Hostages

[TakeMe2Insanity]

This is running on Al Jazeera and others - apparently Israel refused to take back two hostages.

https://english.alarabiya.net/amp/News/middle-east/2023/10/21/Hamas-says-intended-to-release-two-hostages-but-Israel-refused-to-receive-them

Did you forget to take the rubbish out again. You know it was your turn. So don't complain about it getting stinky.

Just seen people online talking about this interesting fact

Sorry whole image not showing. Hate it when that happens. Just tap to make bigger

If you're going to a link to an image of naked bruised bodies, would it really too hard to give the slightest indication of what you're linking to? Although I suspect that getting people to unsuspectingly click those links and see those images whether they want to or not is part of the fun for you.

@Trulywonderful funny that.... it's Almost as though they had a reason to take them to the furthest hospital?

And no one saw a thing.....

Oh that is gross

Now you know never click a Rubbish link again

Probably report that to be deleted if it is that bad. Someone might have a child in the room when they open it. Disgusting behaviour for mumsnet!

I want to hear the excuse apologists make for this fact

Maybe they took a couple of wrong turns in the tunnel

Further information which suggests that we can be hopeful a hostage deal/release is imminent.
Below has just been reported now on the BBC

The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) says its president has travelled to Qatar to meet Hamas and Qatari government representatives, in a bid to "advance humanitarian issues related to the armed conflict in Israel and Gaza".
Mirjana Spoljaric’s trip - and in particular the meeting with Hamas - will fuel speculation that a release of Israeli hostages may be imminent. The ICRC stresses it does not take part in negotiations leading to hostage releases, but is there to facilitate any deal that's agreed.
That's what happened with the four hostages who have been freed so far: Qatar negotiated with Hamas, and then the ICRC retrieved the hostages from agreed locations and brought them back to Israel.

Fun? This is pure evil from the Israeli army. Torturing and numbering victims is beyond evil. Not even sure how your mind works to think of a word such as fun to describe this.

You know the poster was asking if you thought it was fun to post a link to something graphic that mumsnet have now deleted. Especially as you didn't put a warning on it and most of us have children that could be in the room when we opened it. Don't start on another user because you don't know how to behave like an adult

Next time if you must post such things at least add a warning about content

Though personally I think it is disrespectful to those photographed. I thought the same about the naked Jewish girl getting driven around Gaza as men spat at her body and sat astride her photo too. So don't start about it being one sided or anything. These photos should just not be shared on social media it is sick.

The mental gymnastics of coming on here, a thread about hostages and posting whatever gratuitous images you fancy to 'get one over' on the other side.
It's your noggin that needs recalibrating.

I'm using it to describe what's in those images, I'm using it to describe what you feel when you post then with no context or warning.

From bbbc

1. Hamas's leader Ismail Haniyeh has told news agencies they are "close to reaching a truce agreement". There has been no update from Israel
2. The deal could see Hamas returning civilian hostages in exchange for Israel's release of jailed Palestinians, according to AFP and Al Jazeera
3. US President Joe Biden had earlier indicated a deal could soon be agreed that would involve Hamas releasing hostages from Gaza in exchange for pauses in fighting
4. The International Committee of the Red Cross, which helped facilitate previous deals, has further raised hopes by saying its head is meeting Hamas

Two sources familiar with the truce talks have told AFP a tentative deal includes a five-day truce, comprised of a ceasefire on the ground and limits to Israeli air operations over southern Gaza.

In return, between 50 and 100 prisoners held by Hamas and Islamic Jihad – a separate Palestinian militant group – would be released.

They would include Israeli civilians and captives of other nationalities, but no military personnel.

Under the proposed deal, some 300 Palestinians would be released from Israeli jails, among them women and children.

The White House said the negotiations were in the “endgame” stage, but refused to give further details, saying it could jeopardise a successful outcome.

So they wouldn't release all the hostages? negotiating with terrorists is a risky game

@Iwantcakeeveryday most papers are referring it's likely to be done in phases
The families of the hostages are also in a very desperate situation and feel their concerns are going unheard

Yesterday when they objected to a suggestion from the right wing ministers that Israel should give the death penalty to militants held in israeli jails they were shouted back at with 'they don't hold a monopoly of pain' which infuriated many In Israel

@Iwantcakeeveryday all or none is a very risky gamble to play
A phased approach is more likely to achieve better results at this point in time

I'm not sure this is right. Hamas held Gilad Shalit for 5 years (!) before eventually releasing him in exchange for 1027 prisoners, a lot of who were convicted terrorists. Some of them went on to help arrange the events last month. So if Hamas keep hold of 150+ hostages that they consider military personnel by virtue of them being male or 18-30 year old females, there is a very real risk they'll be keeping them until Israel agrees to give up the terrorists who were a part of the massacre in Israel on 7th October...

Hezbollah did something similar in 2006 - kidnapped two soldiers and then exchanged them for a few prisoners including Samir Kuntar (a truly awful human being) two years later. It was only when the soldiers were returned that Israel discovered they had actually been dead for two years.

This will hopefully help explain Israel's reluctance to negotiate with terrorists over hostages. It doesn't always end so well for Israel. Completely unsurprisingly, terrorists are not to be trusted as they don't exactly act in good faith. Ever.

what makes you say that? Do you not think this negotiating for release risks further hostage taking? Thats typically why people won't negotiate with terrorists, exchanges also increase risks of more hostage taking.

@OhHelloTheres that does help to understand it from a different perspective the reluctance.
Right now from what is being reported the exchange combines largely of women and children. The full details haven't been given yet so it will remain to he seen.
I believe its likely the ICRC will check on the hostages at an agreed location before the swap happens

@Iwantcakeeveryday I do understand all your points and the reasoning. I suppose my stance is more aligned with the families of some of the hostages and also that any innocent life saved is worth saving.
It's also because I know that they are children being held hostage and I personally think a deal should be reached in releasing them at the least. Again that's just my own view and I would understand if yourself or others would disagree

You're in good company @OhHelloTheres

Israeli national security minister Itamar Ben-Gvir issued a statement Tuesday morning warning against a deal - using the same arguments

He was the person shouting at the distressed hostage families yesterday ''you don't have a monopoly on suffering''

Don't get me wrong, I would personally rather some hostages be released than none. Specially the children. I was just trying to explain why Israel might not be quite as excited about the prospect. They know this is nowhere near the end.

So utterly heartbreaking

And also that the minors and others held without charge or trial in israeli prisons should also be released

I wouldn't consider that good company. Doesn't mean I can't see his point of view, although to be honest I didn't know he'd said that as I don't follow Israeli politics. I was just explaining the difficulties Israel is facing. Are you saying my reasoning is flawed? If so, feel free to explain why so I can try to understand your point of view.