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Conflict in the Middle East
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25
Stomacharmeleon · 02/11/2023 21:41

@Trulywonderful it's just awful that they feel they have to do that.

ssd · 02/11/2023 21:48

Christ the internet isnt big enough to show pictures of every person murdered or injured in Gaza

Trulywonderful · 02/11/2023 22:08

ssd · 02/11/2023 21:48

Christ the internet isnt big enough to show pictures of every person murdered or injured in Gaza

Pretty sure it is🙄

I suggest an IT course

Plus seriously you do the Gazans no good try to one up other deaths

Trulywonderful · 02/11/2023 22:13

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

EasternStandard · 02/11/2023 22:14

ssd · 02/11/2023 21:48

Christ the internet isnt big enough to show pictures of every person murdered or injured in Gaza

You’re responding to real pain on that site with this

Trulywonderful · 02/11/2023 22:24

EasternStandard · 02/11/2023 22:14

You’re responding to real pain on that site with this

Apparently has problems showing empathy for everyone but Gazans

I am hoping they won't have to go to a neighbours funeral anytime soon.

Imagining the vicar/Imran/whatever saying how sad it was that Nelly has passed away and under such dreadful substances.

Then suddenly a voice is heard "but what about the Palestinians, more of them died you know".

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 01:03

You’re responding to real pain on that site with this

Could you explain why Palestinian suffering doesn’t count as real pain?

Stomacharmeleon · 04/11/2023 10:22

@Reallifelurker no one has said that though. It's like your deliberately looking for an argument. It's a site specifically talking about people massacred on that day. If you would like to draw attention to a similar one?

Trulywonderful · 04/11/2023 10:23

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 01:03

You’re responding to real pain on that site with this

Could you explain why Palestinian suffering doesn’t count as real pain?

I believe what the poster means is that the website is about victims of the pogrom and how they suffered.

Then you seem to jump in and do the what about the Gazans thing. Which in a lot of conversations or debates is valid. However in this case it comes across as lacking empathy for others and trying to point score. Basically in this case your post was a very poor response to something that wasn't anything to do with what has happened next or even before the pogrom.

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 11:05

I believe what the poster means is that the website is about victims of the pogrom and how they suffered

Yes, but what did they mean by “real pain”?

Then you seem to jump in and do the what about the Gazans thing

Well there is a humanitarian crisis in Gaza at the moment. Accusing everyone who mentions it of whataboutary is in poor taste quite frankly. No-one is going to stop talking about that any more than they’re going to stop talking about Oct 7.

However in this case it comes across as lacking empathy for others and trying to point score.

I’m getting a bit bored of this point scoring bollocks to be honest.

Basically in this case your post was a very poor response to something that wasn't anything to do with what has happened next or even before the pogrom.

That doesn’t even make any sense.

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2023 11:16

BethDuttonsTwin · 01/11/2023 23:26

Indeed. And I would suggest pretending none of this is the case surely falls under the remit of “wilfully dense” doesn’t it?

I was thinking more 'unhinged'.

EasternStandard · 04/11/2023 11:26

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 01:03

You’re responding to real pain on that site with this

Could you explain why Palestinian suffering doesn’t count as real pain?

I wasn’t going to return to this as find these threads too much at times but since you’ve asked in a couple of posts no it wasn’t about any one not on that site not suffering real pain

The people documented did suffer a huge amount, and people reading that find it hard too, including people on here

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 11:33

I wasn’t going to return to this as find these threads too much at times but since you’ve asked in a couple of posts no it wasn’t about any one not on that site not suffering real pain

The people documented did suffer a huge amount, and people reading that find it hard too, including people on here

Thats fair but it really wasn’t clear what you meant. Empathy aside it’s difficult to infer much when all you’ve got is words on a screen.

EasternStandard · 04/11/2023 11:35

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 11:33

I wasn’t going to return to this as find these threads too much at times but since you’ve asked in a couple of posts no it wasn’t about any one not on that site not suffering real pain

The people documented did suffer a huge amount, and people reading that find it hard too, including people on here

Thats fair but it really wasn’t clear what you meant. Empathy aside it’s difficult to infer much when all you’ve got is words on a screen.

Ok no problem I didn’t mean it to be ambiguous but glad now I cleared it up

Trulywonderful · 04/11/2023 11:51

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 11:05

I believe what the poster means is that the website is about victims of the pogrom and how they suffered

Yes, but what did they mean by “real pain”?

Then you seem to jump in and do the what about the Gazans thing

Well there is a humanitarian crisis in Gaza at the moment. Accusing everyone who mentions it of whataboutary is in poor taste quite frankly. No-one is going to stop talking about that any more than they’re going to stop talking about Oct 7.

However in this case it comes across as lacking empathy for others and trying to point score.

I’m getting a bit bored of this point scoring bollocks to be honest.

Basically in this case your post was a very poor response to something that wasn't anything to do with what has happened next or even before the pogrom.

That doesn’t even make any sense.

Edited

It is whataboutism with your response in the context of people showing empathy for the horrific things on that particular website. They were only at the point you posting about the pogrom website. Therefore you lacked empathy and decided to post a whatabout.

