Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Conflict in the Middle East

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

After this there will be silence

508 replies

notsoready4school · 11/11/2023 10:13

Are we really just going to just let this happen. I was upset about the protest ban in France but at least he has finally spoken up. When is the UK going to finally say something and stop letting this happen in our name.

This is the moment we have been warning the whole world the Gaza Deputy Health Minister Dr. Youssef Abu Alreesh, currently inside al-Shifa Hospital as it is takes heavy fire from Israeli forces.
Here are his translated comments:

  • This is the moment we have been warning the whole world of, all generators are off, all power sources are out.
  • We have 39 newborns in the incubators, those babies are fighting against death.
  • No one is able to move around the compound, snipers are stationed all over the place in addition to the drones that target and kill any moving person.
  • A few minutes ago one of the engineering team was hit by a sniper, he was hit in the neck and was paralysed and he’s now about to die.
  • Part of the hospital was shelled and part of the building caught fire, we fear it will engulf the whole compound.
  • A few families tried to leave but they were targeted; now they are lying dead outside the hospital. We cannot get to them.
  • We are totally stranded, we are cut off from the outside world, and above all, we are left without any medical resources. We cannot even bury the dead.
  • Ferocious gunfire can be heard within the vicinity of the hospital, the intensive care unit received a mortar shell a few minutes ago.
  • Blood is everywhere, on the floor, we cannot even clean it.
  • In the past, the Israeli killing machine was killing and this was conveyed on TV screens. Now they are perpetrating the same killing but no one is listening, no one is watching, the whole world is standing by.
  • We are speaking with whatever is left of my phone battery, after that, we will be silent.
OP posts:
Thread gallery
27
Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 11:28

@HaveALaff since 1988?

SinnerBoy · 12/11/2023 11:37

They could stop firing rockets and stop using the hospital as a post to shoot at soldiers.... you know if they really cared about the babies.

Why do you keep repeating this propaganda uncritically? The Israeli Government comes out with this absolute bollocks every time they make war on Gaza and in 95% of cases, investigations show that they have zero truth.

When they bombed and dropped white phosphorus on UN shelters in one of their recent wars, they were adamant that Hamas were using it as a firing post.

Then backed down and said they were just hiding there, then that they were nearby, then that actually, no Hamas were anywhere near and shrugged.

It's what they do, like before, during and after the fact. They said that they would be attacking the hospitals before they began.

HiggleDyPigGeldy · 12/11/2023 11:37

All the pro war people on this thread are essentially trying to gaslight the world by saying it’s Hamas’s fault Gazans are being bombed by Israel.

I am 100% pro Israel bringing Hamas fighters to justice, but that is NOT the same as killing tens of thousands of civilians.

If you are an Israeli politician calling the shots today, if you are an Israeli commander giving the orders, if you are an Israeli reservist signing up to go kill babies in “defense” of your people… you are responsible for deep evil. Similar to the October 7th perpetrators but in many ways worse as you are doing it from a position of way more privilege and education than the Hamas terrorists who have little access to education, global networks, diplomatic tools, precision military technology, intelligence etc. You, and all those egging on the violence, are worse because you have access to so much resource that could enable you to do things differently if you actually thought Gazan lives mattered.

HiggleDyPigGeldy · 12/11/2023 11:42

And honestly, those here saying Hamas can start their own ceasefire - what utter nonsense.
They have asked for a ceasefire but civilians will only benefit from that if Israel is on board.
Civilians are being killed by the Israeli army bombing civilians and civilian infrastructure, not by Hamas. (However objectionable I find Hamas, we also need to call a cat a cat now - Israel’s government is no better)

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 11:43

@HiggleDyPigGeldy you mean poor thick Hamas...
Have you read about yahya sinwar... taught himself fluent Hebrew whilst in prison for murder.... got a gazan to bury his brother alive as he thought he was a collaborator. Killed another commander for suspected 'homosexual activity'

I think he might be offended by your stupid Hamas... they don't know better.

