To TTC or not to TTC, that is the question... as Hamlet sort of said about something else entirely

[CHW]

Hi,
Had few glasses of wine and have spent large part of the evening on this site. I am in two minds about a baby - or really, at the age of 35 (but Type 1 diabetic which can complicate thingss) and really ought to make a decision about whether to have a family or not.
I worry about cost, the changes it will make to our lives and, well, if I am actually just happy as I am. Me and DH discussed going for it, so to speak, sometime after the start of Aug (as did the London Triathlon before then so couldn't before then) and decided we would once the triathlon was out the way. Now it is and we are both stalling. But it is playing on both our minds - in the do we, or don't we way.

My babyometer keeps going haywire - any tips or things for me to also consider which may help us make a decision. I am also wondering if we are simply analysing things too much but beeing diabetic makes things more complicated (ie they need to be planned, in an ideal world at least.) Any help or food for thoughts would be MASSIVELY appreciated!

My mumsnet is fine, no crashing. However, thanks for poust but will have to respond tomorrow as dinner (when DH cooks we generally eat late) is about to be ready.
Till then - I know where you're coming from! Unfortunately...
Paws and Claws - do we need you now, or do we need you like a hole in the head...?

It seems better now.
Enjoy your meal - 'speak' later.

PS. Dont invoke P&C, bless her, she makes me want to throw my pill in the bin and buy little white vests....

Hellooo! Am back from a lovely birthday weekend camping in a tipi (camping without the bad bits, like packing up or leaking tents) in Cornwall. We couldn't take the dog (which is such as shame as she'd have loved it) so went on our own. It was great not having the responsibility but did feel like something major was missing too.

One thing DH said (as well as asking, out the blue, if I liked the name Charlotte) was that it was great that we could get pissed if we wanted to and not have to worry about children, he also then asked me if I would ever get pissed in front of the kids. I explained that no, I was unlikely to largely due to the responsibility of looking after said kids - and said we are actually quite similar with our dog (ie need to bear in mind we have have to look after her and be aware of what she needs and I think that looking after a child would increase this tenfold.) He seemed to get the idea, but was a bit too, er, pissed for the conversation to move on any further.

Today I am on a very pale red, so perhaps we ought to call it pink. This is an especially good thing as I have just got back from the weekend and realised I haven't (out of normal routine etc as been away) taken my pill since Friday. And, as we've been away for the weekend sans dog... well, you get the idea.
Will make docs appt on Monday to get this folic acid. I have been on the pill previously (came off it for 9ish months when I got told I can't take it any more due to age and being diabetic but was given 3 months supply when triathlon training so didn't have any 'accidents' with condoms - ugh, hate them - in the meantime) and never forgot it, but after the break I seemed to have been a bit rubbish. Actually, better to say relatively rubbish - I don't want to sound like I only take one out of every four!

DH and I briefly discussed baby things and he said that if I really REALLY wanted to he would want to too, and I said the same would go for me. Thing is, neither of us want to take that leap; having a lovely weekend on our own was great, and rare, and I loved the idea of being able to do what we wanted when we wanted and not having to consider or look after anyone else. The idea of naff family friendly holidays, keeping kids entertained on long journeys - and on holiday, getting up stupidly early due to them, school runs, houses full of 'stuff' and all the reasons that would take pages and pages to list have no appeal whatsoever. But! There is something niggling all the time... I also think you lot can relate to this - after all, there wouldn't be a thread otherwise - and thank god I'm not the only one!

Better go - DH here

Oh god, the little white vests (@HP). They are a killer. My friend has the most beautiful photo of her first daughter in one and it makes me broody even thinking about it.

Very very glad you had a good birthday weekend, Confused - so well deserved after everything you've been going through. Sounds fab. Have also had a great time in Northumbria with DH and friends walking in Cheviots and eating and drinking too much. Similar feelings about kids curbing all this. (Obviously you'll notice contradiction with great non-drinking resolutions in previous post, ho ho - but this was always going to be a boozy weekend as after big deadline and conference, and with slightly wild friends. Only excuse is AF, which means I take the opportunity to drink as I know there's no chance of conceiving anyway! I wasn't quite as bad as I might have normally been - but realize this sounds somewhat hollow...)

Good luck with the doc, C, and further discussions with DH (if you want them right now). Sounds like you've got a great thing going there, which is good whether or not you decide to enlarge the household!

