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Conflict in the Middle East
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Dulra · 21/04/2024 15:50

@Scirocco thanks for challenging them it was an extremely distasteful comment and thankfully has been deleted. I have challenged this poster before on their victim blaming. I guess it's the only way they can reconcile the atrocities the IDF are implicated in by blaming the victims for being bombed to death.

PeasfullPerson · 21/04/2024 16:20

Sorry for those of you who had to see a horrible post. It was gone by the time I got here so I can only make a guess at to what it said. Thankful to avoid it.

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 19:43

Dulra · 21/04/2024 15:50

@Scirocco thanks for challenging them it was an extremely distasteful comment and thankfully has been deleted. I have challenged this poster before on their victim blaming. I guess it's the only way they can reconcile the atrocities the IDF are implicated in by blaming the victims for being bombed to death.

It wasn't victim blaming. 30,000 hamas fighters at the time if 7th October and saying that Hamas don't care about Palestinian people would be viewed by many as a fair comment 🙄

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 19:45

PeasfullPerson · 21/04/2024 16:20

Sorry for those of you who had to see a horrible post. It was gone by the time I got here so I can only make a guess at to what it said. Thankful to avoid it.

If someone reports something it tends to go regardless. As many people wd say. Not allowed to call out terrorists and what their actions lead to

Dulra · 21/04/2024 20:14

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 19:43

It wasn't victim blaming. 30,000 hamas fighters at the time if 7th October and saying that Hamas don't care about Palestinian people would be viewed by many as a fair comment 🙄

Saying that Hamas don't care about Palestinian people would be viewed by many as a fair comment

That wasn't just what you said. Do you know that the children's father's are Hamas? Because you blamed their fathers for their deaths in your deleted post.

Can't believe you're trying to defend it after been told how much your comment upset people

Scirocco · 21/04/2024 20:44

@Factsareimportantplease

You have demonstrated an impressive lack of a) understanding of facts and b) basic human decency.

Actually, plenty of reported posts do not get removed - for example if moderators feel something doesn't breach site guidelines or is better challenged in the thread. Your post was not removed just because it was reported. It was removed because it was offensive.

Your post did not say Hamas do not care about the lives of Palestinian children - it said that Palestinian men didn't give a sh*t about their children and are to blame for their children's deaths.

That is an abhorrent thing to say. Tens of thousands of Palestinian men have lost loved ones, including children. Palestinian men are risking their lives to find food for their children and other dependents. Palestinian men are being executed for efforts to protect the sick and vulnerable. Palestinian men are not all Hamas, although the IDF's AI tech might work on that basis.

As I said previously, some of us here have loved ones who are Palestinian and/or who are in Palestine. The men we care about who are being killed in Gaza and the West Bank are not Hamas fighters, and they very much do care about their families and other vulnerable people. When you're trying to win your internet points or whatever it is you think you're achieving, all you're actually doing is slandering innocent people by a) suggesting they don't care about the people they're desperately trying to protect or whose deaths are tormenting them, and b) falsely conflating them with Hamas.

I suggest you either apologise for the pain you've caused to people unfortunate enough to have read your post, or if you can't do that, then at least take your false accusations and cruelty somewhere else so those of us whose loved ones you're slandering don't have to see it.

PeasfullPerson · 21/04/2024 21:23

Well said @Scirocco

Palestinian man =/= Hamas

And in the instance where men truly are Hamas, I don’t personally believe it means that children should have their lives taken away/limbs blown off because of it.

And I don’t find it easy to believe when the IDF reports they have taken out members of Hamas, because there have been too many instances in which members of the IDF have shown themselves to be incompetent, callous, fascist liars with a disregard for human life.

And I don’t trust the Israeli government to hold accountable those members of the IDF, because they have incited and allowed this behaviour.

