Justifying the rape of women

[armchairactivist1]

Something I keep coming back to.. for the people whose sympathies lie with the Palestinians and think an eye for an eye and that Hamas have been pushed to act the way they have, how do you justify the brutal rape of women by Hamas?
Post edited by MNHQ

@WilmaWonka I've just read the same report. Some footage is included of part of the aftermath.

Massive trigger warning. Not the stuff I'd ever usually post but apparently all bets are off with this stuff now:

https://twitter.com/Dr_logicaI/status/1722693142183297475

No independent journalist confirmed rape.

No independent journalist confirmed rape.

Can you hear yourself? Is that the legal standard in a rape trial, for instance?

I’m not sure why anyone would post this

What do you think of Hamas?

Omg that's disgusting. Those poor women and girls. Brutally raoed and mutilated. The terrorists are barbaric. No wonder Israel are hunting them down.
@SadTimes96 and others like them won't believe it though. The hatred for Jewish people is so entrenched they deny the brutality committed against them.
Shameful and shocking

x.com/ofirgendelman/status/1722561334858961025?s=46&t=H7RsBMUqqEi6HTuLgy64hg

Here is the Israeli Prime Minister's spokesman showing a video that claims to show Palestinians faking their injuries. Except this is a movie shot in Lebanon by Lebanese actors.

It's exactly these sort of lies and propaganda that makes it impossible to believe any information coming out of Israel.

Oh dear! 🤦‍♀️ His X profile calls him "The Israeli Prime Minister's spokesperson to the Arab world" ... What a joke.

But does such a fuckwit really make it "impossible to believe any information coming out of Israel" - ANY information?

@Alcemeg

Sorry, I should have said any information that hasn't also been verified by and independent source. That wasn't me trying to imply October 7th didn't happen.

Thanks for confirming! I hope you can understand my twitchiness on this sort of thing. There seem to be an awful lot of people denying 7 October, and it's only been a month. Social media has a lot to answer for... Everyone can be a Lord Haw-Haw!

@Alcemeg when someone (Israeli govt) has proven themselves time and time again to be a liar, a propaganda spreader and an intimidating bully, we have to stop trusting or listening to their bullshit.

Yes I agree, the bloke is clearly a total wanker and should not have that job, of all jobs 🤦🏻‍♀️

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CyO8YdJGp6/?utmmsource=igwebbcopy_link

Here is a very interesting video that lays out evidence of how a lot of the hostages might have actually been killed by the Israeli forces. It does paint a picture of the Israeli forces being very incompetent in their response to the attack by Hamas.

@VeronicaM27 well, they certainly are being incompetent at "eliminating Hamas" in Gaza, when 99% or so of the people they have killed so far have been innocent civilians, and mostly women and children.

You literally just shared some wanker denying the rapes etc, was that intentional?

Did you see the links shared last night, and what do you make of them?

There are always casualties from "friendly fire" in any conflict, are you saying that it accounts for most of the 7 Oct deaths?

Last but not least, what are you trying to achieve here? I'm trying to get my head round it.

Please can you share your source for "99% or so" and how this is being measured?

@Popolop Yes they seem to be good at firing at people indiscriminately no matter who they are!

What I keep coming back to is the continual bombing of children. Over 4,000 dead, countless horrifically injured and god knows how many are still under the rubble, either dead or still alive and suffering. There is just zero justification for that. They are monsters.

https://www.firstpost.com/world/israel-claims-to-have-slain-60-odd-senior-and-mid-level-hamas-leaders-now-hunting-for-combatant-commanders-13364562.html

According to this article 60 Hamas killed.

Out of 10,500 I calculate this as 0.57%

@Alcemeg The video I shared provides sources from the Israeli media that appear to confirm that the Israeli forces fired on their own people, including firing tanks into their houses which would explain why some hostages were so badly burned.

The only thing I'm trying to achieve is finding the truth.

I've seen some supposed friendly fire footage but it was night vision and the attack on the festival happened during the day so was clearly nonsense.

I see we've been steered away from discussion the raped women though.

@SomeCatFromJapan You are asking us to believe women were raped without providing any verifiable evidence that they were.

Again, I'm not saying that rapes didn't happen. I'm just saying that I'm not willing to say they definitely did without proof. I don't think that's an unreasonable position to take.

What would you count as "verifiable evidence" @VeronicaM27 ?

@Alcemeg Have any of the female victims said they were raped? Any first hand accounts? Again, not saying there isn't. I just haven't been able to find anything.

Why are you asking random Mumsnetters whether they justify the brutal rape of women by Hamas?

There is no justification for any of it. None. The only people we should be demanding explanation from and punishing is the leaders of Hamas and the leaders of Israel and the leaders from the Arab world and leaders of the West funnelling (mostly normal people's money, that people work for and then are taxed on) their tsunamis of money to prop up and and arm terrorist cells and opposing governments with guns and bayonets and huge bombs and chemical weapons and then these men send to war the normal people, the immature, undeveloped 18 and 19 and 20 year olds who less than 5 weeks ago were making tiktoks and thinking about who they fancy, to discharge in the face of other normal people who were just sat in a place they called home, trying to live a life they didn't even choose to be born in.

These men (and I don't give a shit about the obvious misandry, because all they key players I have seen so far ARE men), with their egos and thirst for blood and land and money and power and bullshite 'martyrdom'. They are responsible for the rapes, beheading, stabbings, bombs, torture. They are responsible for sending teenagers (both Hamas and IDF) to certain death. They are responsible for laying out to these normal people who are now being given the name of 'terrorist' or 'fighter' that they can rape, torture and behead their enemy in the name of Allah, or God, or Palestine or Israel, in the name of money and power. It's disgusting. Mumsnetters haven't done this. And instead we are all arguing and turning on each other because we have no power ourselves to stop or start any of it. None. We don't even have any power to find out the truth because the propaganda is so strong.

@Weddingpuzzle I agree with absolutely everything you've said. My post has been edited by MN but people taking the stance of 'well I'm going to need more proof' are demonstrating exactly what I was trying to say but you're right, no one can give the answers here. I came here because I was just so shocked at some people's reactions.

@VeronicaM27 if you scroll up, I have posted a twitter link containing an eyewitness statement.
But do bear in mind that the women will largely be dead.