Hi LST,

Yes, the little white vests. Didn't give them a thought until HoneyPetal (rather than 'PawsandClaws') mentioned them... oh oh!

Your weekend sounds great too - in a child free, and responsibility free way. It's fab! However, and bear with me if this sounds bonkers, I feel as if having a dog has put us half way there on the path to children anyway as they are such a big responsibility. I, also, loved her not being there in short bursts (like when we were sat in the pub and not having to worry about how much longer she'd sit still for) but most of the time it was like something was 'missing.' I imagine not having your child with you would be even more of a big deal.

Yup, calls tomorrow re docs as it needs to be done. Not that either of us want to take the more serious step of going to a, eek, Diabetes Pre Natal Clinic (yes, hear those capitals!) but this is a happy medium.

Ah, there's nothing like little white vests! Especially the tiny baby ones. Worn by a tiny baby snuggled on your DH's/DP's chest, making snuffly noises and that tiny vulnerable head with just a bit of downy baby hair...

Sorry, was passing and spotted my name - couldn't resist dropping in! How are you all?

Oh no, it's PawsandCClaws! Do you realise what you've done to all of us?!

Dear me! I'm not an especially soppy person but my god, I think you've been on some kind of conception encouragment course!

Excuse me while I go and molest DH...

Oh yes, and to answer your question (and keeping things relevant to the post) I or we are fine but as indecisive as ever! The longer you think about it, I am finding, the more tricky it gets...

P&C - am now thinking about your post. You bugger!

It is tricky definitely and you certainly do right to ponder it thoroughly cos there's no going back afterwards (or duvet days, or lie-ins, leisurely soaks in the bath unless pre-arranged with OH as is right and fair. Etc etc).

However the lovely bits are indeed lovely. I advise you not to look at the sad songs thread, particularly not the words to Baby Mine. No honestly, don't.

Oh for gods sake!
You know exactly what I am dying to do now!

More seriously, you seemed to have hit a nerve. I am not sure if I am pleased about this or not, but you have hit a nerve nonetheless. I think the older you get the more you think about what you will forfeit and the more you tie yourself in knots. I also suppose this is 'normal' but it is such a scary and big thing I can't really get my head around it. Suppose that's 'normal' too...

Just read the Puff the Magic Dragon Thread.
I hope you can sleep at night Ms Pawsandclaws.

Hello fellow dithers,

I've just joined MN and have been reading this thread. I think I may have found my natural home. I am in my 30s and have discovered that I do have a clock and it?s starting to tick loudly. I came off the pill 12 months ago, primarily because I'd forgotten to make an appointment at the docs to get some more and DH and I had a brief chat and both decided that it wouldn't be a disaster if I got pregnant so we'd just see what happened.

However, there have been times when I've faked a headache at the (supposedly!) fertile times of the month, cos I wasn't really sure if I really wanted a baby. But recently I have swung the other way. I've read the traumatic birth accounts; but the words of Pawsandclaws lovely posts seem to have more effect at the moment. A few weeks ago my best friend told me she was pregnant. As you?d expect at my time of life, friends have been producing babies regularly for a while and I have been unmoved, but this time I was taken aback by the fierceness of my reaction. I was and am thrilled for her, but at the same time I was totally gutted. When I got home, I wept all over a bemused DH (who assumed I wasn?t really that bothered about having kids, based on all the stuff I?d said previously) and said I wanted a baby, because I?d feel like I?d failed as a woman if I didn?t!

So I think I?ve moved from a pretty consistent amber, to a GREEN GREEN GREEN all systems go, let?s make a baby stage. But I suspect in a couple of week?s time, I may be back to wondering whether it?s such a great idea, and it?s a huge, life-changing decision that shouldn?t be taken lightly and maybe I?m just not ready. So I don?t want to loiter on a thread where highly motivated women are taking pregnancy tests every couple of weeks (I didn?t even know you could test before a late period!) but figured I might be able to chip in here a bit. Much of the discussion here mirrors my own indecisiveness and it?s a bit of a relief to find others who are fluctuating between being broody and terrified!

Anyway, I didn't intend to be so effusive and its way past bedtime, so I'll leave it there...

Hello to YTD - sounds like you're in exactly the same boat as many of us. If possibly a bit 'greener' (i.e. keener) than some of us have been of late... Good luck with the decision - and welcome to the Indecision Club! And hello again P&C - confirming with your posts that we all have it in us to be exceptionally pro-babies now and then, at least!