HiggleDyPigGeldy · 12/11/2023 11:45

@Stomacharmeleon I did not say “poor thick Hamas”.
It should have been clear from my post I was saying that Israel has more access than Hamas to MILITARY intelligence.
As for raw human intelligence, I don’t believe in inferior or superior nations / races / groups.

OneHurtSpaggettio · 12/11/2023 11:51

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 11:17

I stand by the fact if it's not easy to 'snuggle' or smuggle things in we know for a fact weapons and luxury items have gone in.... Hamas are picking priorities.

The article you quoted from the guardian says that Bibi said no... a source said.... because it was for 'some' hostages. I Don't think he has ever made a secret of the fact that he wants them all out. It makes things very difficult when you start picking and choosing....the elderly? Babies? Children under 5?

The hostages weren't brought to hospitals. Lifshitz said 'that each group had their own doctor and paramedic who administered medication' Not a 'hop, skip and jump' as that was what happened. She was there (have provided the article in case you accuse me of propaganda). The doctors were complicit. In the tunnels with the captives.

You know for a fact that items have been smuggled in since the 7th October? Where is the evidence? And how do you smuggle in enough food to keep 2.2bil people fed for months, I wonder?

I didn’t say that it was a ceasefire deal that Netanyahu wanted to accept, but I’m sure that if you had hostage family in Gaza who are currently being bombed and starved by their own government, that you might want a ceasefire if there is “some” chance that they would be released. The fact still remains that it was rejected.

Netanyahu doesn’t want to accept any deal because there billions of dollars are in Gaza:

https://unctad.org/news/unrealized-potential-palestinian-oil-and-gas-reserves

This article goes into it in a lot of detail:
https://www.planetcritical.com/p/everybody-wants-gazas-gas

“But while bombs rain down, business continues as usual, with Israel granting 12 licences to six companies to explore for natural gas off the country's Mediterranean coast on October 30th. This is the latest venture to exploit one of several gas fields discovered on the Mediterranean coast over recent decades, aiming to solve Israel’s energy dependency and, crucially, Europe’s supplies.

The total oil and gas reserves were valued at a staggering $524 billion in 2019. But Israel does not have sole legal entitlement to the $524 billion, according to a UN reportpublished in the same year. Not only is some of the $524 billion sourced from within the Occupied Territory of Palestine, much of the rest sits outside national borders in the deep sea, and thus should be shared with all relevant parties. The report questions the national right to these resources given they took millions of years to form—and that Palestinians occupied the whole territory until Israel’s recent formal creation.
….

Gas in Gaza
In 1999, BG Group (BGG) discovered a large gas field between 17 and 21 nautical miles off the coast of Gaza. According to the Oslo II accords, the Palestine National Authority has maritime jurisdiction up to 20 nautical miles off of Gaza’s coast. In November 1999, the PNA signed a 25-year contract for gas exploration with BGG.
The reserves were estimated at 1 trillion cubic feet and would meet Palestine’s demands and allow for exports. Ehud Barak, Israel’s Prime Minister at the time, approved authorisation for BGG to drill the first well in July 2000. They struck gas gold. Palestine and Israel began to negotiate and the deal was seen to benefit both Israeli demand and Palestinian supply.

However, a change in Israeli leadership soured the deal, with Ariel Sharon’s government allegedly driving the rejection of a supply deal between the Palestinian gas field and the state-owned Israel Electric Corporation. In May 2002, the UK’s then-PM, Tony Blair, got involved and Sharon agreed to negotiate an agreement for the annual supply of 0.05 trillion cubic feet of Palestinian gas for a period of 10 to 15 years.

However, he changed his mind in 2003 stating that the funds could be used to support terrorism.

Ehud Olmert’s government, spurred on by the new PM, agreed to reopen negotiations with BGG in April 2007. Starting 2009, Israel would purchase 0.05 trillion cubic feet of Palestinian gas for $4 billion annually, creating a good atmosphere for peace, it was argued.

