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Conflict in the Middle East

Be ashamed of yourselves

802 replies

Thisworld10 · 24/10/2023 09:42

That’s right be ashamed of yourselves. I come in these threads thinking I’ll read someone saying what’s happening to the people of Palestine is awful but what I end up reading is people saying they brought it on themselves because they elected Hamas.

So, what if they elected Hamas. We elected the Conservative party but they don’t speak for me, they certainly don’t act on behalf of the everyday citizen of this country. Be ashamed of yourselves for not valuing the lives of Palestinians but putting so much value on the lives of Israelis.

be ashamed of yourselves for justifying the ethnic cleansing of over 2 million people because Hamas attacked Israel in early October. Be ashamed of yourselves for standing for genocide in 2023!

be ashamed of yourselves for saying we would never allow the holocaust to happen again yet Palestinians are held in an open air prison. It’s literally been called a concentration camp, with no way in or out and they are being rampaged with bombs, white phosphorus bombs being dropped on them non stop. On Sunday night 400 died because of the bombs, over 2000 children are now dead. Be ashamed of yourselves for justifying their deaths and blaming them for it.

be ashamed of yourselves for condoning the protestors for wanting Palestinians to have a right to live a peaceful existence.

be ashamed for bringing history into justifying the slaughter of so many people. Yes, Palestinians did welcome Israelis into the holy land in the 1940’s, it doesn’t mean they get to die now. Yes, Israel has a right to exist, but that doesn’t mean Palestine doesn’t. Yes, Israel has land grabbed and continues to do so but no one is allowed to say anything. Yes, their is no Hamas in the West Bank but why are the Palestinian still being killed. Why are so many people illegally arrested mainly kids - held for decades in Israel prisons. Are they not hostages? Yea, Israel asked asked the Palestinians to move to the south with 24 hours notice for their ‘safety’ yet they are being killed in the south.

be ashamed if you ask any one who stands to defend the rights of Palestinians if they condemn Hamas. Everyone condemns Hamas. Being pro Palestinian doesn’t mean your pro-Hamas. I also condemn the barbarian acts of genocide committed by Israel. I condemn the open displays of hate for Palestinian people - calling them human animals etc.

Be ashamed if you think it’s so great they are letting a trickle of aid in but no fuel to run hospitals. Electricity ran out last night in the hospital. So many babies reliant in incubators will die as a result. be ashamed if you think it’s okay for world leaders to not call for a ceasefire and instead show 100% support to what Israel
is doing.

no one has the right to hold one life more dearer than another.

you should be ashamed of yourselves for valuing some over others.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:17

Alcemeg · 26/10/2023 13:59

Me, a Zionist! 🤣 Now, that's made me laugh, thank you.

Can you show me similar links to "Palestinians" condemning the 7 Oct attacks, please? Because I'm sure you'd agree they absolutely should.

A sophisticated civilisation permits freedom of speech.

To be honest, this is the sort of contrast between cultures that has destroyed the sympathy I once had for "Palestine."

Why are you using inverted commas?

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:18

OhHelloTheres · 26/10/2023 13:49

I mean exactly what I said - they're victims of a war and therefore are killed, not murdered. Saying an army is murdering someone implies they're specifically targeting them. They're not. That's all I mean and that's all I said. I'm sure you'll be jumping to conclusions anyway though - seems to be your MO. Eg your nonsense hasbara comment and implying you are the only person here seeing things the correct way 🤦🏻‍♀️

Who are you talking about? That's my question.

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:32

Alcemeg · 26/10/2023 14:20

Because it's complicated...?
https://www.britannica.com/place/Palestine

The cheek of you! You want to even strip the people of their identity! Wow! Such hatred. Go educate yourself; you absolutely need it.

OhHelloTheres · 26/10/2023 14:36

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:18

Who are you talking about? That's my question.

We were talking about all the civilian casualties in Gaza. So that's who I mean by "they".

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 14:37

I see many pro Palestine marches and outrage for Gaza’s civilians but don’t see many getting worked up about this.

‘They filed a pregnant women, a terrorist arrives, he disembowels her, takes out the foetus, and in front of her, he comes out and massacres the baby before killing her,' Weisberg told a delegation of Jewish community leaders from France at the Shura military base.
'Everything is filmed. Babies whose heads were decapitated, soldiers whose genitals were cut off, small and elderly women were raped,' Weisberg added.’