It's interesting, Confused, what you say about the dog. We've never contemplated getting one, despite both liking them at least mildly, because of both being out, and sometimes away, for work so much (and occasionally for pleasure), and because of the whole commitment, tying-us-down thing in general - exactly why we're dithering over children, in essence, but no one makes you feel guilty about not owning a dog. I think DH and I would know a lot more about our own capacity to raise and enjoy raising a child if we had a dog or some comparable pet (though dog probably the closest thing - except perhaps chimpanzee!). And on the positive front, it would make DH realize that we could add to the household, and that it could a) feel normal, and b) be a source of pleasure. All hypothetical, of course, btu it's interesting to think about the analogy - and very interesting what you say about it.

Anyway, thanks all - Monday afternoon marches on!

Welcome YTD!
A woman after our own hearts I feel. I agree, it's good to know there are many others who feel the same way. I think you may be further on the track to TTC than the rest of us, but perhaps only just. I really should be a bit more proactive about the medical side of things but somehow that makes it just too official and I don't want to take that plunge.
However, due to the evil Pawsandclaws I am currently on a bright green - but this may change after tomorrow (maybe I ought to log onto the birth trauma website again...)

Levi, re the dog analogy - I am glad you could see where I was coming from. It really is good 'training' for a baby; not that I am suggesting you all go to the RSPCA to find out if you'll make good parents, but they do add a hell of a lot of responsibility to your life (and are very rewarding making the hard work worth it ten times over.) We couldn't imagine not having her now, and wonder what we did with ourselves before we did.

Afternoon ladies,

I'm still feeling pretty green, but am slightly concerned that I'm more bothered about finding out if I'm actually capable of conceiving than actually wanting the baby at the end of it all!

However, maybe I shouldn't be on the indecivie thread at all, cos at the moment I am pretty sure that even though:
a) there will never be a good time
b) we'll never be able to afford it
c) I couldn't function on the tiny amount of sleep new parent expect to get
d) I'm quite attached to my pelvic floor
e) I know in my head that babies lead to poverty, sleep deprevation and a complete lack of control over life as I know it,

I am still being manipulated by some underlying hard wiring, that I never knew was there until I got to 32, that says I am a woman, I must bear children!!

Humm, maybe I should spend some more time on the birth trauma website. I know I'm a definately in a very green phase at the moment, and so am probably guitly of touting pro-conception propaganda, but maybe the fact that we are all airing our TTC indecisiveness on a Mum'sNet forum, suggests that even our red days are greener than we think?

I agree, our red days must be greener than we think / admit as otherwise we wouldn't be on here.

Am with you on all counts re having a baby, from pelivc floors to lack of sleep but suspect being 35 last Friday has made me more into the green zone than the red. I also don't know if I can or how long it will take (obviously - would be great if you could) which makes me want to get cracking. However, I also rather like the idea of lazy weekend lie in's and also finishing my book (writing one, not one I am reading.) Swings and roundabouts, eh?!

I've fallen very much into the time to get cracking, cos it probably won't happen as quickly as you think way of thinking. And the fact that we haven't been Not Preventing Pregnancy for a year and yet I'm not pregnant suggests it might not always happen when you decide you're ready. Its all a bit ironic really, you spend your 20s in mortal fear of getting pregnant and then when you decide that maybe it might not be such a bad thing after all, it turns out its not actually that easy!(Although a 35 year old friend of mine concieved within 3 weeks of coming off the pill, so you can just never tell!).

Maybe pregancy would be a beneficial thing from the book writing prespective? In my (limited) experince, there's nothing like the immovable deadline of a birth due date to get people using their time wisely and finishing outstanding projects (usually DIY related) cos they know they won't have the time once the baby arrives? At least I'm hoping that will happen to DH if I ever get to the being pregnant stage !

Wow. Lots of posts! Welcome, YTD, great to have you here. A couple of people are posting on our indecisive thread while TTC, so you arent alone! In fact, it seems we have all felt better knowing we arent the only ones struggling with this decision. The yelling of Mother Nature vs. the sneaky pleasures of a childfree life....its a difficult one alright.

Hi to all. And the invocation worked, I see P&C has been visiting. Cripes. The bit about the tiny baby snuggling into DHs chest? Ohhhhhhhhhhh.