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 21:25

Dulra · 21/04/2024 20:14

Saying that Hamas don't care about Palestinian people would be viewed by many as a fair comment

That wasn't just what you said. Do you know that the children's father's are Hamas? Because you blamed their fathers for their deaths in your deleted post.

Can't believe you're trying to defend it after been told how much your comment upset people

I'm not defensive, it's a fair comment. Where are the 30,000 hamas in Gaza. Have they no wife's or children. I mean seriously, the contortions people do to make out everyone in Gaza is innocent. It's frankly ridiculous.

EasterIssland · 21/04/2024 21:26

https://twitter.com/Lowkey0nline/status/1782008049240310159

These people deserve a hard death, an agonizing death. And instead, we see them enjoying the beach, having fun... We should have seen a lot more revenge, a lot more rivers of Gazans' blood."

Israeli journalist Yehuda Schlesinger on Israeli Channel 12.

https://twitter.com/Lowkey0nline/status/1782008049240310159

OP posts:
Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 21:33

So where are those men who spat at the body of murdered festival goers, and those who beat and kicked the hostages, faded back into gaza. We all saw them celebrating 7th October in their thousands. All innocent after cheering on hamas, back to bystanders again.

Complain again but the truth is online for all to see. If you find offensive that some Palestinian men joined in with 7th October, cheered, spat at bodies, beat hostages, then go complain, its factual.

Scirocco · 21/04/2024 21:37

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 21:25

I'm not defensive, it's a fair comment. Where are the 30,000 hamas in Gaza. Have they no wife's or children. I mean seriously, the contortions people do to make out everyone in Gaza is innocent. It's frankly ridiculous.

It wasn't what you said though.

What you said was a slander on the loved ones of posters here. What you said disrespected the memory of brave men who have died trying to protect their families and other vulnerable people, dismissed the pain and grief of bereaved parents, and falsely conflated Palestinian men and Hamas.

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 21:40

Scirocco · 21/04/2024 21:37

It wasn't what you said though.

What you said was a slander on the loved ones of posters here. What you said disrespected the memory of brave men who have died trying to protect their families and other vulnerable people, dismissed the pain and grief of bereaved parents, and falsely conflated Palestinian men and Hamas.

Some Palestinian men are hamas. 30,000 hamas in gaza alone. Many more cheering. They aren't cheering now. Hamas disgust me. They should disgust everyone, raping, abusing, torture, vile.

The idf soldiers that act in that way also disgust me.

There are a lot of guilty men in this war.

Scirocco · 21/04/2024 21:50

@Factsareimportantplease

Some Palestinian men are Hamas fighters. Some are not.

Some Palestinian men took part in violence on October 7th. Some did not.

Yet, you chose to accuse Palestinian men - Palestinian fathers - of not giving a sh*t about their children's lives. You did not say Hamas fighters, or Hamas leadership, or any other specific subgroup. You said that about Palestinian men.

On a forum where several posters, myself included, have been clear that our friends, colleagues and in some cases family are in Palestine. Either you didn't stop to consider that your words might be read by people who actually know and care about some Palestinian men, or you realised and chose to say it anyway. And then when it was called out, you didn't apologise or take on board what people said, you tried to deflect and misrepresent your previous words.

There are a lot of guilty men in war. There are also a lot of bereaved and innocent men, and a lot of dead innocent men.

Dulra · 21/04/2024 21:57

Factsareimportantplease · 21/04/2024 21:40

Some Palestinian men are hamas. 30,000 hamas in gaza alone. Many more cheering. They aren't cheering now. Hamas disgust me. They should disgust everyone, raping, abusing, torture, vile.

The idf soldiers that act in that way also disgust me.

There are a lot of guilty men in this war.