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12666289/Eyes-gouged-womans-breasts-cut-daughter-legs-severed-Horrific-details-Hamas-massacre-emerge-rescue-worker-recounts-entire-families-slaughtered.html

Horrific details of Hamas massacre emerge

Hamas terrorists killed a husband and gouged his eyes out before going on to cut his wife's breasts off and saw his daughter's leg off, a rescue worker has revealed.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12666289/Eyes-gouged-womans-breasts-cut-daughter-legs-severed-Horrific-details-Hamas-massacre-emerge-rescue-worker-recounts-entire-families-slaughtered.html

Gruntsandgroans · 26/10/2023 14:42

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 14:37

I see many pro Palestine marches and outrage for Gaza’s civilians but don’t see many getting worked up about this.

‘They filed a pregnant women, a terrorist arrives, he disembowels her, takes out the foetus, and in front of her, he comes out and massacres the baby before killing her,' Weisberg told a delegation of Jewish community leaders from France at the Shura military base.
'Everything is filmed. Babies whose heads were decapitated, soldiers whose genitals were cut off, small and elderly women were raped,' Weisberg added.’

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12666289/Eyes-gouged-womans-breasts-cut-daughter-legs-severed-Horrific-details-Hamas-massacre-emerge-rescue-worker-recounts-entire-families-slaughtered.html

There are quite a few threads about the Israeli civilians who were massacred. This one is about the Palestinian civilians who are being massacred right now with the approval of the US and the UK, that's probably why people on this thread are talking about the Palestinian civilians being massacred.

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 14:46

No, there were plenty of posts about why no one cares for the Palestinian victims. I was pointing out that in fact most do and there is more vocal support being shown on SM.

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:52

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 14:37

I see many pro Palestine marches and outrage for Gaza’s civilians but don’t see many getting worked up about this.

‘They filed a pregnant women, a terrorist arrives, he disembowels her, takes out the foetus, and in front of her, he comes out and massacres the baby before killing her,' Weisberg told a delegation of Jewish community leaders from France at the Shura military base.
'Everything is filmed. Babies whose heads were decapitated, soldiers whose genitals were cut off, small and elderly women were raped,' Weisberg added.’

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12666289/Eyes-gouged-womans-breasts-cut-daughter-legs-severed-Horrific-details-Hamas-massacre-emerge-rescue-worker-recounts-entire-families-slaughtered.html

Look for Atrocity Propaganda.

Since when the DailyFail became a credible source??

Did Hamas behead babies? I Fact Check

In this Fact Check, Al Jazeera's @rawaak tracks the origin and the spread of fake claims about the beheading of children in Kfar Aza. #Israel_Gaza_War #FactC...

https://youtu.be/0el9wiOBmmM?feature=shared

Dinkydaisy1 · 26/10/2023 14:53

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:32

The cheek of you! You want to even strip the people of their identity! Wow! Such hatred. Go educate yourself; you absolutely need it.

That's the aim isn't it - to finish off the country, the identity, the people. As they say "Israel is for a people without a land, in a land without a people", completely obliterating the fact that it was in fact inhabited for centuries, with a culture, language, fields, poetry, work. But it suits a narrative more to say they didn't really exist.

ganondoof · 26/10/2023 15:03

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:52

Look for Atrocity Propaganda.

Since when the DailyFail became a credible source??

As opposed to Al Jazeera and Erdoğan's mouthpiece?

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 15:05

Dinkydaisy1 · 26/10/2023 14:53

That's the aim isn't it - to finish off the country, the identity, the people. As they say "Israel is for a people without a land, in a land without a people", completely obliterating the fact that it was in fact inhabited for centuries, with a culture, language, fields, poetry, work. But it suits a narrative more to say they didn't really exist.

Always has been. Brave people. Palestinians deserve to live in peace and prosperity in their own country. They suffered way too much.

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 15:11

@ganondoof both my links are from reputable sources whether you like it or not. I wouldn't even use the DailyFail as toilet paper.

Dinkydaisy1 · 26/10/2023 15:12

On the concept of "a land without a people"

This is just ONE story I came across the other day by the writer Raymond Khouri

A bit of historical context:

This is my grandfather's house in Haifa, which he built in 1934. His name was John Hanna Asfour, a Christian Palestinian. Our family tree records there go back over two centuries. That's him at his wedding.

A prominent, successful lawyer, he hired a Jewish architect, Moshe Gerstel, to design his home. Gerstel was an immigrant from Europe who had just arrived in Palestine, and my grandfather generously gave him his first job there.

In 1948, after my grandfather's assistant was murdered and his dead body was dumped outside the house, he sent his wife and five children (including my mom, who was 13 at the time) to safety in Egypt. He had to follow them a few weeks later.

They never returned.

His house eventually became an officers' club of the Israeli army (sorry, "defence force"--such brilliant marketing). Today it is an architecturally preserved site. He and his family were never offered any restitution. They lost everything.

They were among the lucky ones.