Which brings me onto the reason for my absense...huge row with DH. Started off pretty much about nothing, then kinda escalated. I feel so frustrated at the moment, have no idea where we are going or what the future holds, and he never gives any of it a second thought. And over the weekend there was another 'childcare costs are obsene and ridiculous' comment. Anyway, you dont want to listen to my problems, but safe to say, am on red red red.

Confused - was your appointment for the mahusive folic acid today?

PS. And C, happy birthday for Friday - hope it was a good one in your tipi, sounds great!

Hi HP and thanks for the birthday wishes. The weekend was top, although weird going without the dog - felt like we were missing something.

The folic acid appt is a week Thursday. Feel a bit ridiculous as the nurse probably expects a bit mote commitment and, really, I don't want to go for the pre natal counselling and so on, I just really want the folic acid just in case! She wants me and DH to go to the hospital, have lots of tests (me, not DH) and be talked through all the ins and outs of a 'diabetic pregnancy.' This, for a ditherer like me, is waaaay too serious! Being diabetic doesn't bother me at all, apart from when people confuse Type 2 (ie the one linked with unhealthy lifestyle and / or obesity), but it sure is with this. I think it makes it all so real and, stupid as it sounds, as if we now have to go ahead with it if we go for the tests etc. So, I am going to tell the nurse all this a week Thursday and see what happens. I have no idea what she'd say or suggest but am also hoping that, as I am fit healthy and well controlled, I don't need the hospital appt - FINGERS CROSSED.

Sorry to hear about the big row HP. I am starting to get the impression that this baby situation is potentially very volatile (say, a dormant volcano?) and needs to be sorted before it gets worse. To use your phrase, the yelling of mother nature is hard to ignore and it would be better to have some kind of a plan, even if it's a little vague, to help with things. I hope things can move forward soon and don't fester - feel free to vent any timee (though can't promise I'll be much help!)

Hi HP, thanks for the welcome, its nice to be here. Sorry to hear things have been a bit pants for you this weekend.

Confused, I don't think that the appointment means you have to go ahead and start TTC. Your medical condition means you have to do a bit more up front preparation. All you're doing is making sure you are equipped to respond when Mother nature's yelling gets too loud to ignore.

Good way of putting it YTD! I shall use those exact words next week!

I agree, having the appointment is info-gathering and exploration of options. And also for horse pill sized folic acid, which it certainly wont hurt to take if the pill avenue is running out. Are they cutting you off soon, the bastards?

I was thinking, we have some actual people actually TTC actual babies on this thread - could it be that we get a BFP on here? That would be very cool.

I feel a bit better today - thanks so much for the kind words and ears to bend. You are so right, Confused, I think the baby situation is very volitile and is no-where close to be being sorted out. I just dont believe him when he says that he will be 100% behind me (eek!) if I want to go for it. The snitty comments and total lack of interest at all other times tell me otherwise. It makes me feel so uncomfortable that I darent listen out for Mother Nature.

Regards having pets. We have cats and we both love 'em, they are part of our little family. I tried to tell him a baby is a lot like a kitten, but he didnt quite believe me!

Oh, HP, so sorry to hear about the row. I really sympathize - it's almost the only source of tension with us (too) these days and it's just horrible at times. The fact that he (yours) says he will be supportive, despite his actions not always backing this up, is a big deal - so many men would never say this in a million years. And I keep trotting out all the old assurances (to myself as much as anyone) that they do get on board, usually cheerfully, when it's a reality, and are almost always besotted. But it makes it very difficult when we too have mixed feelings.

To echo YTD, it's perfectly reasonable to get the folic acid, and even have the tests, without this meaning you have to start trying immediately, Confused - it might be good to be completely prepared, and then to see how you feel, which might tell you something. It wouldn't hurt, anyway. But absolutely your prerogative to decide not to, or not to right now.

Well, have booked appointment with fertility doc to talk about IVF. Have also given up alcohol for a month (possibly more) - don't think this will have miraculous results, but have had quite a boozy time over last fortnight or so, so it isn't a bad plan anyway, TTC or not. So it looks like I'm back to green, at least in deeds if not - consistently - in spirit. But 37 and 4 years of trying, albeit rather lacklustrely (is that a word?!) to start with - I think it's now or never. Gulp. (Actually, I say 'now', but even if we put ourselves onto the IVF waiting list, it will probably be months long so I shouldn't get too excited/scared!)