Israeli Eurovision: how low can you go?

[Redebs]

Israeli entry in Eurovision song contest is likely to be a song called 'October Rain' sung by trans-identifying 'Eden 'Golan'.

My previous thread was deleted for pointing this out.

Gunnersforthecup, no country is investigated for genocide unless the evidence presented is credible and raises serious concerns. Unfortunately fear is what generates genocide in many cases.

They have judged that it is plausible. That there is a case for Israel to answer. Even the USA is worried now about them breaking international law. Israel's behaviour has been utterly reprehensible IMO.

The actions of Hamas on 7/10 were also utterly reprehensible. However you are wrong about their stated objective. It's explicitly not the destruction of all Jews and their constitution states that they basically want a two state solution. That's the official line anyway, though not all members will agree clearly...

Would I agree that Hamas poses a risk of genocide if they had large volumes of powerful weapons/nukes - absolutely. But they don't. Risk of large scale terrorism - yes, but that's not genocide. They simply don't have the means (thankfully).

Israel on the other hand have the means, have leading politicians calling for the destruction of Gaza and have killed a large number of civilians in an area they have trapped them in. Many in areas they were told to go to by Israel for their own safety.

I'll call a spade a spade, and a genocide a genocide.

I’ve just read this and also about non binary flags being not being allowed.

this Years Eurovision will be remembered about anything but music

And @headstone

This is the statement of the ICJ president on misunderstanding of what has been ruled 'plausible'

it did NOT rule that the claim of genocide was plausible.

'I’m glad I have a chance to address that because the court’s test for deciding whether to impose measures uses the idea of plausibility. But the test is the plausibility of the rights that are asserted by the applicant, in this case South Africa” Donoghue told the BBC show HARDtalk.

“The court decided that the Palestinians had a plausible right to be protected from genocide and that South Africa had the right to present that claim in the court,” Donoghue said.
“It then looked at the facts as well. But it did not decide – and this is something where I’m correcting what’s often said in the media – it didn’t decide that the claim of genocide was plausible.”
“It did emphasise in the order that there was a risk of irreparable harm to the Palestinian right to be protected from genocide,” she continued.
“But the shorthand that often appears, which is that there’s a plausible case of genocide, isn’t what the court decided.”

I honestly can't be bothered to engage with genocide apologists any further.

Your view on the value and equality of human life is so far from mine, I don't think that's any point.

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear...

What on earth has Netanyahu got to do with a singing contest ?

Let's just chill out peeps....

More problems for ebu
this is from Finland

Maybe you think he is but what on earth has that to do with Eurovision?

The last I heard was that he wasn't competing. 🙄

That is interesting. From what I can understand of Hamas' constitution, it regards the land occupied by Israel as belonging by right to Islamic Palestine "from the river to the sea" Israel's is land is apparently considered a waqf, an inalienable possession of the Muslims.

It appears that there is a revised, less extreme version which might allow a 2 state solution, which was written around 2006 to make Hamas more widely appealing.

[From what I have read, various attempts actually to establish a 2 state solution were scuppered by extremists on both sides, basically.]

The original 9,000 word charter draws on a hadith, a prophetic saying "The Day of Judgement will not come till Muslims fight Jews and kill them. Then Jews will hide behind rocks and trees, and the rocks and trees will cry out" O Moslem, there is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him".

If this is behind Hamas thinking, it does help explain how threatening Israel finds it, especially in the context of the actual violence in October.

To be honest many of the comments in here have nothing to do with Eurovision either

This with bells on ^

But none of this argument helps the competitors who have spent months rehearsing and just want to sing.

You know nothing about my view on the value and equality of human life and I know nothing of yours. What you did was post something that was factually incorrect - and I pointed it out. You can't try and use the ICJ to further your position when you have misinterpreted the ICJ. Facts matter.

Portuguese broadcaster RTP confirmed moments ago in a live broadcast that Portugal was part of the emergency meeting with the EBU last night. Also confirms that the delegation saw the Israeli team harassing other contestants/delegation

https://twitter.com/tiagoserracunha/status/1789347022627102792

Just waiting for Eurovision

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@Babyboomtastic you have also stated that Hamas does not want to kill all Jews and wants a 2-state solution. However Ghazi Hamad, a member of Hamas's Political bureau, less than a month after 7 October said this on lebanese TV. This was published by MEMRI and the film clip widely available online:

“Israel is a country that has no place on our land. We must remove it because it constitutes a security, military and political catastrophe to the Arab and Islamic nation. We are not ashamed to say this.”

In the interview, Hamad said that Israel’s existence is “illogical” and that it must be wiped off all “Palestinian lands,” a term the terror group uses to mean the West Bank, Gaza and Israel, minus the Golan Heights.
When asked whether this meant the complete annihilation of Israel, Hamas replied: “Yes, of course.”

This is the definition of genocidal intent.

There is a lot of Islamophobia in Europe. I suspect we will see that reflected in votes.

Eh? How will that be reflected in the votes? 🥴

Lots of people/groups have genocidal intent. Thankfully they lack the means. That includes Hamas.

Israel (whose government and leader have made very similar comments to those above), have both the intent AND the means AND have at the very very least behaved in such a way that it's closest allies are concerned about their behaviour and death rate.

I'm more concerned with the genocide that is occurring than a theoretical one that could occur if a terrorist group were much better armed.

That you value theoretical saving of life over actual saving of life really says something about how much value you put on Palestinian lives.

@NotTerfNorCis ---- excellent victim blaming there

Guess

No, I can't. Unless you are suggesting France won't do well because their performer is Muslim? I hope he does well, he has an incredible voice. Not a fan of the song, possibly because I don't understand it I guess, but no one can deny he can sing!

(I had to Google to even find out if there were any Muslim performers tonight, so it's possible I missed some!)

He tweeted his suport of Eden and said that they'd 'won already' by being there.

Tactical voting. I've seen and heard multiple cases of people who identify politically and culturally along Tommy Robinson/'Green and pleasant land/Anti-Muslim lines, getting all excited about "we've never watched Eurovision but we're going to vote for Israel to stick it to the [offensive term]".

Because of course, that's what will really upset Palestinians and Muslims in general. Not actual human suffering, but who wins a singing competition.

Who wins Eurovision means nothing in terms of actual issues in the Middle East. It's just a singing competition in the EBU and it's a shame that it's been so politicised this year.