corrupt Apartheid system and having come to expect that this can simply be ignored and will never have any repercussions!

So, no, there is no equivalence at all! 7 October was a shock event and everyone condemned it! Israel brutalising Palestinians is "just normal" - and its supporters expect everyone else to just accept this and say nice things about Israel!

Kuji · 03/04/2024 12:27

HeidiInTheBigCity · 03/04/2024 12:14

You are absolutely right - there is no equivalence whatsoever!

For Israelis, armed men entering their homes happened exactly once - for Palestinians that is just pretty normal!

Israelis are utterly horrified at the notion that their fellow citizens could be taken captive. Whereas for Palestinians, some ~25% of men will, at some point, end up imprisoned and often brutally tortured - either held with no charges at all or convicted by military kangaroo courts with a 99% conviction rate!

Israelis stare at pictures of destroyed homes in complete shock - while seemingly having absolutely zero awareness that home demolitions are "par for the course" for the Palestinians whom they occupy!

Israelis believe that ~1200 dead Israelis, thereof some ~700 civilians, give them the right to flatten an entire strip of land, kill, maim, injure, rape, torture, and abduct tens of thousands of people while starving and thirsting out more than 2 million!

"Normal" for Israelis is that they get to have happy-clappy dance parties in the immediate vicinity of an open-air prison where their government and army keep 2 million people in an economic and military stranglehold!

Israeli "normal" is getting to pretend that "there was a ceasefire on 6 October" - because only Palestinians were being killed and abducted, only their villages terrorised by fanatics with assault rifles, only their homes destroyed!

Israeli "normal" is being top-dog in a depraved, morally corrupt Apartheid system and having come to expect that this can simply be ignored and will never have any repercussions!

So, no, there is no equivalence at all! 7 October was a shock event and everyone condemned it! Israel brutalising Palestinians is "just normal" - and its supporters expect everyone else to just accept this and say nice things about Israel!

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼

EasternEcho · 03/04/2024 12:37

This reply has been deleted

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If you think Israel hasn't been waging a war on Palestine for decades, then you are the twit.

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 13:16

@HeidiInTheBigCity

Let's play lies vs facts

For Israelis, armed men entering their homes happened exactly once - for Palestinians that is just pretty normal!
Israeli soldiers have entered homes in Gaza a total of ZERO times since disengagement. Zero. They were not allowed to set foot in Gaza for 18 years. So I doubt it was "pretty normal". 🙄

Israelis are utterly horrified at the notion that their fellow citizens could be taken captive. Whereas for Palestinians, some ~25% of men will, at some point, end up imprisoned and often brutally tortured - either held with no charges at all or convicted by military kangaroo courts with a 99% conviction rate!
Israel has a robust and transparent judiciary, and I have never seen evidence that a single innocent person has been held by Israel. I have seen several claims they have, which turned out to be garbage. Sadly, a lot of Palestinians are part of the "resistance" (ie: terrorists) and do bad stuff, like try and kill people. That is not being a hostage. There is also no evidence of prisoners being "brutally tortured". There is, however, ample evidence contained in the Amnesty annual human rights report of many people being imprisoned without trial by Hamas, for crimes such as "meeting with people to make peace with Israel" or "writing an unflattering article". They are indeed routinely tortured, with reports of needles being snuck down people's nails and screams that go on all night. These reports come from Palestinian prisoners THEMSELVES.

Israelis stare at pictures of destroyed homes in complete shock - while seemingly having absolutely zero awareness that home demolitions are "par for the course" for the Palestinians whom they occupy!
Again, Israel hasn't set foot in Gaza for 18 years. They have demolished zero homes. And they do not occupy Gaza. There was not a single, solitary Jew in Gaza on 7th October. What they do, is blockade Gaza, because Hamas tries to murder Jews. Egypt does the same, and they are also not occupying Gaza. Although when they DID actually occupy Gaza, as Jordan occupied the West Bank for 20 years lo and behold no one complained or tried to kill anyone. It's almost as if hating Jews is the real issue here...

