Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Conflict in the Middle East
Thread gallery
45
Auvergne63 · 12/02/2024 18:24

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 14:11

I merely suggest you give up making up your own narratives based solely on your obvious bias. That's all. Stick to facts instead of fiction going forward.

Kettle and pot comes to mind.

Silence1 · 12/02/2024 18:39

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 15:47

Why would you think I wouldn't share the truth?! My whole point is I want the truth to be shared, not all these baseless accusations flying around.

https://www.businessinsider.com/former-associated-press-editor-suggests-hamas-in-gaza-city-building-2021-5

Freidman who served in the IDF, was a disgruntled ex AP employee and was quoting a military source.

Hind and all the other children murdered, mutilated and effectively being tortured everyday by an out of control vengeful state.
US nuclear weapons returning to the UK , Trump gets in and ramps up the USA warmongering with Netanyahu and the other Israeli Govt lunatics. Target on our backs when the UK public do not support this. It's a disaster waiting to happen and our Govt should not be supporting this plausible probable genocide.

ConnieCounter · 12/02/2024 18:40

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 17:59

In the example given above, yes I believe that those who interpret it as some sort of threat do so because they don't think Israel can ever do anything right or acceptable. There was no threat there, veiled or otherwise. They were just saying they won't be able to keep them safe as they'll be in an active war zone where terrorists are known to hide behind civilians both figuratively and literally, so everywhere is at risk of becoming legitimate military targets.

They can't guarantee their safety because Israel is bombing media targets. Your screenshot says that!

Every warzone is dangerous but media manages to enter and report. But not every warzone has an occupying force bombing media and civilian targets. That's the difference.

@Auvergne63 is correct. There's no point talking to you. Your own source contradicts your point and you're still arguing. I give up.

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 19:01

ConnieCounter · 12/02/2024 18:40

They can't guarantee their safety because Israel is bombing media targets. Your screenshot says that!

Every warzone is dangerous but media manages to enter and report. But not every warzone has an occupying force bombing media and civilian targets. That's the difference.

@Auvergne63 is correct. There's no point talking to you. Your own source contradicts your point and you're still arguing. I give up.

Yes, buildings containing press offices have been bombed. That's not the same as the press offices being targeted because they're press offices.

Anyway, more than happy not to continue this entirely fruitless discussion where all I've been trying to say is to stop making assumptions. It seems to be an important thing for a lot of you to be allowed to continue with though so you just keep doing that. Who needs the truth anyway, eh? It's so overrated.

FOJN · 12/02/2024 19:14

stomachameleon · 12/02/2024 14:54

I doubt they would have waited 126 days if targeted approach was able to happen from the get go.

If Hamas continue to manipulate, hide and use civilians in spite of being instructed to hand back over the hostages what choice does Israel have?

Because if they do nothing then Netanyahu doesn't care?
And if they try and get them then they are causing causalities.

For whatever reason some people will be going along with hiding and preventing hostages from being released. It is them that put their own people under risk of being killed. No country would just stand back and do nothing. We still have no confirmation (verified) that kfir Bibas is dead? Or the rest of his family? Noa who was raped and pulled by her hair into Gaza? Hersch with his arm blown off.

Of course targeted response is better but if there is no where else than rafah holds the key to the hostages and they have a duty to return them.

126 days ago the IDF would have had more intel about Hamas activities than they do now because until Oct 7th they had the means to surveil every square inch of Gaza and of course it's hard to locate specific addresses when all you've left is piles of rubble. They would have had more opportunities for targeted operations not fewer when they decided levelling Gaza and murdering civilians was a good idea.

Literally every military expert was screaming Stalingrad when the bombing raids started, the IDF have made their job of finding Hamas and the hostages harder.

The tunnel network is still functioning and the IDF have left northern Gaza, the hostages who aren't killed by the IDF will just be moved to somewhere the IDF are no longer operating.

I suspect the people housing the hostages aren't given much of a choice. The IDF are putting the hostages at risk, intentionally so. Dead hostages are not an asset to Hamas so they have an interest in keeping them alive.

Hamas took hostages and continue to hide them because they want leverage. Like it or not they have objectives. Israel can continue to kill civilians and probably the hostages or they can negotiate. Netanyahu won't negotiate because the hostages are as much collateral damage as the Palestinians are. At least now he has an excuse to ethnically cleanse Gaza and as a bonus it keeps him out of jail, for the moment. It's a win win for him whilst everyone else suffers.

ConnieCounter · 12/02/2024 19:23

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 19:01

Yes, buildings containing press offices have been bombed. That's not the same as the press offices being targeted because they're press offices.

Anyway, more than happy not to continue this entirely fruitless discussion where all I've been trying to say is to stop making assumptions. It seems to be an important thing for a lot of you to be allowed to continue with though so you just keep doing that. Who needs the truth anyway, eh? It's so overrated.

Sorry, truth? The truth is that Israel has banned journalists from entering. That's all we need to know.

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 19:34

ConnieCounter · 12/02/2024 19:23

Sorry, truth? The truth is that Israel has banned journalists from entering. That's all we need to know.

Yes sure. That is fact. The claims earlier about the reason for journalists being banned - not fact. That's all I've been trying to say. I'm glad we're finally on the same page 👍🏻

ConnieCounter · 12/02/2024 19:47

Humdingerydoo · 12/02/2024 19:34

Yes sure. That is fact. The claims earlier about the reason for journalists being banned - not fact. That's all I've been trying to say. I'm glad we're finally on the same page 👍🏻

Yes, we can look at other evidence, like 85 journalists murdered to figure out the rest 👍

stomachameleon · 12/02/2024 19:50

@FOJN there is a lot of supposition in your post.