They never had to live in refugee camps, eat scraps, have no travel documents, or suffer humiliation and brutality on a daily basis.

A dehumanising narrative has been promoted since then that Palestine before 1948 was a barren desert, ripe for a miraculous upgrade. It wasn't. Its people were not bedouins or primitive savages. It was a thriving, well educated, sophisticated twentieth century society. But its people lost a battle for their land. And as we know, history is written by the victors.

What happened two weeks ago was tragic, abhorrent, barbaric. But when an entire people is brutalised for decades under a vicious apartheid occupation that has no comparable in this 21st century, and the media and governments who could make things right like the US and UK don't just consistently turn a blind eye to that ongoing tragedy but support it with weapon supplies, perhaps it shouldn't come as such a shock that hopelessness can lead to extreme rage and, sadly, bloodshed...

It never ceases to amaze me how the victims of a horrific genocide could so quickly and heartlessly turn around and bulldoze through another people, like the victims of child abuse who turn into abusers. And be totally oblivious to the parallel.

Empathy is tragically selective. The world cheered the Sioux in Dances with Wolves, the Na'vi in Avatar, the rebels fighting the empire in Star Wars. Hell, we're now even cheering the AI robots in The Creator (see it). But in real life, the stormtroopers are winning.

But I see a faint glimmer of hope, that if not the governments of the US and UK, but at least the people, a lot of people, are now waking up to this tragedy, seeing and starting to understand what's been happening for decades, thanks to social media and despite the odious censorship and more insidious shadow blocking being done.

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 15:15

@Ohlalalalala Al-Jazeera is a credible source! That’s a good one. The DM is not the only paper running that but don’t let that get in the way of it just being propaganda.

ChalkWitch · 26/10/2023 15:16

@Ohlalalalala and if all you can say in response to that story is to criticise the paper it’s in…

Alcemeg · 26/10/2023 15:18

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 14:32

The cheek of you! You want to even strip the people of their identity! Wow! Such hatred. Go educate yourself; you absolutely need it.

The funny thing is, I was trying to be respectful.

CosimoPiovasco · 26/10/2023 15:30

OhHelloTheres · 26/10/2023 13:13

@Gruntsandgroans
The only ones being killed on purpose in Gaza are terrorists. The rest of the deaths are not on purpose. Stop pretending otherwise. Again, language matters.

Israel have been directly targeting the press. 24 dead so far not counting their family members.
Direct bombing of their homes.

ganondoof · 26/10/2023 15:38

Ohlalalalala · 26/10/2023 15:11

@ganondoof both my links are from reputable sources whether you like it or not. I wouldn't even use the DailyFail as toilet paper.

Edited

But you would happily quote from an organisation that's in thr pocket of the dictator or Turkey.

OhHelloTheres · 26/10/2023 15:46

@Dinkydaisy1
Muslims in places like Haifa and Jerusalem were ordered to leave by the surrounding Arab nations so they wouldn't be in the way when the Arabs attacked. They thought it would only be for a couple of weeks but unfortunately for them, Israel won that war. So that's the real reason the majority of Muslims left these cities - they were told to by the likes of Egypt and what's now known as Jordan etc. Don't just pick and choose what parts of history you'll acknowledge.

CosimoPiovasco · 26/10/2023 16:00

Agree with you OP

A serious aspect that is very one sided.
The constant call for one side ( Hamas) to release hostages whilst not acknowledging that the other side ( Israel ) also has hostages and continues nightly raids taking more, mostly just workers it seems.

Israel has 4000 taken from Gaza plus 1600 missing ( including 900 children )
Many missing for a long time
( figures not up to date, so probably more )
It’s well documented how many Hamas has taken as Countries all want them released so Israel can carry on bombing.

Xenia · 26/10/2023 16:14

I hope Israel win. And we have freedom of speech in democracies unlike many Middle Eastern nations so if people think it is a cheek that some of us support Israel in the UK, that is simply how it is - we are entitled to hold different views.

Parkingt111 · 26/10/2023 16:45

@Xenia yes for free speech of journalists unless they don't hold the same view as Israel then they just mysteriously get murdered. Shireen Abu Akleh
Or targeting the family of journalists
Like they did yesterday

Parker231 · 26/10/2023 16:51

Xenia · 26/10/2023 16:14

I hope Israel win. And we have freedom of speech in democracies unlike many Middle Eastern nations so if people think it is a cheek that some of us support Israel in the UK, that is simply how it is - we are entitled to hold different views.

It shouldn’t be a case of wanting Israel to win - what about the innocent Palestinians? It’s not as if they can go and live somewhere else - Israel holds them as prisoners.
Why is an Israeli life worth more than a Palestinian?