However, the 2007 Battle of Gaza in which Hamas took control of the strip changed the deal once more, with Hamas looking to increase the original 10% Palestinian share in the BGG deal. An Israeli team of of negotiators was set up by the Government of Israel to formulate a deal with BGG, bypassing both the Palestinian government and PNA, effectively nullifying the contract signed in 1999 between BGG and PNA. However, in December 2007, BGG withdrew from negotiations with the Israeli government.

In June 2008, the Israeli government recontacted BGG to urgently renegotiate the deal. The UN report states: “The decision to speed up negotiations with BGG coincided, chronologically, with the planning of an Israeli military operation in Gaza, whereby it would appear that the Government of Israel wished to reach an agreement with BGG prior to the military operation, which was already in an advanced planning stage.”

Israel’s invasion of Gaza in December 2008 brought the Palestinian gas fields under Israeli control—without regard for international law. BGG has been dealing with the Israeli government ever since. The UN estimates billions of dollars in loss for the Palestinian people.”

———

Re: Lifschitz, it seems like those who are pro-Israeli government seem to believe her account as and when it suits them. Sometimes she’s made up how kind they were because she’s been fed a script, and other times she’s bang on the truth. Either way, if there are a couple of doctors tending to hostages then this still isn’t proof that the doctors know where the hostages are.

It’s not hard to transport doctors who are either blindfolded or transported in other ways where they cannot see the route. I’m not an expert in war strategy, but I doubt the location of the hostages is something Hamas would want known by anyone other than their highest in command and most trusted operatives. This would be an extremely basic precaution, as I’m sure there are a lot of Mossad in Gaza.

The unrealized potential of Palestinian oil and gas reserves

Geologists and resources economists have confirmed that the occupied Palestinian territory (oPt) lies above sizeable reservoirs of oil and natural gas wealth, in Area C of the West Bank and the Mediterranean coast off the Gaza Strip, according to a rec...

https://unctad.org/news/unrealized-potential-palestinian-oil-and-gas-reserves

Livinginanotherworld · 12/11/2023 11:57

queenofarles · 12/11/2023 09:43

All staff in the hospital have always known that hamas have their headquarters below the hospital
please do the faintest bit of research before spewing things you no nothing about ,
the hospital was built in three stages , first by the British , then Egyptians then Israelis in the 80s,
lots of Foreign Doctors like Mads Gilbert Worked there for years and know the place very well and said they’ve never seen anything suspicious , Sara Roy a professor at Harvard who lived in Gaza and Isreal wrote many thesis and Books about Gaza says it’s highly improbable,
yet the Israeli Army who didn’t see two Hamas Paragliding into Israel are all of sudden certain Hamas are hiding inside the hospital ?

And if they indeed had a tip off that members are within the vicinity , the tunnels are 500km long , and are probably changing locations very often . do you think after heavy fighting they’d still be in there ?

👏 👏 👏 100% this. There is no evidence for tunnel exits and entrances underneath the hospitals. Most entrances are in back street at the back of tiny shops and lock ups.

Livinginanotherworld · 12/11/2023 12:01

OuiOuiKitty · 12/11/2023 10:35

Just today, Israel is offering assistance to the Shifra hospital today to help it transport the babies in incubators. If the Israeli army was intent on genocide and targeting civilians this would not be happening.

Is this serious? A decent army wouldn't cut off power, destroy solar panels and generators for hospitals. A decent army wouldn't deny hospitals fuel for generators. A decent army would deny aid entry so that people are having to ha e amputations on the floor with no anaesthesia. A decent army wouldn't have snipers shooting nicu nurses as they do their job. A decent army wouldn't target ambulances and medical centres. Delicate babies shouldn't need to be moved, they should be safe in their incubators with their parents at their side and nurses able to freely move around and tend to them. They shouldn't be wrapped in blankets on a hospital floor with terrified staff afraid to move on case they get shot. If Israel do move them it will be for nothing but optics because babies dying in incubators makes them look as bad as they are.

