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Conflict in the Middle East

Detainees, Truce and Agreements *title altered at OP's request*

971 replies

stormy4319trevor · 26/11/2023 15:49

Continuing broad discussion of the release of detainees, hostages and prisoners and the agreements around this.

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Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:04

Ahmed Manasra will not be released despite Amnesty International calling for this for years.
Simply because he is now an adult
His long terms spent in solitary confinement and continued mistreatment in jail has left him mentally incapacitated and despite this there is no compassion, no empathy and no true justice for him.

BabaBarrio · 28/11/2023 22:05

These are military courts too. They are not civilian secular courts. There is a difference. The laws and sentences are different. There is no jury. You are tried by a panel of 3 judges, two of whom are simply IDF officers with no legal background or qualifications. The use of military courts is an abuse.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/06/israel-military-courts-palestinians-law-uk

Israel's military courts for Palestinians are a stain on international justice | Sahar Francis

I’ve defended people in this profoundly discriminatory judicial system. It needs dismantling – and the UK can help, says Sahar Francis

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/06/israel-military-courts-palestinians-law-uk

Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:07

The victims. They did not self harm.

Naor Shalev Ben-Ezra, the 13-year-old boy from Jerusalem, survived the attack, after had been critically injured by the cousins while he was riding his bike. [8] The knife had pierced his subclavian artery, causing severe bleeding that field medics struggled to control. Initially presumed dead upon arrival at Mount Scopus, the Hadassah medical team, led by Dr. Yoachim Shiffman, identified signs of life. Dr. Shiffman manually controlled the bleeding by inserting his fingers into the artery for 15 minutes. Vascular surgeon Ina Akopnick, racing against time, performed a crucial operation to close the truncated artery, aided by Professor Achmed Eid, Director of General Surgery at Hadassah Medical Center, who opened the chest cavity for the procedure. His gradual awakening in intensive care marked the beginning of his recovery journey.[9]
Ben-Ezra's recovery was marked by significant celebration, attended by family, friends, Deputy Mayor of Jerusalem Meir Turgeman, media reporters, and David Dalfon, the first medical responder who played a crucial role in saving Ben-Ezra's life.[8]
After recovering physically from the stabbing attack, Ben-Ezra faced significant emotional and psychological struggles. Despite an impressive physical recovery, Naor felt isolated and misunderstood. He described feeling emotionally dead, saying, "You are not treated, you are dead." This emotional turmoil led to a rapid decline in his well-being. Naor began using drugs, gambling, accruing debts at a young age, and generally struggling to function. Over time, however, he managed to find his way back to a more stable life. He took up painting, found love, and got married.[10]
The adult victim, Yosef Ben-Shalom, also suffered serious injuries, including damage to the lung and liver

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:17

Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 21:59

What sort of ‘adults’ beat up children
Can we even imagine the mindset of these animals because I am really struggling with this

Ages ago I recommended Yoav Shanir's film 'Checkpoint' on one of these threads. He's an Israeli film maker who spent 2 years documenting interactions at checkpoints. There's no physical violence, but you can see the interactions with children, and how soldiers do not moderate their behaviour on account of their age.

OP posts:
EasterIssland · 28/11/2023 22:19

Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:07

The victims. They did not self harm.

Naor Shalev Ben-Ezra, the 13-year-old boy from Jerusalem, survived the attack, after had been critically injured by the cousins while he was riding his bike. [8] The knife had pierced his subclavian artery, causing severe bleeding that field medics struggled to control. Initially presumed dead upon arrival at Mount Scopus, the Hadassah medical team, led by Dr. Yoachim Shiffman, identified signs of life. Dr. Shiffman manually controlled the bleeding by inserting his fingers into the artery for 15 minutes. Vascular surgeon Ina Akopnick, racing against time, performed a crucial operation to close the truncated artery, aided by Professor Achmed Eid, Director of General Surgery at Hadassah Medical Center, who opened the chest cavity for the procedure. His gradual awakening in intensive care marked the beginning of his recovery journey.[9]
Ben-Ezra's recovery was marked by significant celebration, attended by family, friends, Deputy Mayor of Jerusalem Meir Turgeman, media reporters, and David Dalfon, the first medical responder who played a crucial role in saving Ben-Ezra's life.[8]
After recovering physically from the stabbing attack, Ben-Ezra faced significant emotional and psychological struggles. Despite an impressive physical recovery, Naor felt isolated and misunderstood. He described feeling emotionally dead, saying, "You are not treated, you are dead." This emotional turmoil led to a rapid decline in his well-being. Naor began using drugs, gambling, accruing debts at a young age, and generally struggling to function. Over time, however, he managed to find his way back to a more stable life. He took up painting, found love, and got married.[10]
The adult victim, Yosef Ben-Shalom, also suffered serious injuries, including damage to the lung and liver

They didn’t. But the person that they’re accusing to have done it hasn’t done it neither and has been. In jail for years

woukd you like to be in jail for a crime you’ve not committed and being tortured ?

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:19

@Pennina It is a tragic story, and it should never have happened. However, I think the point being made here is that another child's life was ruined and it was found by the Israeli courts that he had not participated in the stabbings.

