smack those rats, sniff those drugs; we dont care how, but we will get our babies and we are BROOKING NO ARGUMENT

[keepitgoing]

roll up roll up

thanks loopy, it was more the living in another country issue I was thinking of. Definitely something for me to think about, though I think our problem is more likely just getting a decent quality embryo. Our new dr said that she wasn't sure that they would have tried to grow our previous embryos to 5 days, as she wasnt sure there were enough good quality at 2 days. Though who knows what will happen with this cycle. [fingers crossed]

beedles I think you go to The Wellington hospital on a Saturday, they do hysteroscopy and scratch at the same time, when I was cycling at ARGC lots of the girls did that as it was then covered by health insurance whereas it woul dnot have been if carried out at an ivf clinic.

keep brooking like mad for your last frostie!

imps are you sure you don't want to do Coventry tests first? Just thinking if you have one free round left, you would kick yourself if a simple steroid tablet would make the difference between success and failure? I am a big believer in immunes therapy in pregnancy and I think in a few years time it will become normal and accepted as the studies start to come out!

All well here, 31 weeks (!) and the nesting has started to kick in, the house is a mess and I just need a week of work to sort everything out as I am too tired in the evenings to tackle it and I want to play with little far at the weekends, not spend my precious free time sorting out old clothes!
She is enjoying nursery although is still a bit wobbly at drop off times until they distract her with some sort of activity.
I have a consultant appointment this PM to discuss c section, am nervous!!!

Ooh far not long now. When do you stop work? Remind me, is it a boy and do you know the haemophiliac status pre birth?

Just back from dildocam, all good with lining 9.4mm, EC set for 10.10 on Saturday. Come on emby!!!!

Thanks far I think that is something I will want to do at teh beginning of next year, if all goes really well with this round they won't actually put any embryos back straight away (there is not enough time to do teh testing, so any blasts will be frozen and put back later) So it could end up being a waste of time getting a scratch done now. And if i doesn't go as well and we only get a 2 day embryo to put back I might have more chance at persuading my own dr to do a scratch here (and if she says no we'll just have to have a few days in London :o )

I can't believe you're 31 weeks, hope you're not working too much longer.

keep woohoo great lining, fingers well and truly crossed for Saturday

keep that sounds very promising! You mention EC is this a fresh round then?

So we know its a boy but I have refused the amnio that would determine the status pre birth so instead they test the baby when he is born although apparently they test again at 6 months anyway because your factor 8 levels can pass to the baby during labour/delivery and artificially elevate them and give a false negative. I am not too worried about the actual haemophilia as the strain in our family is mild and therefore should not impact his day to day life too much if he does have it, he won't be playing rugby for England though.

beedles I think Lister might also do a scratch for you but you are right, I think it only lasts 3 months so you have to time it right!!

Plan is to stop work at 38 weeks if I can, our mat leave is terrible, 6 weeks pay and then statutory so I can't really afford to stop too early.

Gah, ET not ec. Is a natural fet cycle

Oh yes, the dreaded 2ww: the time when your body decides to go all random and throws you a load of red herrings just for fun!

Had another puppy comment from MIL today - dd2 said she would love to have a puppy and MIL said 'No, you don't!' We already have an elderly dog (who is like another child to me. I loves her so much). So I said to dd2 that MolotovDog was a puppy once and of course will will have a puppy again one day :-)

far, would this be a first CS for you? Are you requesting one, or are you being requested to have one?

You're right Far, maybe I will. How do I go about getting me an appointment - can you link to contact details??

31 weeks already!!!! How lovely and so exciting :)

Sorry, last message sounds like I'm asking you to run around and find contact details for me Far - what I mean is that although I hear about tests happening "in Coventry", I don't know where in Coventry they happen. Is it the Lister (although I thought that was in London?). I'll do some web-based research later.

Imps it's called the Coventry implantation clinic, which is linked to Warwick university. If you google it, it should come up, professors Quenby and brosens, and it's a woman called Kerri that you email. I don't have the details myself as I haven't been yet but I gather Google should bring up loads re them and their work.

They have a standard treatment protocol for everyone to be on progesterone and heparin/clexane until I believe circa 12 weeks. Then if your tests show high NK cells they also prescribe prednisolone. Quite a lot of hospitals are supporting their work and protocol now. I know of someone who had 2 or 3 miscarriages who got Hinchingbrooke to agree to the progesterone and clexane, and she is I think about 17 weeks pregnant now. Not sure re Addenbrookes though

Or would it be Rosie? Not sure as never went to Cambridge, I was just Hinchingbrooke

Thanks Loopy Lou. I have found the details and will get in touch - I can't quite figure out how it all interacts with treatment at Bourn Hall etc. All v interesting though.

imps I think Quenby does a biopsy to check for NK cells in the womb. I never went this route but lots do, I just had the blood tests pre IVF at the ARGC. Lots of places do a blood test instead, I am sure you can find somewhere in Cambridge, in London I know Zita West clinic and Lister do these tests too (without doing iVF through them)!

You can do your own immune protocol alongside IVF at your clinic although some docs are very very sceptical on these tests!

I just phoned and spoke to Kerrie - it really is very straightforward isn't it? Will go not this ovulation but next, so that will be start Nov I think. Exciting!

Molotov this would be my first section.