Israelis believe that ~1200 dead Israelis, thereof some ~700 civilians, give them the right to flatten an entire strip of land, kill, maim, injure, rape, torture, and abduct tens of thousands of people while starving and thirsting out more than 2 million!
Israel, and the majority of the sensible international community, believe Israel has a right to stop the terrorist, genocidal maniacs who invaded Israel on 7th October and have vowed to do so again and again. This group overly, proudly, and with chest present an existential threat to Israel and like any other country on the face of earth it absolutely has a right to stop them. They did not choose to fight an enemy hiding in tunnels and hospitals, but that is the situation they were given. There is no evidence of rape, or torture according to the US government spokesman this morning. War is horrid and people die. Which is why the genocidal maniacs need to be stopped from fulfilling their promise to repeat 7.10 again and again. As for "starving out people", there is a record with the UN of every kilo of food aid that goes into Gaza, This averages 700g of food per day, per person (including babies). So that's almost 3x the amount the WFP stated was required for survival in the Congo for example. It's the equivalent of I guess two meals per person, per day. Plenty not to starve. The issue is that the food is not getting to all people. The WFP released a report last week which said this was caused by threat of looting, which was almost guaranteed. Sadly, there are lots of people making it hard to get the food to people and as much as you clearly hate Israel the evidence does not support that they are starving people.

"Normal" for Israelis is that they get to have happy-clappy dance parties in the immediate vicinity of an open-air prison where their government and army keep 2 million people in an economic and military stranglehold!
Yes! Israelis are very free to have dance parties. I am sorry if you find Israeli's enjoying life so upsetting. Gazans are free to have as many parties as they want. If they weren't led by Islamic extremists who don't allow alcohol or parties then I am sure they could have lovely music festivals. It's hardly Israel's fault if they decide not to do so. And it is not an "open air prison". It was a state with beautiful beaches, shopping malls, universities and filled with nice homes with luxury cars and swimming pools (albeit only for Hamas family and friends!) and all the latest iphones and nice clothes. The wealth gap is a sign of corruption, which is what happens when you live in a terrorist run dictatorship. Israel does not control movement of people in and out of Gaza, or it's money. Hamas does. To leave, you need a permit - which they made extremely expensive and hard to get unless......can you guess...yes! Unless you're a member of Hamas. Yes, those chaps get to come and go as they please! What Israel does do is say "hey, you people who say (and prove) you want to use every opportunity to kill us can't actually do that". Sorry, again, if that is upsetting.

Israeli "normal" is getting to pretend that "there was a ceasefire on 6 October" - because only Palestinians were being killed and abducted, only their villages terrorised by fanatics with assault rifles, only their homes destroyed!
Despite almost daily bombings and attacks from Hamas, more Israeli civilians were killed on 7/10 (deliberately) than were killed by Israeli forces in almost NINE YEARS previously. Your characterisation is objective nonsense. Palestinians are arrested, not abducted. The only people who abducted them, were Hamas themselves.

Israeli "normal" is being top-dog in a depraved, morally corrupt Apartheid system and having come to expect that this can simply be ignored and will never have any repercussions!
Err, no. Muslims conquered the entire area and made anyone who was not Muslim "dhimmi". This meant they were lesser under law. A dhimmi could not work in government, wear fancy clothes, testify against a Muslim in court, live in Muslim areas, work in the police, pray loudly, marry a Muslim, bear arms and they had to defer to their Muslim masters in the street. That is what apartheid is, and the independence of Israel ended that! Yay! Now Jews, Christians, Muslims and Druze all live in equality under law in Israel. They don't want to be "top dog", they just want to be left alone. I suspect it might be the mad buggers screaming for jihad and caliphas to be re-established that might be after being "top dog", but it sounds like you're just generally upset that Jews dared to not be dhimmi anymore (a common feeling)

So, no, there is no equivalence at all! 7 October was a shock event and everyone condemned it!
Nah, it wasn't a "shock event". It was planned for years. And no, not "everyone condemned it". People around the world and in Gaza cheered and openly celebrated it. In the UK itself there was a street party outside the Israeli embassy. A lot of people absolutely loved it and can't wait for round 2.

