What does 'ceasing responsibility for life' mean?

[flufferknutter]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12653619/Israel-reveals-plans-three-phase-war-Gaza-starting-airstrikes-ground-manoeuvres-moving-eradicate-pockets-resistance-ceasing-Israels-responsibility-life-Gaza-Strip.html

I'm sorry for the DM link. I want to know what is meant by Israel 'ceasing responsibility for life' means though. I don't understand.

I thought most posters think history started on in 1948 or 2007

Gaza is not a country. When will people understand that. It is a small territory of was Palestine where millions of displaced Palestinians made refugees by Israel live. It’s surrounded by a security perimeter controlled by Israel, and is totally dependent on Israel for the distribution of funds and access to basic humanitarian services. This is why describing this current genocide campaign as a ‘war’ is completely inaccurate - it’s not a battle between two nation states. One is a nuclear superpower the other is an open air prison controlled by its oppressor.

what Israel does to Palestinians is state sponsored terrorism.

@Jelllytot Honestly if it's upsetting you that much please step away from following the news.
You won't be burying your head in the sand. The reality is children are dying in conflicts globally, this is the one currently in the news cycle.

@Desertrose2023 Hamas is nowhere i your description though and that's hugely relevant in the current situation.
They are also what I'd describe as the oppressor of Gaza.

Are you actually justifying a massacre? Dismembering, ripping foetuses from their mothers and decapitating, burning people alive, shooting their faces off, raping so brutally that their pelvises were broken? That Jews deserved this treatment?

@PinkTonic @mushti agrees with you, she's not justifying the atrocities.

Unfortunately someone will be along in a minute to minimise them and demand "evidence".

Sorry I’ve only read the last few posts this morning.

No, I doubt many on the Palestinian side are going to say that, because they are radicalised, and those who are independent thinkers and are not radicalised have either managed to leave, or stayed and are oppressed, fearful of (and bribed by) their leadership . Also, if you think back to their last election 17 years ago, dissenters (eg anyone who wanted to vote for Fatah, the slightly more moderate option) were murdered by Hamas.

It's an absolute shit show.

And an Israeli government that most moderate, modern Israelis are completely against and have been protesting against for the last year, is now running the war.

While ordinary Israelis are grieving and totally traumatised, plus still living with sirens warning of rocket attacks every day.

And ordinary Gazan Palestinian's have never had much choice of anything (especially what to think of believe) to start with and have been sold up the river (if there was one) by their own leadership, and none of the surrounding Arab states willing to come to their help with actual solutions, because they don't want them in their countries, and they would rather see them oppressed and turn to terrorism, because that serves the purposes of radical Islam which is to eradicate Israel as a Jewish nation and all the Jews within it.

It's an absolute shit show with no easy answers, or it would have been solved by now, and whatever happens is going to lead to unacceptable loss of life, because that's exactly what war is.

What do you want, me to condemn Hamas? Ok I condemn Hamas, there are horrible. But make no mistake the only oppressors of the Palestinian people are Israel. First they oppressed them by forcibly removing them and stealing their land, making them refugees in their own country. Now they oppress them by collectively punishing them through carpet bombing, dehydration and starvation.

I'm not asking you to condemn them but their presence is entirely relevant to this. They run Gaza and they launched their terrorist attack from there. They are still firing rockets from Gaza.
Otherwise it makes it sound like Israel has launched an entirely random attack.

Why is the BBC never ever reporting of any of the rockets that are still flying out of Gaza?

You moron! Israel gave FREE WATER AND ELECTRICITY to Gaza!

My understanding is they’ve cut the supply’s off not handed them a bill.

let’s not be cute and pretend Hamas were formed in a vacuum. Israel is entirely responsible for the creation of Hamas. Their existence is a direct consequence of Israel’s ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948 and their ongoing land grabs and dehumanization of the Palestinian people.

Apart from the fact that there is no carpet bombing (things would look very different if Israel was carpet bombing), what it means is that the Palestinians will have to fend for themselves or turn to Egypt. Israel is done supplying them with electricity and water (which it has done even with the Hamas government, even with the missiles).

No more work permits to work in Israel. No more treatment in Israeli hospitals (you know, like the treatment of the granddaughter of the Hamas leader https://apnews.com/article/bfddfc52de874861aa9c39cd08fcf8b9)

It's very sad but not sure what choice Israel has now. It would be one thing if Hamas was a fringe group. It's not, it has massive support in Gaza and would win elections if held tomorrow. Gazans support armed struggle against Israel and a repeat of the Hamas (except it wasn't just Hamas, Islamic Jihad and even ordinary Gazans all joined in the killing, looting and kidnapping) massacre is very likely.

If they hate Israel so much, fine, it looks like they'll need to turn to Egypt for support and imports/exports and work or even build up their own economy. You can't always be a victim, sometimes you need to own your own ideology and the consequences of your (collective) decisions.

