Israel has bombed the front of a hospital / 2

[Readingallnight]

Discussion re Israel’s bombing of hospitals, infrastructure and residential buildings

Take a look at standwithus on Instagram for the footage.

Honestly I’m actually flabbergasted at the wilful ignorance in a lot of the posts on these threads (although I shouldn’t be as the agenda is very clear), do people really think that after raping, and horrifically murdering over a thousand Israeli men, women and children, the caring, upstanding Palestinian government would rush some of them for medical treatment for their injuries? I mean seriously!

It’s clear hostages were taken to the Al Shifa hospital and it is obtuse in the extreme to think the medical staff wouldn’t have been well aware. Two have been found dead so far and they didn’t walk there themselves. I wouldn’t be surprised if the rest of them are found dead underground eventually. The Palestinian government released a few hoping we would believe that after their barbarism, that they kindly filmed for all the world to see, that they were treated kindly and a ceasefire would be forced to happen so they could regroup to continue their atrocities with impunity. That obviously hasn’t worked and I’m sure when the hostages are finally found, Israel will be blamed for their deaths.

It also seems to be forgotten that there was over a MONTH from Oct 7th to the IDF getting into this hospital. How much more notice did they need to give? Why in earth would weapons be left when they’re still using them?

The Palestinian government could have shared some of their stockpiled fuel to power the hospital instead of using them to fire more rockets? Why didn’t they instead of letting neonates die FFS!

Why is that on Israel?

Thanks but
I don’t have instagram Twitter etc. Al Jazeera has a video of part of the hospital burning.

@WilmaWonka
Your Paragraph 1
The Israeli Govn refused to test for rape even though the doctors had rape kits to carry that out.
The IDF are claiming the footage from cctv is of Hamas with hostages taken to the hospital, at least one on a stretcher. Clearly the IDF are showing the Palestinians brought them there to get treatment, If they are Hamas…we don’t know as yet due to conflicting reports by the IDF.

Para2
We do not know if the doctors and staff knew all Hamas operatives.
If the hostages are found and they are dead then it is inevitable Israel could be blamed especially if it is down to bombings, starvation or lack of medical supplies.

Para 3
Hospitals are protected in war. They should not be bombed or invaded. The Palestinian people, patients and staff should be safe there. They should not be forced out. This is a war crime.

Para 4
The fuel used for rockets is a type of fertiliser, it cannot be used to run electricity or babies incubators. That fuel wasn’t allowed to get to the hospitals .The Israeli Govn also shut all other power and communication sources.

Para 5
The Israeli Govn are committing war crimes, their invasion on the back of excuses that they are defending themselves has been criticised by Governments, the UN, WHO and academics and has been for many years.

Hopefully that clears up your tirade.
Would be happy to see independent evidence to the contrary
All of the above has already been discussed here or on the previous thread.

@Stomacharmeleon
I have just seen the guardian reporting this. Again take with a pinch of salt

The director of the Gaza health ministry has dismissed Israel’s claim that it found a Hamas tunnel at the al-Shifa Hospital, according to an Al Jazeera report.
Mounir el-Boursh described the claim as a “pure lie”, the report said.
The Israeli army had said on Sunday that its troops “exposed a 55-metre-long terror tunnel 10 metres deep” under the hospital complex, running under the hospital and ending at a blast door.
The military also published video footage that it said showed the first solid evidence of a sophisticated Hamas tunnel network under the hospital in Gaza City.
Hamas dismissed the footage. Agence France-Presse quoted senior political bureau member Izzat al-Rishq as saying it had repeatedly said it had taken several captives to hospital for treatment, “particularly because some had been wounded in airstrikes” by Israel.
His statement added:
We have released images of all that and the army spokesman is acting as if he has discovered something incredible.

@Parkingt111 thanks for the article/.

It just proves though that medical staff that were interviewed denying all knowledge of Hamas within their hospitals lied. None of them mentioned hostages. Whether it was a benevolent thing to do to treat them they should not have been there.... they are their prize I assume and better an alive one.

They blamed both deaths on people found in the complex on things the IDF dispute eg a panic attack of the elderly man.

And for another poster to say they aren't dressed like terrorists? How do they dress then? And denying again even in the face of Hamas' statements.

Also I believe there were five other hospitals on route to al shifa so you have to ask yourself why there?

And just before anyone says it...... I don't think it was because it was the best....

The prem babies who are suffering with a variety of infections are due to be moved to Egypt today after being assessed and treated at the Emirates hospital in Rafah

Attention is turning to the evacuation of the remaining critically ill patients at Al Shifa - 40 patients on dialysis and 29/40* patients with severe spinal injuries are hopefully going to be moved to other hospitals over the next few days

*seems to be some variation in the number

Here's a more detailed account for anyone who is interested

''In an update on the 31 premature babies evacuated from al-Shifa hospital in northern Gaza on Sunday, they are in “extremely critical condition”, health officials say.

The newborns had dehydration, hypothermia and sepsis in some cases, said Mohamed Zaqout, the director of Gaza hospitals. Four other babies died in the two days before the evacuation, Associated Press also quoted him as saying.

The babies from the hospital, where power was cut and supplies ran out while Israeli forces battled Palestinian militants outside, were receiving urgent care in the southern Gaza city of Rafah. Zaqout said preparations were under way for them to enter Egypt.

A World Health Organisation team that visited al-Shifa hospital said most of the remaining patients had amputations, burns or other trauma. Plans were being made to evacuate them in the coming days.