Israel brutalising Palestinians is "just normal" - and its supporters expect everyone else to just accept this and say nice things about Israel!
Israel being in conflict with Palestinians is "just normal". If Palestinians stopped trying to kill them, then there's room for peace. As is, very few actually want that. You've seen the polls I am sure and your eyes are open. There are very few Palestinians saying they want peace and security for BOTH Israel and Palestine. Most don't want that, they want destruction and death. They're pretty open about it. In that space, it's a bit tricky. Presumably that leaves not much room for peace, but certainly once Hamas are dismantled there will be room for more voices. As is, if you are Gazan and so much as MENTION peace with Israel, you are arrested, tortured and likely killed!

Abhannmor · 03/04/2024 15:35

If the British people had to pay this price for the crimes of their ruling class the place would be a desert now. The same applies to many nations. But in reality terrible things happen , peace is restored , lasting treaties are signed.

This invasion seems to have a different agenda. If Bibi was just interested in the welfare of the hostages he wouldn't be bombing the place back to the Stone Age.

HeidiInTheBigCity · 03/04/2024 20:00

LemonyTicket · 03/04/2024 13:16

@HeidiInTheBigCity

Let's play lies vs facts

For Israelis, armed men entering their homes happened exactly once - for Palestinians that is just pretty normal!
Israeli soldiers have entered homes in Gaza a total of ZERO times since disengagement. Zero. They were not allowed to set foot in Gaza for 18 years. So I doubt it was "pretty normal". 🙄

Israelis are utterly horrified at the notion that their fellow citizens could be taken captive. Whereas for Palestinians, some ~25% of men will, at some point, end up imprisoned and often brutally tortured - either held with no charges at all or convicted by military kangaroo courts with a 99% conviction rate!
Israel has a robust and transparent judiciary, and I have never seen evidence that a single innocent person has been held by Israel. I have seen several claims they have, which turned out to be garbage. Sadly, a lot of Palestinians are part of the "resistance" (ie: terrorists) and do bad stuff, like try and kill people. That is not being a hostage. There is also no evidence of prisoners being "brutally tortured". There is, however, ample evidence contained in the Amnesty annual human rights report of many people being imprisoned without trial by Hamas, for crimes such as "meeting with people to make peace with Israel" or "writing an unflattering article". They are indeed routinely tortured, with reports of needles being snuck down people's nails and screams that go on all night. These reports come from Palestinian prisoners THEMSELVES.

Israelis stare at pictures of destroyed homes in complete shock - while seemingly having absolutely zero awareness that home demolitions are "par for the course" for the Palestinians whom they occupy!
Again, Israel hasn't set foot in Gaza for 18 years. They have demolished zero homes. And they do not occupy Gaza. There was not a single, solitary Jew in Gaza on 7th October. What they do, is blockade Gaza, because Hamas tries to murder Jews. Egypt does the same, and they are also not occupying Gaza. Although when they DID actually occupy Gaza, as Jordan occupied the West Bank for 20 years lo and behold no one complained or tried to kill anyone. It's almost as if hating Jews is the real issue here...

Israelis believe that ~1200 dead Israelis, thereof some ~700 civilians, give them the right to flatten an entire strip of land, kill, maim, injure, rape, torture, and abduct tens of thousands of people while starving and thirsting out more than 2 million!
Israel, and the majority of the sensible international community, believe Israel has a right to stop the terrorist, genocidal maniacs who invaded Israel on 7th October and have vowed to do so again and again. This group overly, proudly, and with chest present an existential threat to Israel and like any other country on the face of earth it absolutely has a right to stop them. They did not choose to fight an enemy hiding in tunnels and hospitals, but that is the situation they were given. There is no evidence of rape, or torture according to the US government spokesman this morning. War is horrid and people die. Which is why the genocidal maniacs need to be stopped from fulfilling their promise to repeat 7.10 again and again. As for "starving out people", there is a record with the UN of every kilo of food aid that goes into Gaza, This averages 700g of food per day, per person (including babies). So that's almost 3x the amount the WFP stated was required for survival in the Congo for example. It's the equivalent of I guess two meals per person, per day. Plenty not to starve. The issue is that the food is not getting to all people. The WFP released a report last week which said this was caused by threat of looting, which was almost guaranteed. Sadly, there are lots of people making it hard to get the food to people and as much as you clearly hate Israel the evidence does not support that they are starving people.