Rangelife · 12/02/2024 21:17

I am curious why the IDF targeted and killed every drone operator in Gaza if they weren't trying to suppress the documenting of what is happening on the ground? I'm also curious how many times, when they target a journalist or a drone operator they seem to take out the car or the ambulance - they send targeted and specific devices if they have a suspect, as discussed here:

https://www.fdd.org/analysis/op_eds/2024/01/27/new-tools-of-war-how-the-idf-uses-drones-to-fight-hamas-in-gaza/

So, why drop bombs on entire buildings if they can operate in this way? They estimate they have killed 9k Hamas fighters. So out of the conservative estimate of 25k dead they are operating at a 16k civilian to 9k fighters death rate? What? It makes no sense that they are then selling this as 'getting rid of Hamas'. It's not factual as they are in fact obliterating more civilians than the enemy. Also, if they are bombing tunnels why the hell are they bombing graveyards? There can't be tunnels under graveyards?

PeasfullPerson · 12/02/2024 21:28

I think given the context surrounding the message that journalists couldn’t be kept safe, it is reasonable to suspect that there may be a different intention to those words than their literal meaning. I don’t think that it is biased to say that (or that anyone who says that must think Israel is evil), I think it is based on evidence regarding journalists safety, and visibility of the tactics that are being used to control the narrative.

FOJN · 13/02/2024 00:02

stomachameleon · 12/02/2024 19:50

@FOJN there is a lot of supposition in your post.

Possibly supposition but also logical, I was responding to your post which started with "I doubt".

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 06:42

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3QbcpOtzxc/?igsh=OHV3NHJ5bGhrazVo Destruction in the so-called safe zone of Rafah

Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3QbcpOtzxc?igsh=OHV3NHJ5bGhrazVo

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 06:45

It has been reported that Israeli Occupation has killed two hostages and injured eight others due to their bombing campaign.

Which is why it has been stated that the campaign in Palestine is not about getting any hostages back

This is the reality of what Israeli is doing.
BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 06:48

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3QZ4M7Nes1/?igsh=dWRtbm5obGc1OWlx Occupation shoots a Palestinian man and stands around watching on as he bleeds ~ the usual

Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3QZ4M7Nes1?igsh=dWRtbm5obGc1OWlx

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 13/02/2024 07:03

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 06:45

It has been reported that Israeli Occupation has killed two hostages and injured eight others due to their bombing campaign.

Which is why it has been stated that the campaign in Palestine is not about getting any hostages back

It is obvious that Israel doesn't care about the hostages. ☹️

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:03

@Silence1 "Hind and all the other children murdered, mutilated and effectively being tortured everyday by an out of control vengeful state."

You think IDF is torturing children? Oh boy !

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:05

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 06:48

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3QZ4M7Nes1/?igsh=dWRtbm5obGc1OWlx Occupation shoots a Palestinian man and stands around watching on as he bleeds ~ the usual

I can't see any blood.

The red you can see is a red t-shirt.

Some really creative journalism here !

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 07:23

10UsernamesNotAvailableTryAnotherOne · 13/02/2024 07:03

It is obvious that Israel doesn't care about the hostages. ☹️

Exactly (which is terrible) but it is so blatant yet some still seem to believe it is about the hostages.

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 07:26

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:05

I can't see any blood.

The red you can see is a red t-shirt.

Some really creative journalism here !

Really? I don't even have my glasses on but I can clearly see the blood on the ground by legs... oh well, no dount he will be soon accused of being "Hamas" given the usual reaction from some

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 07:27

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:03

@Silence1 "Hind and all the other children murdered, mutilated and effectively being tortured everyday by an out of control vengeful state."

You think IDF is torturing children? Oh boy !

Oh boy.... despite the numerous reports some still refuse to open their eyes

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:28
  1. Children may throw stones but how are IDF to know they aren't throwing hand grenades?

2."The Israeli Foreign Ministry said it had responded to a report by the U.N. children's agency UNICEF in March on ill-treatment of Palestinian minors and questioned whether the U.N. committee's investigation covered new ground.
"If someone simply wants to magnify their political bias and political bashing of Israel not based on a new report, on work on the ground, but simply recycling old stuff, there is no importance in that," spokesman Yigal Palmor said.
The report by the U.N. Committee on the Rights of the Child acknowledged Israel's national security concerns and noted that children on both sides of the conflict continue to be killed and wounded, but that more casualties are Palestinian."

3.These are allegations. What investigations have been done?

4.See 1, In response to the section claiming: “Many protesters threw rocks or other projectiles but were posing no threat to the lives of well-protected Israeli soldiers when they were shot,” Laufer said : “This thinking both excuses violence, while creating a baseless standard that prevents Israeli forces from protecting themselves and others.”

5.That link is behind a paywall.

Blackkittypoo · 13/02/2024 07:34

BackandForthRoundandRound · 13/02/2024 07:26

Really? I don't even have my glasses on but I can clearly see the blood on the ground by legs... oh well, no dount he will be soon accused of being "Hamas" given the usual reaction from some

Well I can't see it.
You've obviously never been in a casualty dept.
If the guy was ' bleeding out' all those soldiers would be paddling in blood. In addition, the 'casualty' would have lost consciousness in the time that clip was running. People can bleed out in 2 mins without medical attention.

As I said 'creative journalism'.

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.