How effective is Israeli bombing, anyway?

[mushti]

According to Hamas figures, Israel has dropped 12,000 tonnes of explosives on Gaza. 6000 people have died.

Hamas terrorists killed 1400 Jews with just what they could carry on trucks and motorbikes.

It almost looks like Israel is trying to minimize casualties, doesn't it?

I don't know anything about this man so I couldn't tell you what he did or didn't do. Your lack of humanity and deflection is telling though. I doubt they are campaigning for worldwide release of minors who have committed murder. They probably just don't agree with the torture of 13 year old children.

Israel often rounds up Palestinians and imprisons them. There have long been reports of mistreatment, torture and murder of Palestinians in Israeli prisons. This is happening as we speak https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/features/2023/10/21/number-of-palestinian-prisoners-in-israel-doubles-to-10000-in-two-weeks

A quick Google brought up this man who very recently died "in mysterious circumstance" in an Israeli prison. He was arrested and imprisoned with his 9 year old son. https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231024-palestinian-prisoners-dies-in-israels-jails-2-weeks-into-his-detention/

Pisgat Ze'ev stabbings - Wikipedia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pisgat_Ze%27ev_stabbings
He did not kill some one. There is a video proof of him being questioned in torturous ways at 13. Where did you read that he killed someone? There is no proof and his knife had no blood on it!

Since many don't believe Israel without visual proof a very large group of journalists were gathered together and showed recorded footage that was recorded by Hamas terrorists and uploaded. The journalists reported about this and the sickening things they saw.

Hamas don't have the same problem and many believe their claims without seeing any proof at all.

Personally I wouldn't want to see these uploaded recorded scenes to realise why Israel are angry. The festival rapes and killings uploaded sometimes to family social media accounts. The kibbutz slaughters etc. They were shared with journalists. Although the journalists reported what the saw many still don't believe it which might explain how anti semitic beliefs work...don't 'trust the Jews' its very deeply buried in many.

So you have 2 different organisations telling you 4000-6000 have been killed and hundreds more missing under the rubble, thousands more injured. But you think you are right in thinking Palestinians are lying. This is what you call dehumanisation. Even in a genocide they have to prove themselves. Please go follow Shaun King on insta. Please go follow Motaz_azaiza you will see every single child and innocent being killed in hundreds daily. Entire families wiped out during night. Everything is being filmed yet here you are arguing over number of deaths.

@Ohdearanotheryear well this is the difference they palestinian shows us what is going on because is the only way to get their story out because the media does not show their side
As of journalist Seeing and telling us i don't have faith in the media anymore not after this mot after Iraq .
I am thankful
For social media today people
Are in the middle
Of bombing and they are recording talking in english why ?? Fo us to see for the western people
To see the atrocities to speak up

Are israeli supporters saying these videos are fake ? Because i have seen the argument that is make up and fake bodies and i just cant believe how blind can they be ?? Make up ? There are plenty of israeli "influencers" making mocking videos of mothers holding dead babies faking it is disgusting to see

I have seen people
Saying they make it up and is fake 😳

I realise there are several different disagreements going on here.

My reply was to @immigrant002 with regard to prove of the claim of a baby being cut from its mother, killed in front of her and then she was killed.

@Ohdearanotheryear where did hamas terrorist upload this video ?

Go search yourself. Go look for the journalists sharing stories of what they saw because Israel know that people like you won't believe unless they watch it themselves. I personally don't want to see it.

There is a lot of I don't believe Hamas did this that or the other and yet immediate belief in Hamas claims. This is why a very large group on international journalists were sat down and shown footage of festival and kibbutz killings. There is also survivor testimonials. It's out there Go look.

@Ohdearanotheryear i search all i found was people talking about it

I am sorry i am bit more cynical than you ! There is a history of US and the media lying to people to defend their actions do you blame people for not automatically believing IDF ? They lied many times or the US investigating themselves ? i don't believe hamas we believe regular people like motaz like plestia documenting their nightmare we believe documentaries showing the everyday life of palestinians under occupation
I believe the greek speakkng priest saying people where taking refuge in the church that most people killed are not hamas but regular people that entire families have been wiped out
I am not denying people died and that hamas did terrible things but the lines of beheaded babies have been disproven so i am a bit skeptic when i hear horror stories with no proof

What is clear to me is that israel acts like a spoilt brat things they can do whatever they want threatens to "teach" the UN a lesson and get angry whenever anyone tries to ask about palestinian civilians

Actually @Sugaristheenemy prior to 7 October approval ratings for the (very right wing) government were low, and the prime minister was scrabbling around for parliamentary partners to shore him up. I'm a Jew, my family are in Israel, my friends are in Israel, and their families... hundreds of people and lots of shared discussions, access to media viewpoints etc. Not a one would say that "anything short of a genocide is a kindness". What a terrible thing to ascribe. Please don't mix ordinary people up with their gov't.

My apologies. Good to know mushti’s ravings aren’t common place (assuming they are a genuine poster I guess)

Actually @Sugaristheenemy prior to 7 October approval ratings for the (very right wing) government were low, and the prime minister was scrabbling around for parliamentary partners to shore him up. I'm a Jew, my family are in Israel, my friends are in Israel, and their families... hundreds of people and lots of shared discussions, access to media viewpoints etc. Not a one would say that "anything short of a genocide is a kindness". What a terrible thing to ascribe. Please don't mix ordinary people up with their gov't.

My apologies. Good to know mushti’s ravings aren’t common place (assuming they are a genuine poster I guess)

Jesus wept!

Wow I'm disgusted that you actually want to see it. Yet you accept others talking about what Israel have done and say they said x y or z. These were international journalists, sobbing on recounting.

Unbelievable. I bid you goodbye I cannot talk to someone who feels the need to actually watch these things.

It's so sad that the Palestinian genocide is always excused with but Hamas this and Hamas that.

Collective punishment is okay with you? You know nearly half population of Gaza is children. Half the number of killings are of children. Why does Israel think bombing children is the right thing to do and why is US opposing a ceasefire in Gaza?

@Ohdearanotheryear sorry you misunderstood me i do not want to see it i am just explaining to you why people are a bit hard to convince after idf and US record of lying !

People who blame Hamas please go and look at the west bank where there is no hamas. 6000 killings of Palestinians in last 8 years by Israeli settlers. Look at how many settlers have killed Palestinians for their homes :(

Follow Shaun King on insta for an Americans perspective on this atrocity

Do you have a link for this?

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/09/israel-opt-after-nearly-2-years-in-solitary-confinement-ahmad-manasra-too-ill-to-attend-his-hearing/

Thank you. Nothing was coming up on Ahmed Manasir but see now it's spelled Manasra.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pisgat_Ze%27ev_stabbings

Apologies for that

Jesus christ thats horrific

What did someone upthread just say "bombing unless nuclear is an unreliable way to kill people" LOL. ok.

Wow I'm disgusted that you actually want to see it. Yet you accept others talking about what Israel have done and say they said x y or z. These were international journalists, sobbing on recounting.

Unbelievable. I bid you goodbye I cannot talk to someone who feels the need to actually watch these things

I think* *we just want to know if they actually exist? Personally I’m getting a bit fed up of people making statements then refusing to back them up. A simple google search will prove them right apparently but will they do it themselves? Nope.