Israel confirms

[Ohlalalalala]

Refugee camps are supposed to be safe havens for refugees.

Can't edit the title. Meant to say Israel confirms bombing the refugee camp.

Good idea.

Does it really that much how long it had been there? These were people without much money. Where could they have moved to? Are you blaming the dead for their deaths? Your lack of compassion is depressing to read.

And I say that as someone who feels sick for every innocent Israeli death and hatred for what Hamas did at that festival.

@ProvincialLady1 I’m done too with this whole board. Full of sixth form student activists and far left ideologues who are quite happy to spout information provided by fundamentalist terrorists and cannot see the irony in that. They’ve taken over this board, they shut down any intelligent discussion to the point that anyone with a different opinion is insulted and frightened off, constantly posting multitudes of questionable highly emotional links designed to inflame things rather than inspire discussion. The fact that you’ve got people with the same views physically harassing the leader of the opposition, banging on his car, chasing him down the road is a sad indictment of the situation.

The leader of the opposition who doesn't want a ceasefire ? Sad excuse for a man and needs to resign his seat.

People have had enough, anyone now who is an apologist for the Israeli genocide of the Palestinian people should hang their heads in shame. Questionable links ? Or just ones that show what’s really happening in Gaza, not the Israeli backed msm and western governments. There is no intelligent discussion with others who sanction what’s happening now, there is no justification. Follow some credible journalists in the ME and see the appalling war crimes.

@Livinginanotherworld ’people have had enough’. Which people is this ? The 50 who ambushed a politician doing his job because they don’t agree with his stance ? The tiny echo chamber that you are operating in where no dissent or nuance is
allowed ?
The fact that you believe a terrorist organisation allied with other terrorist organisations that are quite happy to murder, rape and pillage innocent people elsewhere in the world says more about you.
The fact that you are quite happy to enable another 5 years of misrule by this pitiful government by creating the illusion of a split in the LP tells me you don’t give a shit about domestic events in your own country (if you are in the UK lol). Families and children in your own country are suffering right now, older people cannot afford to heat their homes but no, something you cannot control, that is massively complicated, is obviously of far more importance for middle aged class warriors.
Anti Semitic incidents have increased massively, jewish people are afraid to openly display that they are jewish because of potential abuse, such is the overheated atmosphere created by people like you. I suspect the same has happened with Islamophobic ones too.
The whole situation is an absolute Shit show, no one is condoning the deaths of children or any innocent people for that matter, but the constant threads like this, with multiple name changing, accusations of genocide aren’t helping at all.

No, we're just not easily fooled. You must think people here are stupid, sorry to disappoint you. Times have moved on.

This thread is disgusting
Such self justification on both sides
Cant believe what I am reading

@sleepwouldbenice agreed. This thread should be deleted.

I think the thread and the topic should be deleted.

@ProvincialLady1
and they dare to call them terrorists whilst they look down their gun

I’m taking solace in the fact that younger generations- perhaps because of the rise of social media, they are objectively able to see what is happening for themselves, without being force fed just the Western mainstream media narrative- are starting to stand up for Palestine.

Wanting to pull a thread about a discussion about bombing a refugee camp and the horrors of this war.
Thats sick
The truth can’t be hidden by pulling a mumsnet thread you know

Any attempts to shut down this thread, like the other Mumsnet threads in mid-October(!!!), are clearly disingenuous attempts to silence any opposition to the status quo. Just like Suella Braverman would happily shut down the protests now her cohort are losing public support.

You didnt listen
I have sadly learnt much about this situation in the last few weeks, the history,the hatred. But the vitriol on this thread, from both sides, and the lack of compassion for the innocent from all walks of life, is disgusting

Are you for real? Wanting to remove Hamas doesn’t allow Israel to commit war crimes in doing so.