"Normal" for Israelis is that they get to have happy-clappy dance parties in the immediate vicinity of an open-air prison where their government and army keep 2 million people in an economic and military stranglehold!
Yes! Israelis are very free to have dance parties. I am sorry if you find Israeli's enjoying life so upsetting. Gazans are free to have as many parties as they want. If they weren't led by Islamic extremists who don't allow alcohol or parties then I am sure they could have lovely music festivals. It's hardly Israel's fault if they decide not to do so. And it is not an "open air prison". It was a state with beautiful beaches, shopping malls, universities and filled with nice homes with luxury cars and swimming pools (albeit only for Hamas family and friends!) and all the latest iphones and nice clothes. The wealth gap is a sign of corruption, which is what happens when you live in a terrorist run dictatorship. Israel does not control movement of people in and out of Gaza, or it's money. Hamas does. To leave, you need a permit - which they made extremely expensive and hard to get unless......can you guess...yes! Unless you're a member of Hamas. Yes, those chaps get to come and go as they please! What Israel does do is say "hey, you people who say (and prove) you want to use every opportunity to kill us can't actually do that". Sorry, again, if that is upsetting.

Israeli "normal" is getting to pretend that "there was a ceasefire on 6 October" - because only Palestinians were being killed and abducted, only their villages terrorised by fanatics with assault rifles, only their homes destroyed!
Despite almost daily bombings and attacks from Hamas, more Israeli civilians were killed on 7/10 (deliberately) than were killed by Israeli forces in almost NINE YEARS previously. Your characterisation is objective nonsense. Palestinians are arrested, not abducted. The only people who abducted them, were Hamas themselves.

Israeli "normal" is being top-dog in a depraved, morally corrupt Apartheid system and having come to expect that this can simply be ignored and will never have any repercussions!
Err, no. Muslims conquered the entire area and made anyone who was not Muslim "dhimmi". This meant they were lesser under law. A dhimmi could not work in government, wear fancy clothes, testify against a Muslim in court, live in Muslim areas, work in the police, pray loudly, marry a Muslim, bear arms and they had to defer to their Muslim masters in the street. That is what apartheid is, and the independence of Israel ended that! Yay! Now Jews, Christians, Muslims and Druze all live in equality under law in Israel. They don't want to be "top dog", they just want to be left alone. I suspect it might be the mad buggers screaming for jihad and caliphas to be re-established that might be after being "top dog", but it sounds like you're just generally upset that Jews dared to not be dhimmi anymore (a common feeling)

So, no, there is no equivalence at all! 7 October was a shock event and everyone condemned it!
Nah, it wasn't a "shock event". It was planned for years. And no, not "everyone condemned it". People around the world and in Gaza cheered and openly celebrated it. In the UK itself there was a street party outside the Israeli embassy. A lot of people absolutely loved it and can't wait for round 2.

Israel brutalising Palestinians is "just normal" - and its supporters expect everyone else to just accept this and say nice things about Israel!
Israel being in conflict with Palestinians is "just normal". If Palestinians stopped trying to kill them, then there's room for peace. As is, very few actually want that. You've seen the polls I am sure and your eyes are open. There are very few Palestinians saying they want peace and security for BOTH Israel and Palestine. Most don't want that, they want destruction and death. They're pretty open about it. In that space, it's a bit tricky. Presumably that leaves not much room for peace, but certainly once Hamas are dismantled there will be room for more voices. As is, if you are Gazan and so much as MENTION peace with Israel, you are arrested, tortured and likely killed!

Mate! That was "one hell of a Guiness book attempt at a Gish Gallop", though!

I will, in fact, respond to it (not because I think I can change your mind but because your master class at "galloping" genuinely deserves credit for what it it - albeit not on substance!)

I will deal with this some time tomorrow or so!

stormy4319trevor · 03/04/2024 20:21

Well @HeidiInTheBigCity that is quite a task for you to address, but I agree it's impressive in its enthusiastic approach! Save the Children, Oxfam WHO etc. I suppose some of us were listening.