TTC for 10 months or more, and now we're moving onto thread 4! Ten plussers welcome!

[MPP81]

Thread for anyone TTC for over ten months. Please feel free to join us!

Took the liberty of starting a new thread (with what is obviously a brilliant piece of rhyme!) as I assume everyone else is sleeping peacefully right now :)

FYI, esp for lucie and trixie who asked

Immunes results came back as broadly normal - no obvious red flags. We'll treat empirically with pred / intralipids / clexane etc, but no massive concerns about any particular issues that might require a higher dose :

"The results show a marginally elevated NK concentration (whilst % of NK cells was normal); NK cells cytotoxicity and cytokine levels are within (or below) reference values."

So desperately hoping it's a chromosomal issue, and that if we put a good one back (and cover all our bases with immunes tx, thyroxine, ABs to clear ureaplasma, hysteroscopy etc), I hopefully have a good chance of a live birth

Still crapping it about tomorrow, but less than I was an hour ago....

That all sounds quite positive Banana. Best of luck for tomorrow.

Banana best of luck for tomorrow. Roll on an end to this ordeal for you. I hesitate to comment as I know so little but a chromo issue seems the most likely thing - fingers tightly crossed for you and Mr Banana.

Itsme - hurray for some action after such a long wait, exciting! Look forward to hearing more.

Lucie, sending good vibes and sticky wishes - sounds good so far.

Brenna, ouch. I can see why you're not relishing your visit under those circumstances. Have a hug and from me for your due date approaching. Can I say that your dog sounds as if he's trying to defend you ...?!

AFM I am pretty sure I had implantation bleeding last night. One big brown spot, day 20 of 28-day cycle. I can't believe I am even mentioning this as I am so over symptom-spotting and implantation bleeding is the Lough Ness Monster of symptoms. And also, crucially: I have had it 3 times already over the past year or so and it never leads to anything, not even a chem pregnancy. So it might not be that at all. Or it might be that I have a problem with implantation, maybe due to endometriosis? Or it might just be pre-menstrual spotting (though I don't think so, as it's always a week before period). Mentioned it to several doctors and nobody has ever given the smallest shit about it, so it's probably nothing. Gaah. But now it's got me thinking. And hoping. Which is the worst! Oh well, whatever. It can f*ck off.

Hope everyone else is well - oh and congrats on scan Boris!

Banana, that's brilliant news! At least you can put your mind at rest a little now about immune issues but great that you will be treated empirically anyway. That and tested embryos should give you a brilliant chance!

Rebecca, fingers crossed for implantation bleeding for you!

Thanks Lucie. I'm not crossing much though as I've had it 3/4 times and there's never anything. But it's got me scared now that this is the reason I can't get pregnant. Repeated implantation failure. The idea - which of course I could be imagining - that these are healthy potential embroys that repeatedly can't implant because of my toxic womb/endo is really scary to me. I'm feeling a bit tearful now and I have to go out to a meeting. Ugh.

Sorry, don't mean to hijack the thread. I just wish I could speak to a doctor about this but they are just not interested ime - or maybe I've tried the wrong ones (GP and two registrars).

Aww Rebecca, I wouldn't go thinking too much into it. It can be perfectly normally to have a little bit of spotting before af where your hormones naturally fluctuate during your cycle. Have you had the initial testing of fsh, LH, progesterone etc by your gp? Sorry I'm not really up to date with where you are with ttc.

Hello Ladies, sorry for the silence recently. I've been trying to not focus so much on ttc and we are refurbishing our house (well, 'furbishing' maybe after buying a wreck in December) so trying to google interiors rather than infertility every waking minute.
Anyway, I've been keeping up with you all as much as I can.
Lucie, I'm so so pleased the bleeding has stopped. I have my fingers crossed for good news on Wednesday.
Oh banana, this limbo is so rubbish. I really hope your levels start dropping much quicker soon so you can get going. Good news on the immunes testing though. I really do think it will be a chromosomal issue - that is the most likely scenario.
Stealth, how exciting your transfer is just around the corner! I'm all geared up for the first bfp of the new thread. Good luck!!!
Mpp, wow congratulations on the essay that's amazing! I thought our last cycle started on the same day and my period finished yesterday, so could you possibly be.... late?? I didn't think you had long cycles.
Rebecca, fingers crossed it's implantation and you get a bfp in a few days. If not, the 40th holiday sounds great. I decided to stop putting anything on hold and it really does help. On Thursday I'm off to Gothenburg for a hen do and last month I went to a big party in Barcelona- both things I'd have the either cancel or do very differently if I got pregnant, but they really sweeten the pill of yet another cycle. I'm on month 17 now, it's getting soooo boring.
Itsme, amazing news! I'm so excited for you to get started!

