March against antisemitism on Sunday

[SharonEllis]

1.30 pm Royal Courts of Justice to Parliament Square

Yep that was definitely an All Lives Matter comment.

Nice sentiment but for goodness sake

An investigation is underway after two men were subjected to antisemitic abuse in Edgware.

At around 16:40hrs on Saturday, 25 November, the men were walking along Manor Park Gardens when they were approached by two men who reportedly made antisemitic remarks and grabbed one of the men by the arm.

https://news.met.police.uk/news/appeal-after-two-men-subjected-to-antisemitic-abuse-475985

Just seen a letter sent home to parents of kids at a Jewish primary school (one of the ones that had red paint splashed over it's gates) that they will be taking one of the classes on an educational trip to a museum. They will be going on the underground but not to worry because they will have a security guard accompanying them....
That's the reality of a Jewish primary school in London.

According to @beachcitygirl / @Desertrose2023 there isn't a problem.
As long as the kids don't wave the flag of Israel, they will be fine.
Terrible situation that a primary school even have to contemplate this.

I know, I agree with you. The poster you were replying to is just utterly full of hate. It's not normal behaviour to come on a thread about antisemitism and start hating on Jews for other people not standing up for them. It's just bizarre. But then there have been rather a lot of bizarre comments on here, so not particularly surprising

You are contradicting yourself there my old girl.
You either empathise with bigotry or you don't.
The verbal onslaught, often physical against minorities, is down to those personally affected to determine its severity, not you; to suggest otherwise is obnoxious.
I don't think the kids at the primary school mentioned above are feeling much privilege.
My perspective is perfectly measured.

errm what? Sorry to disappoint you but I don’t “empathize with bigotry”. get over yourself.
I’ve given my perspective and you’ve given yours. we’ll need to agree to disagree and leave it there as I don’t see any point in either of us continuing a discussion.

. What I objected to was the hyperbolic and frankly tone deaf/insensitive language you used saying things like this march was finally a “glimmer of hope” for Jews and they had a “collective safe space” for the first time. In the context of what’s happening to the people of Gaza I believe everyone in the UK: muslim, Jewish, whatever - even those experiencing this heightened environment of increased hate speech - are in an extremely privileged position

I see what you’re saying. The people in Gaza (and the victims of Hamas) have suffered horrors we can’t even imagine. We are all privileged compared to them.

But I think a lot of people convinced themselves that the vocal anger directed at Israel and the marches in support of Palestine meant everyone was secretly antisemitic. The show of support on Sundays march may have reassured them that this is not actually the case.

I doubt 10 month old baby Kfir is feeling very privileged either. After being placed with another Palestinian group instead of being released.
While you are finding selective empathy, please remember your words were inappropriate on a thread about persecution.
Have a good day.

And its nothing new. All Jewish organisations in this country have long had to have heightened security. Its almost as if 'privelege' doesn't protect them.

Really???? Do you need me to list the names and ages of the 8000 Palestinian kids blown to bits in Gaza. I give up honestly. You’re the one that has selective empathy.
Have a good day and don’t tag me again.

You really need to sort that temper out.

Thank you, I appreciate that response.

Well put.

To be honest you can say this about absolutely any situation. There are all sorts of horrors and atrocities going on around the world...that doesn't mean people in the UK aren't allowed to express concern or fear regarding what's happening to them. It's like saying to someone in the UK visiting a food bank, well at least you're not living in a famine zone. There's always someone worse off than you.

In terms of being Jewish... please remember the Holocaust is in living memory for some and if it's not, it's in living memory of our family members. Surely you can see why Jews may feel unnerved by hostility?

So you are also outraged that a thread dedicated to a march against antisemitism spoke about hope and safe spaces?
I doubt it's my perspective that needs a reality check.

Not outraged no.

Sad that there were no placards or speeches asking for the war to stop/ceasefire/the killing of children though!

It was a march against antisemitism in Britain and to express solidarity with Jews here - who are not responsible for what is happening in the Middle East. There absolutely were speeches calling for peace - I guess you weren't there?

Just have a think about what you've just said there.

Well said.

You really need to sort that temper out

To be fair she has a point. There’s “selective empathy” on display in the various threads where only certain issues can be mentioned.

Off topic I know but on the thread about the hostages there is plenty of concern about the Israeli children who were held hostage but any mention of the abuses Palestinian children have suffered at the hands of the IDF is met with angry accusations of derailment because would you be talking about that? I find it a bit grim to be honest.

The reason she was being selective is that she was lecturing the rest of us about Gazans' fate. Moreover, getting more angry at the thought of my reference to a 10 month baby hostage, not a detainee, nor prisoner.
This is even more disconcerting that a thread promoting a stand against antisemitism finds itself attacked. There is much much reference and empathy to Palestinians in Gaza elsewhere on the board. None of us are so inhumane and cold.
This thread should be a safe space from attack. How on earth saying that Jewish people can feel hope from the march can lead to such an outburst, I do not know.
That is why I said she has a temper. That also applies to her sidekick.

The reason she was being selective is that she was lecturing the rest of us about Gazans' fate. Moreover, getting more angry at the thought of my reference to a 10 month baby hostage, not a detainee, nor prisoner

Obviously we all hope that baby makes it home safely.
However it seems that a lot of these detainees are not only minors but arrested on for throwing stones or held indefinitely without charge. They are often abused by the IDF while in custody or sent to kangaroo courts.
This is also worth discussing but as it has its own thread now I won’t go on about it endlessly here.

I do see that. I also understand how that kind of trauma can be multi generational. no one should be in a position where they feel targeted or unsafe, especially when they’ve suffered persecution like what happened in the holocaust.
what I find deeply unnerving though is despite that suffering the majority of Jewish posters on these threads appear to be either supportive or defensive of what Israel is doing (at least based on the comments ive seen). Appreciate not all and there have been some Jewish posters who are not supportive and have even spoken of their participation in ceasefire marches.
i find it personally very hard to reconcile some of the dismissive comments about the deaths of 8000 children and 15k civilians. Things like “that’s what happens in war” or making excuses for food, water, medicine being cut off etc, blaming it all on Hamas whilst ignoring the role of the Israeli occupation in the broader context. do you not think it’s hypocritical of these posters to call for sympathy and understanding for what Jewish people in the UK are currently experiencing re hate speech whilst simultaneously taking this supportive line with regard to the impact of Israel’s actions on Palestinians? On top of that the exhausting attempts to sweep aside any criticism as being necessarily founded in antisemitism as opposed to critical thought.