Is there independent evidence to back up the claims?
Anecdotal and other evidence does suggest that Hamas and other factions have used civilian objects including hospitals and schools. Guardian journalists in 2014 encountered armed men inside one hospital, and sightings of senior Hamas leaders inside the Shifa hospital have been documented.
During the 2014 conflict the UN reported weapons were found inside two UN schools and there have been numerous reports of Palestinian armed factions in Gaza firing rockets and other weapons from close to protected civilian locations. It is also clear that Hamas has operated from residential buildings.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/30/human-shield-israel-claim-hamas-command-centre-under-hospital-palestinian-civilian-gaza-city

This has nothing to do with the truth. It’s the disgraceful comments around Shani Louk and other innocent civilians (Israeli and Palestinian) caught up in this atrocity. What if their family were to read such things?
This thread is a toxic mess.

I am feeling guilty about the role we play as bystanders. I am not trying to be patronising here, as I am watching people's lives (and their deaths) every day through a lens, and screen and probably without their consent and they are smelling, seeing, feeling and watching this first hand.

The privilege of it is making me uneasy. Here I am pondering on the rights and wrongs of a conflict that isn't yet affecting me in any way apart from psychologically, bickering about intentionality and morality with complete strangers on the internet whilst also unable to look away. If we look away and delete and stop discussing it what are we? If we keep looking, thinking and discussing it without really being true agents of change what are we? I keep justifying it to myself, that I have a part to play and a voice to share because I'm compassionate for people and I worry about escalation and Iran, Russia and US involvement creating global conflict. I do have some skin in the game at as a public health researcher, with insight from people around me who are experts in the health implications if civil order breaks down, but really, am I just entertaining myself? What responsibility am I taking towards others if I'm battling with them on the internet? Am I a hypocrite saying people need to take responsibility for civilians. What unknown upset am I causing? Social media consumption is so new and not fully understood at all. I wonder what they will make of the way we used it in the future.

@Pheasantsgame why is it rubbish ? Criticising israel policies and israel government is not anti Semitic end of !

I for once find it disgusting that you are using jewish people suffering and prosecution to shut down any criticism of israel ! Most holocaust survivors or victims would be absolutely horrifies at israels actions not just now but over the years !
Never again to anyone !

What are you on about ? I am referring to you saying criticising israel is antisemitic ! Nothing about a list !

Your arguments "But hamas ... human shields ... antisemitic "! Enough! There are innocent lives being lost on both sides no one is disputing that ! We are disputing the amount of force used by israel military

Many people from different backgrounds religions and political ideologies are criticising the force israel is using including jewish people ! Saying all these people are ultimately antisemitic is complete rubbish

Jabalia was not a tent city of refugees, but rather a built up neighbourhood of apartment buildings etc with a huge network of Hamas tunnels and munitions built underneath - and Hamas does not let any civilians use its well fortified tunnels as bomb shelters. Hamas has even stated publicly in recent interviews that it is not responsible for its civilians, but the UN and Israel is.

War is horrible and bloody and deadly and Hamas has the blood on its hands of the death of its civilians.

Why is no one asking Hamas to stop bombing Israel, which it continues to do every day, but which does not get reported in main stream media? Why is no one asking Hamas to return the hostages? If Hamas really wanted the war to end, it would acknowledge the right of Israel to exist (and also Jews around the world - just look at the Hamas charter).

Hamas was pushed into the 7 October terror attack by Iran on the eve of a monumental step towards peace in the Middle East with the Abraham Accords. The same Iran where a 16 year old girl was beaten and just died for daring to show her hair in public.

The situation is complicated and ugly. I'm not saying Israel is perfect, not at all. Nor is Israeli society unanimously behind Netanyahu and his government - remember the massive protests by many many many Israeli's almost every day this summer over the Netanyahu government - but right now, it is facing an existential threat and will do what it takes to continue to exist.

Is there any reason why Hamas stop their rocket fire, hand over the hostages and surrender to Israel in order to secure a ceasefire and prioritise Palestinian lives?