Some Palestinian men are hamas.
Agreed* *
Hamas disgust me.
Agreed
The idf soldiers that act in that way also disgust me.
Agreed

Not every man or father is Hamas so accusing fathers of being responsible for their children's deaths is extremely offensive as I'm sure you can understand

Limesodaagain · 21/04/2024 22:18

“Israeli strikes in Rafah kill 22 -mostly children “
Feargal Keane’s report on the news just now is completely completely heartbreaking.
I know I generally post about the marches because that is something I have experience of in London. But I am so horrified by what is happening in Gaza and those mothers and children are in my heart and prayers. Fathers too are bereaved and broken.

Cherryon · 22/04/2024 12:20

Some Palestinian men are hamas. 30,000 hamas in gaza alone.

According to IDF they have killed over 9,000 Hamas. The 30,000 was the high end of an estimate btw, no one knows exactly how many are Hamas. They estimate there are only 4 battalions left out of over twenty, so there aren’t that many in Gaza now.

However, it is a war crime to deliberately murder innocent relatives of Hamas members, especially children. Israel justifies such state sponsored murders of civilians as “allowable collateral damage” by ensuring to claim at least one of the dead bodies in any strike was Hamas or mistaken for Hamas (ie, the world kitchen mysterious gunman, the supposed terrorist drone operator that was a press photographer with a camera)

Imagine, if you will, the tables turned and Hamas rampaging through Israel. IDF falling back and defending block by block Tel Aviv. No Iron Dome and rockets raining down on schools, hospitals, synagogues.

Would it be ok for Hamas to deliberately kill the civilian relatives, even the children of IDF members because they are related to the armed enemy they are fighting? Of course not. And that isn’t because Hamas don’t have a special license to kill civilians like IDF does, but because there are supposed to be laws governing war that prohibit going to the level of killing your enemy’s wife/husband, children, brothers, sisters, parents, grandparents, cat, dog, donkey, olive trees and blowing up their home.

EasterIssland · 24/04/2024 07:54

.

Please do all you can to object to the genocide of Palestinians (Thread 2)
OP posts:
Kindatired · 24/04/2024 14:26

Here is a link to a fairly comprehensive list of Israeli goods offered in Ireland to boycott. Personally I’d rather choke on an Israeli orange than buy one while children are being deliberately starved.
A lot are available in the UK also
https://www.ipsc.ie/campaigns/consumer-boycott
I just don’t understand how people can sit down to a festive meal knowing that there are children 20km away.

Boycott Israeli Goods & Services - Ireland Palestine Solidarity Campaign

Individual consumers can show their opposition to Israel’s Apartheid policies against the Palestinian people and violations of international law by participating in a consumer boycott of Israeli goods and services. A boycott can also put pressure on co...

https://www.ipsc.ie/campaigns/consumer-boycott

Scirocco · 24/04/2024 14:51

@Kindatired I'm struggling with that thought too. It was hard to bring myself to do celebratory meals for Ramadan while thinking about people starving in Gaza. If I hadn't been doing it for DC, I probably wouldn't have. I wonder if there'll be a lot of people similarly putting on a celebration for their children to enjoy while hiding their distress inside...

EasterIssland · 24/04/2024 17:01

Kindatired · 24/04/2024 14:26

Here is a link to a fairly comprehensive list of Israeli goods offered in Ireland to boycott. Personally I’d rather choke on an Israeli orange than buy one while children are being deliberately starved.
A lot are available in the UK also
https://www.ipsc.ie/campaigns/consumer-boycott
I just don’t understand how people can sit down to a festive meal knowing that there are children 20km away.

Im from a land with loads of potatoes. The other day there was a picture from Spain’s biggest supermarket chain selling Israel potatoes. Yet the other day when I went to Waitrose I could buy Spanish potatoes. Why import from Israel when Spain produces potatoes to export ?

OP posts:
Finallyloggedin · 24/04/2024 17:50

Thank you @Kindatired , I am boycotting too.

Cherryon · 25/04/2024 03:58

I have been reflecting this Passover on how it commemorates my people marking our doors so that God’s avenging angels would pass over our homes. Passover commemorates both the hardship of the Egyptian slavery but also the fortitude in fighting for freedom and celebrating our liberation.