Brenna, that sounds stressful with your mum. Hope the weekend passes quickly and without incident.
Boris, lovely news I'm so happy for you!

As for me, we've just passed the three month mark on proxeed and I find I'm too terrified to do another SA! So I haven't picked up the charting or anything and I'm just going to wait for our next nhs appointment in 4 weeks and discuss ivf then. Just added coenzyme q10 into the mix for both of us last weekend but too soon to have any effect yet.

Sorry, been awol! Think I've caught up...

Great news Boris

Congratulations on your distinction MPP

Hi Lucie lovely to hear from you. I agree with Sammy re getting a scan done. Great that the bleeding has reduced, everything crossed here for good news. I remember reading about the clear blue digis being unreliable, try and ignore.

Great news about your results Banana glad you're feeling a bit better about tomorrow. So that would be 6 tested blasts? I've been wondering about whether we'll do as well on this fresh cycle as last cycle, it's been nearly a year but I'm hoping we'll get a similar number, fingers crossed you do too. It's frustrating that you can't test blasts that have already been frozen. We've got 5 but 2 from the same batch have already fallen victim to my stupid NK cells so no idea how many (if any) are normal.

Good luck for Friday Stealth!

Sorry you're having a tough time Rebecca, I think with long term ttc/fertility treatment you start to question absolutely everything.

AF arrived here on Sunday so I am on day 3 of bcp. It's been ages since I took the bcp and it is making me feel a bit nauseous, hopefully this is just temporary. Due to have my scan on the 25th and hopefully will get going with injections very soon after.

I'm still undecided re the clexane and gestone. DH thinks we should just go with what the NHS suggest. I need to contact the Dr. to let him know whether I want to go with Healthcare at home for the intralipids or go to another clinic so will bring it up again and then accept what he says. I was debating arranging a telephone appointment with Dr. Gorgy to run things past him but I couldn't 100% follow him at our meeting before so not sure if it would end up being a waste of money.

Out of interest Lucie and Sammy do you remember how long after stopping cyclogest that AF arrived after your cycles? On my first cycle AF arrived the next day which seemed very soon though at the time I was pleased to get it out of the way!

Yay for hitting the 3 month proxeed mark Star!

Big waves to everyone else!

Trixie, I don't know how long after stopping cyclogest af would arrive as on my first transfer af arrived before or pretty much on OTD and this is my second transfer which fortunately I didn't need to stop taking them. Really glad you don't have too long to wait now until you can get going!

Star, sounds like you have been keeping busy! Have a lovely time in Gothenburg. Not long until your next appt now either. It's all happening on here!

Are you taking Gestone as well this time Lucie?
I asked Dr. Sher and he said it would be advisable for me to have injections in addition to the pessaries. I have one injection left over from last time. I think if my Dr. won't prescribe them then I will have to ask my private clinic for a prescription. It's all so complicated!

Yes I'm taking both Trixie. I think it's worth it to be honest as you can't have too much progesterone but if you have too little then it can obviously affect things. Would it be a problem getting a private prescription?

It shouldn't, I think we would just have to pay £25.00 for a private prescription. Though I guess they may want me to wait and have a blood test to check my levels before transfer which could be difficult logistically. Last time I had to go back twice after transfer to have my levels checked and they upped my injections so it was all pretty stressful. Will see what the Doctor at the hospital says first though. We've got time to get it sorted since I won't start stimms for a few weeks.

Thanks Rebecca. I have just realised that this is my last chance at being pregnant again before my due date comes up as I am halfway through my TWW and my due date is at the start of my next TWW. This is even more depressing. DDog was very badly abused and had multiple homes before I got him at 4. He is very defensie of both me and the house, so I think a lot of his worry with mum is to do with that as she lives in France so only turns up once every couple of years and then acts like she is part of the household, which she is to us humans but not to the poor dog. This will probably be the last time she sees him though as he is very old and decrepit now.

I agree with Lucie, my cycles changed the second we started TTC and changed even more after my m/c. So I would try not to read anything into changes as they may mean nothing and then you are torturing yourself over nothing. That said I really hope this is your month.

Trixie - I used my last pessary on Wednesday morning, and AF arrive Saturday afternoon. So 2.5 days ish I think. Xx

Thanks Sammy and Lucie!

So ladies, hope you don't mind but this is my list of points to raise with the consultant on Friday. Please comment freely if you think there's more I should be saying!

1. my lining. I'm not happy with 7mm, and actually even when I got ohss it was still only 7.3mm. Why is this? Surely with enough estrogen to cause ohss it should have been better than that? I've heard of people getting 14mm!
   What can we do to increase it more?