Guardian

UNICEF is also trying to identify the parents of the babies or their extended family members Fricker says, “Because we don’t want these children to be completely separated from their families.”

BBC

I saw that tweet with the map - seemed a strange conclusion to draw about the 5 hospitals which are clustered in central Gaza City

If there were 5 hospitals in a line with Al Shifa at one end and Israel at the the other maybe you'd have a point

The tunnel they built themselves? Too many lies from the Israeli government, they make BoJo look honest

I read on the BBC website that the hospital was built by Israelis and is has “an extensive basement complex” according to the architects records.
Maybe they just figured that would make a good place for a base and assumed Hamas were there?

@Stomacharmeleon in regards to were some of the hostages taken to hospital then as said Hamas say that we have told you that ourselves.

In regards to doctors not all of them were interviewed. If you have a look a look at the map of Al shifa it is huge. It's possible that some knew and its possible that some didn't but can you imagine it being on sky news that doctor so and so confirmed that a hostage was brought here for treatment. He and his family would now have two targets on their back. The IDF and Hamas. Remember Shani louk? Hamas said she was at a hospital. Although subtle the guardian article also mentions that the medical staff looked suprised at what was happening in the CCTV.

Did Hamas lie about the way the hostages died? I wouldn't put that past them if I'm honest. It could be part of the psychological war and its entirely possible that they didn't die due to the reasons they are claiming but rather use it as a tactic for pressure

The main reason given by the IDF behind the attack and subsequent evacuation was done on the basis that Hamas HQ is under Al shifa hospital which resulted in the death of many and the collapse of the hospital. Till now this has not been proven by the IDF despite being there for 8 days

@Efacsen the babies do seem very unwell. Praying they can be evacuated out of Gaza safely today

BBC is reporting that the Indonesian hospital is now being struck which has resulted in some deaths
Not verified but says 10 deaths

@Parkingt111 more barbarity. What else did we expect from IDF though? 💔😢

More baby news - only 28 babies mentioned maybe others not fit to travel

''As we just reported, 28 premature babies are on their way to the Rafah crossing, having been evacuated from al-Shifa hospital in the northern Gaza Strip.

The Egyptian minister of health is reportedly at the El Arish airport, around 30 miles from the Gaza border, as part of the team receiving the babies.''

BBC

I literally just read this
No reason given for the other three babies or whether they are still alive or not. Guardian is reporting from PRCS who I believe are carrying out the evacuation
Praying the other 28 manage to evacuate safely

I also appreciate everyone posting here and that those of us on both sides (I support Israel) do so. Talking is good. I suspect everyone on the thread has a similr aim - we want the truth. Truth, facts etc do exist; they are not just relative so usually the truth will out. We probably all on both sides on MN also all want peoples kept safe. We are united on a lot more things than we might think.

BBC verify has shown this image of Israeli tanks moving in at the indonesian hospital
This is the next attack on a hospital from the long list of hospitals that have already been attacked.

@Xenia I appreciate the sentiment of your post but the idea of taking "sides" is in itself divisive and part of the reason that we have come to this so I think you have to be careful when speaking about taking sides.

I support innocent civilians in both Israel and Palestine. I support full human rights for Palestinians and Israelis. I support all civilians in having free speech, full human rights and respect.

It's reported there are approximately 700 people in the hospital which includes medical staff. This cannot become the new normal in Gaza in this war.
The attack on Gazas health care infrastructure needs to stop, it has already been pushed down on its knees. If it continues then thousands more will die from their injuries as Israel continues to bomb within civilian areas which has now increased in the south significantly.
This is inhumane
We need to use our voices CEASEFIRE NOW!
this madness has to stop

Are International communities and their Governments becoming immune to attacks on hospitals and schools.
The Indonesian Government has not even condemned the attack on the hospital and the Israeli Government and IDF hasn’t even bothered to explain why they are attacking.
At Al-shifa they desperately try to justify the assault claiming Hamas use it as a base. What about the other hospitals and schools what justification do they seek for those bombings.
People trying to leave the Indonesian hospital are being shot and the Kuwait UN school was burned down overnight whilst sheltering hundreds of people.

Are people forgetting the Palestinians plight………is everyone becoming immune to it?!

Why only 28 out of 31 premature babies have been transferred to Egypt
Ethar Shalaby
BBC Arabic

I have been speaking to Dr Mohamed Salama who is head of the neo-natal unit at al-Ahli Emirates hospital, where the 31 premature babies were taken after being evacuated from al-Shifa.

“Some parents arrived yesterday at al-Ahli Emirates hospital to identify their babies”, he says, “We asked them to sign a consent form so that their babies will be sent to receive treatment in Egypt.

"We have one baby who is unidentified and his parents are unknown. He is still here with us. The decision to keep him was taken by the Gaza health ministry as his condition is stable and does not need to be moved for treatment.

"Two babies, their parents refused to send them out due to personal circumstances."

Dr Salama says that three babies are in a stable condition.

BBC

Whilst negotiations for the release of hostages on both sides, (women and children ) the Israeli Government are negotiating the death penalty for Palestinian fighters. Something they have not used since 1948 and the formation of Israel.

As they hold more than 10,000 hostages, more than half of which have been arrested since October 7th from their places of work in Israel and from the West Bank, what does this mean for these people.

For all those families whose loved ones are held by the Israeli Govn this must be a shocking development knowing that their family members could be executed by Israeli law. The discussions are ongoing so we have, as yet, no idea of the outcome. Furthermore I wonder whether such a revelation could scupper hostage release negotiations