This year I have been considering the darker aspects to Passover. Moses called down death on every first born Egyptian of every generation (male or female) of all ages in their homes. This included the first born of the Pharoah, who was a child. It was the final and most brutal of the plagues Moses called down on the Egyptians as a desperate bid to gain freedom for the Israelites. Earlier plagues involved famine (locusts), poisoning the water supply, disease… but it was the overnight murder of his child and every first born in Egypt that finally convinced Pharoah to let the Israelites go free.

I know the Torah isn’t 100% historical, but there must be a foundational truth. I think it reflects a bloody struggle for liberation that included killing innocents, even Egyptian children. But that’s ok, we are taught as kids, because the Egyptians were the bad guys. I no longer think in such childish terms. I think it’s very dark and bloody, and that Moses terrorised the Egyptians to gain our freedom. No wonder Pharoah pursued us, he likely saw the freedom he was forced to grant as an unjust reward for terrorism and felt that his attempt at vengeful genocide on the lonely desert road north out of Egypt was justice.

Hamas murdered thousands of innocent Israelis in a bid for freedom for their people, they terrorised the entire country and have done so for decades. Oct 7th was the bloodiest massacre. In response, I feel like Nethanyu is attempting to do to the Palestinians the genocide that Pharoah tried to do to us thousands of years ago.

For me, this Passover is one of prayer for the death and destruction to end. To understand that terrorism is what a desperate and oppressed people do to try and gain freedom. That freedom is a right, and can never be a reward.

I believe that the land needs to be shared. Just as Israel deserves to exist, so does a modern Palestinian State.

In Antiquity, Judea was an autonomous Jewish kingdom living peacefully alongside Palestine. Gaza, within Palestine, was the premier centre of science and learning for the Eastern Mediterranean. It was a hub of commerce as the trade routes from India and the far east to the west went through Gaza, as did the ancient roads north and south between Egypt and the Near East. That era was one of great prosperity and peace for all the inhabitants of all religions and ethnicities (a lot more pagans then) and it can be so again.

But we cannot do any of this, until we all stop the war machine. A war machine that is threatening to engulf the entire region and dismantle the international laws put in place by the survivors of WWII to prevent what we are seeing unfold with increasing momentum from happening again.

DomPom47 · 25/04/2024 16:36

Wow - just wow! Students wanting peace and ceasefire and students questioning what is happening to Palestinians is antisemitism.
They have taken the word antisemitism and made it lose any meaning. Any questioning of Israel is now antisemitism.
Comparing these students who are challenging their governments support of Israel through arms used to kill innocent people is antisemitism and is compared to what the Nazis did in 1930s Germany.
Theyre doing anything and everything to stop people asking legitimate questions.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6KMiWcA1Yf/?igsh=MWlhYzJmMTRlM2Z6ZQ==
As I said just wow!

Instagram

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6KMiWcA1Yf/?igsh=MWlhYzJmMTRlM2Z6ZQ==

Dulra · 25/04/2024 16:59

DomPom47 · 25/04/2024 16:36

Wow - just wow! Students wanting peace and ceasefire and students questioning what is happening to Palestinians is antisemitism.
They have taken the word antisemitism and made it lose any meaning. Any questioning of Israel is now antisemitism.
Comparing these students who are challenging their governments support of Israel through arms used to kill innocent people is antisemitism and is compared to what the Nazis did in 1930s Germany.
Theyre doing anything and everything to stop people asking legitimate questions.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6KMiWcA1Yf/?igsh=MWlhYzJmMTRlM2Z6ZQ==
As I said just wow!

He lost the moral high ground a very very long time ago.

Some of the actions by protestors has been dreadful and definitely anti-semitic but the last thing American colleges need is Netanyahu getting involved, that will most definitely fuel the fire at a time when authorities are trying to de-escalate

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