And please dont say 'But they can't, they had a blockade' when clearly they COULD since they had sophisticated weaponry with which to attack Israel and build their terror tunnels depiste an apparent blockade, when the quiet in Gaza before the massacre led to increasing exports through Israeli ports, increasing numbers of work permits to Israel and a hope that this would improve economic conditions in Gaza. What naive fools we were.

What Hamas did 2 weeks ago has changed things for ever. My own personal wish is that people will realise that Israelis and Palestinians are both here to stay and need to work things out (Israelis that occupation is not just and not sustianble and Palestinians that Israel is here to stay and they are not going back to the grandparents' villages from 1947) but I suspect that Israel will go further right and the left/peace camp further weakened and Palestinians will contiue to court Iran and Russia and become more religiously extreme. Israel is not going to turn back on the electricity for them.

Advice like this is why I’ve lost faith in humanity.

@Jelllytot the fact you’re so impacted shows you’re a human with a heart. Take a mental health break if you need to from the news but there’s lots you can also do if you want to help. You can donate to charities like UNICEF, PCRF and UNRWA who do a lot to support children in Gaza and elsewhere. You can also spread awareness about what’s happening so people understand the war crimes happening there and hopefully raise their voices for a humanitarian ceasefire.

Hamas is backed and supplied by a nuclear power, Iran. The reality is that since Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005, Hamas improved their weapons capabilities, increased coercive control of Gazans and Iran supplied them with more destructive weapons.

Hence blockade since Hamas came to power in Gaza. Never again will they be able to convince them world they're not interested in attacking Israel, only governing Gaza.

The role of Hamas and Iran is highly relevant here. Its naive to think various Palestinian leaders and terrorist groups haven't oppressed Gazans for their own ends. Terrorist groups that claim to defend their people usually oppress them, especially as their position is always unstable as Hamas' is due to popularity of Palestinian Islamic Jihad and Lion’s Den.

@SomeCatFromJapan is correct on this being a major factor. Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi believes if Palestinian areas had been demilitarised long ago there wouldn't be a war today. He's right.

Gaza is not a country. When will people understand that. It is a small territory of was Palestine where millions of displaced Palestinians made refugees by Israel live. It’s surrounded by a security perimeter controlled by Israel, and is totally dependent on Israel for the distribution of funds and access to basic humanitarian services. This is why describing this current genocide campaign as a ‘war’ is completely inaccurate - it’s not a battle between two nation states. One is a nuclear superpower the other is an open air prison controlled by its oppressor.

Exactly this.
The blockade of Gaza has made it very difficult for them to develop infrastructure and so Israel are obliged (as an occupying power) to provide them with water and electricity supplies. And yet you get posters acting as if they’re acting out of benign charity.

Very well argued! Fully agree. 👍

This is the usual portrayal of Palestinians as hapless victims, innocent and pure, lacking any agency in the face of the evil and cruel satanic Israel. The idea that bad Israel is entirely responsible for Hamas and the good Palestinians had absolutely nothing to do with it is both childish and ridiculous and absolves the Palestinian of any responsibility for their home-grown monster.

I guess ISIS was Israel's fault too? Islamic extremism is not restricted just to the Palestinians.

Hamas began blowing up buses and cafes in Israel in the 90s, intentionally to derail the peace process (and they were quite successful about it too) so if they were interested in helping their own people, this was a strange way to go about it. Their stated goal is the destruction of the State of Israel and replacement with an Islamic state.. And, silly me, I thought that being responsible for the wellbeing of 2 million people might change them, might make them accept the reality that Israel is here to stay, might make them more moderate - since they have to speak to Israel about keeping the water and electricity on, deal with waste management and sanitation - but I was so wrong and I feel that I was a naive fool. Hamas has always said what they want to do. Even now, they are still firing rockets to Israel. We should believe them and take them out their word.

Hence blockade since Hamas came to power in Gaza. Never again will they be able to convince them world they're not interested in attacking Israel, only governing Gaza.

The role of Hamas and Iran is highly relevant here. Its naive to think various Palestinian leaders and terrorist groups haven't oppressed Gazans for their own ends.

I don’t think Desertrose2023 was arguing Hamas are harmless rather that Gaza is not a country/state in its own right. That is quite relevant to the topic - the humanitarian crisis caused by Israel getting off essential supplies and blocking aid, which it can do because it controls most of Gaza’s borders (I’m aware Egypt is also guilty)

god the hasbara is out in force today

please continue to justify the actions of an apartheid state currently committing genocide.

I’ll just leave this here

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Cyo3DSZrJXu/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

On the contrary, they were downplaying the threat Hamas poses and not taking account of the security factor which ultimately explains the blockade around Gaza.

The political settlement cannot come about until the security threat is properly addressed. Even Egypt acknowledged that.

Furthermore, they ignore the oppression Hamas practices on their own in keeping with other terrorist groups to varying degrees. Hamas has control of life within Gaza.