Edited

This….they don’t need to move those poor babies, they just need to turn the power and water on, but they won’t get the propaganda coverage for that will they.

notsoready4school · 12/11/2023 12:05

This reply has been deleted

We have now removed this as it quotes a deleted post.

I agree these posts just highlight the brainwashing that lies behind this, it is you important for people to understand where the violence is stemming from so that they can be ‘woken’ from it.

It will be impossible to change it unless the world first realises where the thinking behind the ‘Palestinian babies deserve to die for the cause of getting Hamas’ comes from. It comes from hatred and brainwashing of overblown concepts of everyone hates you, no one will save you, only we can defend ourselves and it doesn’t matter that the rest of the world is saying we are wrong in what we are doing, it’s justified because remember they ALL hate us.

OP posts:
Jupitersstorm · 12/11/2023 12:09

OneHurtSpaggettio · 12/11/2023 01:22

Evacuate hundreds of critically injured and disfigured people, many of whom are in intensive care, as well as babies in incubators to where exactly? To one of the other hospitals getting bombed, or…? I would love to know.

“All staff in the hospital have always known that hamas have their headquarters below the hospital, they also know that the hostages including 30 babies are being held below the hospital.”

You’re just making things up as you go along. Multiple hospital staff have refuted the claim that Hamas are there. If they are there, then they’re unaware.

As for the bit about babies being held under the hospital, that is pure fiction. I love that you claim to know where the hostages are.

When was the last pause? Do you know that, too?

You seem to think that Hamas have forced Israel to do despicable things, as if Hamas are somehow now using telekinesis to force the IDF to blow up, maim and torture Palestinian children and babies as they die slowly under rubble. As if that isn’t a choice made by their far-right, terrorist government, that’s part of all the other monstrous decisions that they make.

The fact that you have been reading the news for the past month and think that the Israeli govt give a shit about hostages says a lot. Thousands protesting in Israel disagree with you.
@eardefender

Are you responding to me or Onand who posted the post you disagreed with?
Try and make your points without veiled insults like" says a lot."

Parkingt111 · 12/11/2023 12:30

@Stomacharmeleon I know it's upsetting but the way I see it can also be two possibilities

  1. The doctors who Hamas take to treat the hostages don't really have a choice (again Hamas, I'm sure they don't fancy saying no to them)
  1. Doctors take an oath to preserve all life. I'm sure they would not even want to say no to saving or treating innocent lives of the people who find themselves in a horrendous situation, they are innocent people

It would be much worse if they died a preventable death would it not.

Dinkydaisy1 · 12/11/2023 13:05

This reply has been deleted

We have now removed this as it quotes a deleted post.

I agree - there is a total unwillingness from those defending genocide and the validity of Palestinian deaths to actually confront the reality of Israel. There is little to no critical discourse on its violent creation, forced displacement and ongoing terror. There is just a simple blame on every corner -

Arab stated for not allowing Israel to just be created in joy and happiness
Palestinians for never wanting peace
Gazans for supporting Hamas, from the day they were born (or even just from fertilisation in the womb)
UN and Amnesty for being Anti Semitic for calling Israel an apartheid state
All hospitals churches, mosques, bakeries, all being hamas hotspots
If not Hamas, then Hezbollah, or west bank radicals
babies and children and dead people simply dressed up in paint and dramatic clothes to inflate death tolls
Civilians and journalists all being mouth pieces for hamas and saying whatever hamas dictates
All callers for ceasefire being imbeciles who don't know what they talking about
Medical organisations that have been speaking about Israels contribution to breakdown in Gazas infrastructure for years
Doctors being too busy working to realise their hospitals are actually fronts for Hamas
Holocaust survivors, anti Zionist Jews, as being self hating or misled people

Its constant. There is absolutely zero critical thinking or human empathy. It's futile having any conversations here.

notsoready4school · 12/11/2023 13:38

HiggleDyPigGeldy · 12/11/2023 11:37

All the pro war people on this thread are essentially trying to gaslight the world by saying it’s Hamas’s fault Gazans are being bombed by Israel.