2. further tests.
   What further tests do they offer? Immunes?
   Hardly ever get ill. Actually had my first cold in years on Sunday and it's already pretty much gone.
   I know NHS won't do immune tests, so how much with our clinic?

3. if we do the immune testing and it shows an issue will the NHS pay to treat it? If not can we pay privately alongside our NHS round?

4. will they prescribe the immune drugs privately without doing the testing so we can use them alongside NHS round just in case?

5. What will we do differently to reduce the risk of ohss? Concerned about embryo numbers.

That's what I have so far. What else should I ask? More details? Xx

sammy I'll reply properly when I'm at the computer, but just to say this guide to questions to ask after a failed cycle is VERY comprehensive:

www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=283000.0

Banana - thank you for the link. Interesting read, although a lot of its slightly over my head.

I'm so sorry I've not been around to help others out as much as I should. I'm really struggling at the moment with feeling empty in my childless life. I'm also terrified at the prospect of trying again in case I fail, but equally terrified that the dr will say we're going to have to wait ages. Basically my heads a mess. Xx

Hi all! Sorry for delayed check in, have been swanning around doing my pre-FET preparations (read: booze, soft cheese, sushi, hot baths, lots of jumpy exercise etc) - it's not text book, but trying to get it out of my system!

boris so pleased the scan went well, hurrah!

lucie and banana good luck for your respective appointments tomorrow. Try to get some sleep tonight!

sammy sorry to hear that you're struggling. That fertility friends list is amazing. But your shortlist of questions is a great start.

hi to everyone else, sorry am on phone so struggling to see all the posts! Hope you're all well & enjoying this beautiful balmy day

Sammy, I think your list covers the main points. I think the most important thing is your lining but it good to find out all about the immunes too and what can be done to reduce ohss. Sorry to hear you are struggling at the moment. It's so hard I know but keep focused. This appt is the next step and hopefully you will find out lots of useful info. It's all any of us can do is keep trying until we eventually get that baby in our arms which I'm sure is going to happen for all of us.

Stealth, I'm liking the sound of the pre fet preps! Make the most of it!

I've finally had a spotting free day today which is nice! Nothing at all. Just need to get this scan over tomorrow. It's so so scary! I've convinced myself I have a blighted ovum or something.

Thank you both. I'm worried the consultant won't listen about the lining. They seem so confident that 6.5mm is enough. I'm just praying my acupuncture will help a little, along with diet changes and weight gain (I'm still trying!).
How important do you think the immunes tests are? Or is the general consensus here that it's my crap lining that is stopping me getting pregnant? I didn't have an immune response after transfer (no cold etc.).

Lucie - keeping everything crossed for tomorrow for you. What time is the scan?
How many weeks are you? 6? Xx

Sammy, I think the lining may be more of a problem for you than immunes but saying that I would push to get some sort of immune treatment added on a just incase basis if you can. It can't hurt.

My scan is not until 6.20pm tomorrow so I have to get through a full day in work first. I will be 6w4d tomorrow.

Sammy I'm so sorry for your situation It's such a hard lonely slog. I've only been at it 15 months and it feels like forever so can't imagine how hard it must be for you. It sounds like you're doing all the right things. Fingers crossed.

Brenna, I can understand wanting to be pregnant again with your due date rolling around, it's so cruel. Hoping for better things for you and that the weekend goes quickly.

Thanks for the advice, all, feel calmer now. Trixie you're right I'm just second guessing everything, especially as we're unexplained. Lucie, I've had all scans including Hycosy, awaiting IVF in June. Best of luck for your scan tomorrow, really really hoping all will be well for you.

Sorry for not a proper reply to everyone - will reply properly with personals tomorrow when back from appt

sammy I would agree with lucie. Immunes may be a belt and braces 'just in case' but i would have thought the lining would be a much more significant barrier to implantation failure than immunes

7mm is a minimum, my consultant said he has had pregnancies at that with ovulation induction cycles, but he said 8mm was best and 9mm was optimal. Dr Sher writes a lot about it - I know there was no way I could have conceived naturally with a thin lining, so if you are in the unexplained category, it's more than reasonable that lining issues could be a reason why you've ended up again IVF. Which is also eminently fixable with the right approach that really focuses on optimising the lining.

Tbh I'd want to be pretty direct and say if it's not the lining, why do they think you haven't been able to conceive naturally and why has nothing implanted. It can't just be egg quality as whilst two blasts could be unlucky, it's unlikely that every egg you've ovulated since starting TTC would be chromosomally abnormal

If they think the lining isn't an issue, what do they think is?

Thank you Rebecca and Banana.

Banana - I'm going to write down your response to read to the consultant. My biggest problem is I normally end up in tears and so no one takes me seriously! DH might have to do the talking! Xx