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Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:19

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:17

Ages ago I recommended Yoav Shanir's film 'Checkpoint' on one of these threads. He's an Israeli film maker who spent 2 years documenting interactions at checkpoints. There's no physical violence, but you can see the interactions with children, and how soldiers do not moderate their behaviour on account of their age.

Thankyou.
Ill definitely have a look at that!

Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:21

Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:07

The victims. They did not self harm.

Naor Shalev Ben-Ezra, the 13-year-old boy from Jerusalem, survived the attack, after had been critically injured by the cousins while he was riding his bike. [8] The knife had pierced his subclavian artery, causing severe bleeding that field medics struggled to control. Initially presumed dead upon arrival at Mount Scopus, the Hadassah medical team, led by Dr. Yoachim Shiffman, identified signs of life. Dr. Shiffman manually controlled the bleeding by inserting his fingers into the artery for 15 minutes. Vascular surgeon Ina Akopnick, racing against time, performed a crucial operation to close the truncated artery, aided by Professor Achmed Eid, Director of General Surgery at Hadassah Medical Center, who opened the chest cavity for the procedure. His gradual awakening in intensive care marked the beginning of his recovery journey.[9]
Ben-Ezra's recovery was marked by significant celebration, attended by family, friends, Deputy Mayor of Jerusalem Meir Turgeman, media reporters, and David Dalfon, the first medical responder who played a crucial role in saving Ben-Ezra's life.[8]
After recovering physically from the stabbing attack, Ben-Ezra faced significant emotional and psychological struggles. Despite an impressive physical recovery, Naor felt isolated and misunderstood. He described feeling emotionally dead, saying, "You are not treated, you are dead." This emotional turmoil led to a rapid decline in his well-being. Naor began using drugs, gambling, accruing debts at a young age, and generally struggling to function. Over time, however, he managed to find his way back to a more stable life. He took up painting, found love, and got married.[10]
The adult victim, Yosef Ben-Shalom, also suffered serious injuries, including damage to the lung and liver

Please stop derailing this thread.
Thats the second time.
Most posters, now, have had the decency to move on!

Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:22

Being released
At least shes been allowed to smile

Detainees, Truce and Agreements  *title altered at OP's request*
stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:25

I actually think it's a beautifully shot film. Lots of close ups of children's faces, the barbed wire, the landscape. Towards the end a soldier will say 'we are the humans, they are the animals.' Despite that it also shows a human side of the IDF - bored young kids, who'd rather be swimming in the lake with their friends... @Readingallnight

Checkpoint Full Film- By Yoav Shamir

The Video is free here, but if you would like to support my work please consider watching it on my VOD: https://www.yoavshamirfilms.com/films Thanks!Documen...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrE88iYz5dM

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Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:25

@BabaBarrio
perhaps with the wider world learning of the injustice in the Israeli system of trial without…..well anything really……then maybe the ‘system’ will be brought to account.

Rachna83 · 28/11/2023 22:26

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:19

@Pennina It is a tragic story, and it should never have happened. However, I think the point being made here is that another child's life was ruined and it was found by the Israeli courts that he had not participated in the stabbings.

Thank you for that @stormy4319trevor
Yes the case highlights the mistreatment of Palestinians in jail and lack of a fair legal process.

Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:29

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:25

I actually think it's a beautifully shot film. Lots of close ups of children's faces, the barbed wire, the landscape. Towards the end a soldier will say 'we are the humans, they are the animals.' Despite that it also shows a human side of the IDF - bored young kids, who'd rather be swimming in the lake with their friends... @Readingallnight

Edited

My son is joining ...

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:31

@Pennina Do you mean your son is joining the IDF?

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Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:31

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:19

@Pennina It is a tragic story, and it should never have happened. However, I think the point being made here is that another child's life was ruined and it was found by the Israeli courts that he had not participated in the stabbings.

I hope both boys, now young men can find peace. If the Palestinian lad is innocent then I really hope he is released and can rebuild his life.

Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:31

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:31

@Pennina Do you mean your son is joining the IDF?

Yup

Struggggggling · 28/11/2023 22:33

@Pennina how do you feel about him joining?

stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:37

Oh @Pennina I'm not sure what to say. Stay on the thread if you want to. All welcome. But we are loosely focused on the thread title, so trying to stick to those topics.

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Pennina · 28/11/2023 22:38

Struggggggling · 28/11/2023 22:33

@Pennina how do you feel about him joining?

It will derail the thread and let's not do that. The thread about hostages and detainees, although I appreciate it's easy to drift off track. Maybe I'll update when he's joined (it would be next year)

Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:38

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Struggggggling · 28/11/2023 22:40

@Pennina @Readingallnight

That's fair, we can leave it, I was just shocked

Rachna83 · 28/11/2023 22:40

@Pennina
I don't think Ahmed Mansara has any hope of rebuilding his life sadly. I am however praying he will be freed and can be surrounded by his loved ones.

Stomacharmeleon · 28/11/2023 22:41

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Readingallnight · 28/11/2023 22:44

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stormy4319trevor · 28/11/2023 22:49

So the G has a bit on the 14 year old now. His name is Ahmad Salayme. He is quoted as having witnessed beatings in the prison. I haven't heard much about the other prisoners. Let's try to keep the thread on track, since that's what it's here for! Probably best to ignore something if it doesn't seem relevant, I'll try to be more focused as well.

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