I get you don't understand this. That is why I tried to explain it to you. If you still don't understand then I am afraid you never are going too. However I hope you will at least try to think on it. Posting out of whatabout responses when the context is wrong doesn't help the Gazens you are trying to support. It just makes people think the people that support Gazens are all lacking empathy or comparison for Jewish and Arab deaths and suffering in Israel. Plus posts like that imply a lack of empathy for the emotions of the Jewish relatives/friends of victims in Israel and around the world

Basically it just isn't a good look and won't help Gazens

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 12:13

It is whataboutism with your response in the context of people showing empathy for the horrific things on that particular website. They were only at the point you posting about the pogrom website. Therefore you lacked empathy and decided to post a whatabout.

I get you don't understand this. That is why I tried to explain it to you. If you still don't understand then I am afraid you never are going too. However I hope you will at least try to think on it. Posting out of whatabout responses when the context is wrong doesn't help the Gazens you are trying to support. It just makes people think the people that support Gazens are all lacking empathy or comparison for Jewish and Arab deaths and suffering in Israel. Plus posts like that imply a lack of empathy for the emotions of the Jewish relatives/friends of victims in Israel and around the world

Basically it just isn't a good look and won't help Gazens

You’re overthinking this

Silence1 · 04/11/2023 12:17

Stomacharmeleon · 02/11/2023 18:43

@OhHelloTheres I think some things are so unfathomable that people almost demand evidence visually. Because we cannot imagine such a thing.

and @OhHelloTheres
Such hypocrisy when you are constantly calling for everything to be verified;
that all information coming out of Gaza is from Hamas and therefore questionable.
This is one story actually confirmed not to be verified by either IDF or the JC but you want us to just except it.
I wondered why anyone would want to embellish (edited to add it doesn't need to be it's bad enough) what happened on the 7th October by putting out this story in the Daily Mail and the only conclusion I can come to is it is an effort to refocus the public's attention on the pain Israel suffered in order to justify the killing of Gaza civilians.
The really sad thing is a Palestine baby was killed many years ago in an actual bakery by being put in an oven.

Trulywonderful · 04/11/2023 12:29

Reallifelurker

My response to that is a fairly obvious you haven't thought about your posts enough. However I believe it is just best we both agree to disagree on this. I still hope you think for a few more seconds before you post in future though.

quantumbutterfly · 04/11/2023 12:36

Silence1 · 04/11/2023 12:17

and @OhHelloTheres
Such hypocrisy when you are constantly calling for everything to be verified;
that all information coming out of Gaza is from Hamas and therefore questionable.
This is one story actually confirmed not to be verified by either IDF or the JC but you want us to just except it.
I wondered why anyone would want to embellish (edited to add it doesn't need to be it's bad enough) what happened on the 7th October by putting out this story in the Daily Mail and the only conclusion I can come to is it is an effort to refocus the public's attention on the pain Israel suffered in order to justify the killing of Gaza civilians.
The really sad thing is a Palestine baby was killed many years ago in an actual bakery by being put in an oven.

Edited

We need peace to stop more hearts being broken.

Reallifelurker · 04/11/2023 12:41

My response to that is a fairly obvious you haven't thought about your posts enough. However I believe it is just best we both agree to disagree on this. I still hope you think for a few more seconds before you post in future though

Give. It. A. Rest.

Stomacharmeleon · 04/11/2023 14:23

@Silence1 can you verify that.

Parkingt111 · 04/11/2023 14:31

Stomacharmeleon · 04/11/2023 14:23

@Silence1 can you verify that.

It was widely reported as one of the atrocities of the Deir Yasin massacre

Parkingt111 · 04/11/2023 14:36

@Stomacharmeleon

Hamas official declares "we will repeat Oct. 7 attacks until Israel is 'finished'"
SomeCatFromJapan · 04/11/2023 14:51

What is interesting is that there are posters who are very quick to declare some of the worst details of 7 October as untrue. Obviously I don't personally know what did or didn't really happen, but there is relatively credible eyewitness evidence.
The same posters would find any questioning of incidents coming out of Gaza deeply offensive though, even though the two main sources are the Hamas-run Health Ministry and Instagram.

What I have noticed is that the Israelis are far more squeamish about realeasing the worst of the footage and images. When the attack initially happened, it was the terrorists realeasing much of the imagery so they had no control over what went out. Now they are doing it via invited press screenings, or images that have at least to some degree been consored and permission from families sought.

The images out of Gaza tend to be immediate and uncensored.

I think this has maybe given a skewed perception, beyond the obvious differences in number of deaths, of the levels of suffering.
Or maybe people will simply seek out and believe whatever chimes with their existing views, and seek to deny, dismiss and minimise that which doesn't.

That is the reason I got involved in these discussions in the first instance. I was confronted with some raw imagary on twitter that was shocking in its brutality, and the whitewashing and lies that followed that were almost instant, including on here.

SomeCatFromJapan · 04/11/2023 14:52

It's also quite plausible that the terrorist actually sought to emulate some of the more widely publicised historial atrocities such as the baby in the oven and the pregnant woman.