DD was born via ventouse after a very long 2nd stage. She then had shoulder dystocia and it took 4 mins and a lot of different manoeuvres to release her. She was born crying and was fine and the doctor was so calm we had no idea how serious a complication this can be. It is only since going through my notes with a consultant that we have realised how things could have been very different, many babies have real difficulties including brain damage and nerve damage as well as a high mortality rate. So I just don't want to risk it again, esp as 2nd babies are often bigger and this baby could have haemophilia which would mean that a dystocia would be even more dangerous for him.
They have basically left it up to me to decide though. Initially I thought I would go the other way and try and have a very intervention free birth but there is just too much uncertainly for me in a natural birth and its making me anxious!

Far that sounds absolutely sensible and a good call. You always seem to do so much research and put so much thought into your decisions - no one could ever accuse of making rash or ill thought through decisions. You need calmness and peace of mind leading up to the birth, not anxiety and panic. A v good choice.

Oh and can you remember the names of the blood tests? Are they autoimmune systems tests? Sorry, I remain so clueless about this stuff. I'm not a stupid person but I simply cannot get to grips with anything remotely science/medicine-based.

Far, an ELCS sounds like the ideal mode of delivery given your circumstances.

I gave birth vaginally to dd1 and ran into some difficulties (long labour and delivery meant 'maternal exhaustion'; dd passed meconium; dd got stuck at the last hurdle which meant episiotomy (which took several months to recover from) and ventouse delivery. I suffered coccyx damage which I still have pain with).

The ELCS (at my request), whilst not exactly a breeze, was a much more pleasant and preferable mode of delivery for me - much easier and more predictable recovery than the vb. I could plan for the day of dd2's birth, the birth itself was fast and I was well cared for re. pain control, etc, the entire time. You just need to get the balance right between taking things easy, yet not grinding to a halt.

I'm happy to talk more about it if you'd like

Thanks Molotov that is exactly what I am hoping for! That is really very reassuring. So far I have arnica, peppermint capsules (for trapped wind!), biiiiig pants on the c section list. Also planning on doing nothing for 2/3 weeks and lucky to have my mother near by who will be delighted to be 'useful' and cook for us, do the laundry etc as I think its bending and lifting which is the worst thing you can do? My episiotomy was no picnic to recover from either so I feel your pain (literally!)

imps you are very kind, I think its partly my over anxious nature that makes me want to read everything I can about TTC etc. The tests you are looking for are usually called Natural Killer cells (NK Assay) or an Immunes Panel. I think they are sometimes called Level2 tests too. They cost a BOMB.

The Zita West Clinic seems to list them all on their website:

LEVEL 1

FBC, blood glucose, LFT’s, U&E’s, thyroid function – TSH, FT4, thrombophilia screen – anticardiolipin antibodies (IgG and IgM), antithrombin 111, factor V Leiden, factor II prothrombin gene, PAIP polymorphism, activated protein C resistance, Protein C/Protein S, lupus anticoagulant, MTHFR, autoimmune antibodies ( inc. anti-nuclear antibodies, thyroid peroxidase and anti-mitochondrial antibodies). £950.00

Thrombotic Risk Screen - FBC, anticardiolipin antibodies (IgG and IgM), antithrombin 111, factor V Leiden, factor II prothrombin gene, activated protein C resistance, Protein C, Protein S, lupus anticoagulant, MTHFR) £730.00

PAIP polymorphism £198.00

Autoimmune antibodies £138.00

LEVEL 2

a) - NK assay, TH1:TH2, intracellular cytokine ratio, HLADQ alpha) – female £935.00

HLADQ alpha - male £98.00

b) - NK assay, TH1:TH2 - for female partner only £837.00

HLADQ alpha £98.00

NK Assay £525.00

Follow-up NK Assay £422.00

TH1:TH2 £422.00

Leucocyte antibody - for female partner £235.00

Leucocyte antibody - for male partner No charge

All NK tests analysed in Chicago USA (fees include shipping)

Argh I didn't post earlier. I meant to say I agree far that sounds like a good choice. Scary for your first labour, do they know why it happened and are you more at risk of similar this time? When will they do your cs and will they still do it if you go into labour first?

Big 48 hours here. Tomorrow I have first a big presentation and then an interview for promotion in the afternoon, then FET on sat morning, eek

Arnica is good for some people, far, as it helps the blood to prevent clots. However, you would be wise to find out how viscous your blood is because if it is 'runny' (a very medical term my OB used to describe my blood's viscosity), it can hinder your blood from clotting, which isn't ideal when you need to stop bleeding.

I didn't know I had runny blood; fortunately I didn't take arnica because I wasn't sure if it was a load of old guff. But my OB asked if I'd taken arnica whilst trying to stop me bleeding during the CS because it was taking longer than usual. Turns out mine is down to diet and lifestyle and it was a good thing I hadn't taken it. I thought I'd say, anyway.

Conversely, I did not suffer from trapped wind at all! But peppermint capsules or tea is the right stuff if you do. And I loved lactulose, which is what you might be given to make going for a poo more comfortable (I was actually disappointed when my bottle ran out.)

Definitely no lifting (baby only for the first couple of weeks!) and bending for a while. Vacuuming is a huge NO for at least 6w as it uses all of your abdominal muscles in various twists and contractions. I had DH home with us for the first 2w - when I needed most help (cooking mostly - he did it all - and establishing routines); DM was with us during wk3, MIL wk4 (both helping lots with tidying, vacuuming, laundry and ironing) and I was on my own and driving from wk5.

The most uncomfortable days for me were the first couple of days, and then each day thereafter I felt better, bit by bit. Never refuse help during those first 6w and make every effort not to overdo things.

Good luck, keep

Omfg those tests!! Did you do them all far? Can you treat without testing?