I am 100% pro Israel bringing Hamas fighters to justice, but that is NOT the same as killing tens of thousands of civilians.

If you are an Israeli politician calling the shots today, if you are an Israeli commander giving the orders, if you are an Israeli reservist signing up to go kill babies in “defense” of your people… you are responsible for deep evil. Similar to the October 7th perpetrators but in many ways worse as you are doing it from a position of way more privilege and education than the Hamas terrorists who have little access to education, global networks, diplomatic tools, precision military technology, intelligence etc. You, and all those egging on the violence, are worse because you have access to so much resource that could enable you to do things differently if you actually thought Gazan lives mattered.

Thank you. This is just so true.

I wish they could just see past the brainwashing. When will they wake up. The world doesn’t hate them. If it was just a few odd ppl shouting out you might question it but when doctors all over the world, politicians, humans, other Jewish people are all saying the same thing you need to just reflect on it and consider the possibility you might be doing something wrong.

These are just normal people across the world, in most cases biased in Israel’s favour and still calling it wrong.

it is just so useless having these discussions online. They just can’t see it. It just can’t change unless they see it is a really baby, just because it is a Palestinian baby it doesn’t make it worthless.

OP posts:
notsoready4school · 12/11/2023 13:48

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 11:27

@notsoready4school 'I have seen no evidence of that' do you live there?
Hamas are still firing rockets into Israel and fighting hand to hand (in a hospital)
Imagine if they just laid down arms or stopped firing rockets (that have to come from somewhere)

I am talking about what Hamas could do now.....like handing back the hostages. All of them. Which they haven't.

I wrote a long reply but then realised it’s pointless. Maybe just maybe this hospital is what we need to wake up. Chances are even then you won’t be allowed to wake up because the narrative will first be anchored by fake images that will later become obvious as fake but the view formed by you will be anchored already, just like the beheaded babies.

It’s so hopeless.

OP posts:
Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:39

And now you will say ' they shouldn't have stopped giving them fuel in the first place' although this negates the fuel they are given that's then taken by Hamas.

They offered a solution as is removing the patients and doctors. They are resolute in riding Gaza of Hamas as no one should have to leave under terror.

@Parkingt111 I argue but that's because you are the voice of reason. And you also listen rather than condemn.

After this there will be silence
Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:40

*ridding.... sorry spelling error.

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:40

*live (I give up)

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:41

@Parkingt111 I agree.....

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:42

@notsoready4school they have allowed independent journalists in with them eg Jeremy Bowen from the bbc.
Which is a darn sight more independent than Hamas health minister.

Stomacharmeleon · 12/11/2023 14:45

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Parkingt111 · 12/11/2023 16:01

@Stomacharmeleon iv had a busy day so not up to date today
But just had a quick look and things are looking worse for everyone unfortunately

OneHurtSpaggettio · 12/11/2023 19:20

From WHO this morning, after losing communications with its contacts at Al Shifa:

Patients seeking health care should never be exposed to fear, and health workers who have taken an oath to treat them should never be forced to risk their own lives to provide care.

WHO calls again for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza as the only way to save lives and reduce the horrific levels of suffering.

Hospitals, patients, health staff, and persons sheltering in health facilities are protected under the Geneva Conventions and International Humanitarian Law.

https://www.emro.who.int/media/news/who-loses-communication-with-contacts-in-al-shifa-hospital-in-gaza-amid-reports-of-attacks.html

WHO loses communication with contacts in Al-Shifa Hospital in Gaza amid reports of attacks

https://www.emro.who.int/media/news/who-loses-communication-with-contacts-in-al-shifa-hospital-in-gaza-amid-reports-of-attacks.html

notsoready4school · 12/11/2023 21:49

I keep skimming different news any news to see maybe now someone will say something, maybe now Biden will intervene, maybe now Sunak will say enough.

Nothing, not even something as lame as expressions of mild disappointment at the uncomfortable situation the hospital is going through.

OP posts: