TTC 10+++ months part 18

[Mrsden]

This is the BFP thread.

I hadn't heard of vena previa critter although I had heard that placenta previa was more common in ivf pregnancies because of where the embryo implants, I think this is why they try to transfer the embryo towards the back. It's just one of those very, very unlucky things and nothing anyone could have done to prevent it. I hope your obs can give you more detail and reassurance.

sea I think it depends on how you feel about your employer, do they treat you fairly? In my last job I would have told them because they were always kind and fair with me, treated me well, good terms and conditions etc. In my current job I don't feel the same, I know if I told them about the ivf then they would act like I'd already left. No opportunities or interesting projects etc. I guess another consideration is whether the new job would be more stressful and if you need this stress with a twin pregnancy. Only you know what's right for you.

Critter – goodness me, it must be so tough to hear what happened. I had no idea about vasa praevia and had no idea of the increased risk with ivf babies. What rotten, tragic luck. There presumably is no test that can be done to check the placenta is ok during pregnancy? I’m quite shocked that your insurance covers you for ivf but doesn’t cover you for grief counselling. That’s a heck of a lot of money so I am glad that you have found other outlets that are helping you through it. Writing things can be just as therapeutic. How is MrC coping?

Sea – that’s a tough one. I would always wait personally but i have a different history with pregnancies. I think you are well within your rights to not say anything but if you would prefer to be up front now, then perhaps you should tell them now. But don’t you have your own business or is this a job you will be taking on full time and for the long term? Sorry to hear about the nausea/sickness. That’s a good sign though and presumably this is now just morning sickness and not ohss? It’s funny how ten plussers will never complain about their morning sickness. When friends tell me they have been sick during pregnancy, I always tell them how lucky they are which I don’t think they ever get as they are normally looking for sympathy!

Free- it must be so nerve wracking and wishing you lots of luck for next scan.

Euro – do you think you are going to tell everyone after your next scan or are you going to do it on a need to know basis? I can’t imagine announcing anything until at least 20 wks...well only to very close friends and family. When do you need to let work know?

Ray – i guess the A* was one i was expecting. I wondered a few days ago when they would be announcing a pregnancy. Like you, I expect everyone to announce a pregnancy and funnily enough it felt like a punch in the stomach, a bit of an electric shock and then I wasn’t too bad. Just a tiny bit cross if I’m being honest! She told me perfectly though. She didn’t apologise for her pregnancy, she emailed me kindly and tactfully and said she knew it must be hard. I really appreciated that. I think it depends on the person as to how i feel. Some can sting for a week and i can feel so angry at the injustice and others i can actually feel really happy about. I guess one of the hardest things about all this , is knowing that old school friends are meeting up without us or throwing kids birthday parties and doing fun things together that we will never be a part of. I just keep on saying to myself it’s not my path and things will hopefully happen for us another time.

Ray (32) ttc close to 4 years. 2 rounds of ICSI ending in BFN. Waiting for FET.
Joy (34) – ttc 4 years. 1 natural m/c 4 yrs ago. Then infertility. Unexplained. 1st ivf ended in twin m/c at 10wks. ERPC. 2nd ivf ended in bfn. Now waiting for an ivf appt with nhs.

devon that's exactly how I think about school friends. Although the reality is that I think that people actually operate in their own little family units and I think the socialising is in my imagination. I have two best friends from school that I'm still in close contact with, both have children but I don't think they hang out together or at least I'm not aware that they do. One of my friends told me that she doesn't actually enjoy spending time with other parents because of the competitive "my kid is more advanced than yours". I think she genuinely prefers to spend time with me because she knows she won't get that and we don't talk about babies. I actually think being a parent might be lonelier in terms of friendships. I know my mum always said that she hated being forced into friendships and socialising with my friends' parents.

Critters – I am sorry you had rough morning. What you are feeling is perfectly natural. You have been through something terrible. You are dealing with is so admirably. Crying can be a release. I know some people try to avoid tears and pain but I think it’s important to let it out.
I am shocked that the grieve counselling is so expensive and it’s not covered by your insurance. I am glad you found the private forum, here and your family/friends a good source of support. It’s so important to have people to talk to.

I have not heard of vasa praevia. How scary that it’s more likely because of ivf. Another reason why ivf ladies will never be a normal preggo.

Free – Congrats on reaching 12 weeks. I bet that’s somewhat of a weight off you mind but I understand the worries don’t end there. So what book is it that has the sexy bits if not Middlesex???

Devon – I agree with you about different reactions to A*. For older ladies who have been trying for a while I am usually v happy for them. The ones that get preggo on their honeymoon always make me a bit nervous. There are also those ones that pop one out one after the other and go on about having babies at convenient times of the year – I have no time for those at all I am afraid.

Ray – I agree with you about new mums who find it lonely. I think many actually do find it quite isolating. I have quite a lot of friends with babies and I still see them. It’s only one or two that stopped seeing me because I wasn’t a parent. TBH, I think that’s more their problem then mine.

Euro – I hear you on telling people. I have told only those very close who knew about the exact timing of my ivf. MIL knows and has no doubt told everyone. MrS can’t really keep a secret so I think he might have told others without my knowing. [sigh]

Thanks all for your good advice about job. I think I will accept and tell them when I get to 3 mths as it really is still v early days and a lot can happen (although touching wood it won’t). Devon – I will be closing up the business to take this job on a full time basis. It’s a career change for me that still utilises my contacts and skills in my current industry but also does social good as well.

Went to see my GP today to get a referral to hospital. She told me because I am ivf, having twins and old (I am just 36) I will be classified as “high risk”. I found this quite comical as when I was being considered for ivf on the nhs (last year) they considered me young…

Sea I do wonder at GP's sometimes, how is that comment supposed to help you at all? I would ignore her. How are you feeling? The job sounds interesting, I'm intrigued as to what you do now.

Ray I think that's very true about new mothers, I'm sure it's all harder than it looks. I think that's a great idea for a clutch of bfps to happen at the same time for everyone. When do you expect the test results? Would they add gestone into your regime? I'm convinced it does something to help the lining prepare properly.

Dev I'm so sorry for the announcement. It's so hard and so unfair. I think its true that how friends handle it can have a big impact on the friendship. one friend did a 'ive been dreading telling you' to me which really hurt. i did think of you recently when I was reading about prof quenby from warwick - she apparently thinks that some drugs like aspirin can cause some women more harm than good - everyone's different and I'm so intrigued and hopeful as to how you get on at a different clinic with a different approach.

Euro I'm very excited for you that the 12 wk scan is within touching distance. Hopefully you can start to really believe in it.

Critter your description of your craving James was so poignant. Do you find it comes in waves? I have thought that before about grief but what you're experiencing must be the toughest loss of all. £350 sounds extortionate, I wonder if there's any alternatives if you reached a point you wanted to explore that. Have you been out for any more walks at all? I'm so glad you've been exploring other forms of support and have found them helpful. Will you think about any holidays in the next few months at all? I completely agree about the physical ness that you were describing about the dogs, that's such an interesting concept. I've had many months where I've felt physically sad before I knew the outcome was definately bfn. I'm glad the midwife was informative.

Free fantastic you fit that far. I'm still intrigued as to the regime you followed?

Nelly I'm sorry for the overwhelming emotions, it's all so hard and a bit much sometimes. If I'm honest I feel far from 'normal' - I feel really like I'm in another phase of Ivf - where I'm waiting for the clinic to again give me a verdict of how our DNA is getting on and waiting for more drugs etc. if its not good news next time I think I'll be thinking along the lines of embryo quality, but I think like Dev said once I just find it hard to believe that was our problem all those years ago. I do feel like this current round was an Ivf round. Maybe the Ivf procedures loom large in the mind. Or at least I feel no different between this round and the one in sept. Which has left me feeling strongly that I think if this was a de round I would also feel no different.

Buzzy so glad that you're home and I hope the feeding is going better. I didn't realise that it was so hard until a friend was telling me about the horrors she experienced. The photos on the other place are beautiful, I'm so thrilled for you.

Sar, Gin, Doll, Art, Princess so so lovely you're all still popping in I always love reading your posts.

Special squeeze to Fox and Pout and everyone else.

sea, I think being classified as high risk is good - it means you'll get lots of monitoring which is great and that they'll be really looking after you and the twins.

euro will be sending you lots and lots of positive thoughts for the next scan. I can't wait till you're past the 12 week mark and can start telling people and enjoying your pregnancy!

devon I can imagine that having a small person could be isolating. I hear you on the 'different path' thing. I keep telling myself that when I hear about instadiff aquaintances who are slightly unsatisfactory people and yet have had no trouble reproducing. Although, in the words of MrC, 'this path sucks'.

free hold on tight. Sending you and bean so much love as you pass each milestone. How disgusting about the pervy Tube man.

ray your telephone consultation with the doctor must be coming up soon - really hope you get some more good advice. He sounds great, and like he cares about your case.

cos are you ok? Thinking of you and the little heart bravely beating inside you.

I had never heard of vasa praevia either, but I did find it really helpful to have a clearer idea about what might have happened - although we still don't really know and hopefully the consultant will be able to tell us more in a couple of weeks. Apparently you can spot it on an ultrasound, but the sonographer would need to be checking for it. The risk I've seen online is one in 300 for an IVF pregnancy but much lower for a normal pregnancy. They think that's to do with the fact that the embie may implant lower down with IVF. So it's still extremely rare - I definitely don't want to freak out any of our lovely IVF preggos. What happened to me was just really, really bad luck and very unusual.

Oh poo. I just wrote a long post and it seem to have disappeared into the either.

That seems like the right decision sea. When do you start?

ray there are not many people left to tell as most of those close to me knew about the IVF. If all is well after the next scan and the Harmony test result, we will tell my parents. At some point I will have to tell work, I suppose.

I had my booking in appt this morning. The midwives (midwife+sudent) were lovely. The only hiccup came when they tried to refer me to a consultant due to IVF and previous colposcopy (even though they only took a biopsy and didn't do anything to affect my cervix). I REALLY don't want to see more bloody doctors and hospitals. So they have agreed to speak to the consultant to see if she thinks it is really necessary in the circumstances.

Critter how reassuring they could look for it on an ultrasound in a future pregnancy.

Having a wry smile at Euro's midwives getting more than they bargained for

I was very nice to them. Honest.

critter that is reassuring that they could look for it in any future pregnancy. When is your meeting with your obs?

cos sorry I did see your note before and forgot to answer.

Got pregnant once naturally in 2011 - miscarried.

Western medicine - 5 x IUI. Clomid. + brectavid (hcg) + Prednisolone. Worked once, when I'd just started with the TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine). Turned out to be a chemical pregnancy/v early miscarriage or rather, didn't really get going.

TCM - monthly appointments.

• Tracking temperature and periods to make sure the signs were there that I was ovulating. And getting cycle down from 45 to 32 or so days. Western doctors never even asked how often DH and I had sex.
• Doctor checking pulse and sensing where I was cold, mostly lower abdomen,back bum and legs - this was chinese doctor's theory as to why I miscarried a couple of times or had trouble conceiving. Dr checking pulse was the only way he touched me other than acupuncture and massage. I never took my kit off once.
• Warm foot baths every evening, starting with hot water from tap then adding a kettle of boiled water to as hot as I could take it
• Herbs from Chinese doctor drunk daily in hot water
• Never ate or drank anything cold ever, lots of vegetables. Left my desk at lunchtime and had a little walk. When working from home, had a 15 minutes kip.
• Walked for an hour daily at least, did weird cycling in the air thing from the 80s to strengthen abdominal muscles
• Cut refined sugar and alcohol from my diet
• Had some acupuncture and massage as doctor "sensed" I needed it
• Lost weight through healthy diet and exercise - about 7kg which brought me to a normal BMI
• Took Iron supplement Floradix and alternately Vitamin B complex
• DH cut out alcohol and junk food and came exercising with me - his sperm motility went from WHO (a) - fast swimmers 2% to 14% and concentration from 46,0 mio/mL to 61 mio/mL. So it wasn't totally awful to start with, but marked improvement
• I was also doing FF and trying to get it on with DH at the right time
• I found this bit very annoying but since you asked - TCM doctor was very big on me not obsessing (yeah ok, then), enjoying life as much as possible, and finding joy in being 2, as this is a very different and special joy from being 3. He kept saying, I am not God MrsFree, I can just help your body get ready to hold a pregnancy.

Evening lovelies!

Just to let you know I am thinking of you all. Write a long post that got eaten by my phone earlier.

Just wanted to give another hug to critter. Good to know they can monitor you more carefully by scan for a twibling. But still so awful. I do hope you'll feel better, but I don't expect that soon. I agree with mrC's qualification of your path.

Thinking of the others, esp those in doubt or still waiting!

How is everyone doing today? The thread is going through some quiet spells lately.

Waves at euro :) just to let you know, by and large, I was really happy with my care throughout pregnancy, birth and afterwards too. I just had an initial battle axe for booking in but she was gone soon after. And although a poor bedside manner, she was very accurate! I'm happy to share my birth story with you if you want? I can pm you the details if you'd like :)

Critter thinking of you lots. Hugs.

Cos also thinking of you and willing the next fortnight to pass swiftly and with no drama too.

Ray just to let you know I still have a lot of hope for you and Mr Ray. You've had so much checking and so many tests and waiting, which has elongated your journey. The frustration must be just awful. I'm sorry you feel up against it. I always think how stunning and happy you look on the other place. I think 2014 will see your luck turn. I really do. So please know that in your darkest hour, when you are struggling I'm here thinking positive thoughts for you.

Dev I'm sorry about the A*. I still feel stabby when I hear announcements. Very irrational.

Fox extra paw holds for you.

Buzzy hope all is going well with babeebuzz and Kayla. Does it feel real yet?! :)

Thinking of you all. Hoping everyone has nice weekends planned.

I'm here Euro, but these days I go through spells of not thinking about TTC at all. I'm so close to moving on. Earlier this week someone found me the perfect new hobble and I just wanted to buy it. MrN said we had other priorities, and I just thought . I'm pretty bored of It all which I think is why I'm focussing on the holiday aspect of the DE route. Someone asked me up thread when I'm going. I've no idea, I've barely glanced at their website and not even contacted them. I cannot be arsed. Sigh again.

Anyway the reason it's so quiet is cos most of us are diffed now

Hello lovely princess. Not got much planned this weekend. Forecast looks mis. However I do have Mr N back after a long absence so I am planning on ensuring he makes it up to me. By way of DIY and gardening, you understand, not anything involving nakedness...

Waves to everyone else

Sea - I find it extraordinary that if you are 34 or over you are considered of advanced maternal age. So from a girl's first period to advanced maternal age, there are barely 20 years. It's asking quite a lot of a woman in that time- have a childhood, get a career, find a hubby and have some sprogs. I swear I think I would slap a nurse if they told me I was old. However I would want the extra care so being high risk is probably an extra hand hold.

Free - unbelievable what you have done to get here. What a journey!

Critter - yes as many times as you say your path is differe t, it can be still hard to accept and your path has been particularly horrifying.

Ray - interesting that your friends don't hang out. We probably do have a romanticised view of it all.

Cos - that is awful when someone says "I've been dreading telling you". How insensitive- I've had that before.. Interesting about the aspirin thing. What is aspirin suppose to do anyway? We're you taking it before your bfp? I'm sorry this feels like an ivf round, is because it is so stressful? And are you going to slip in another scan before the 10wk one?

princess yes please. I need to know what I am letting myself in for!

nelly I know that feeling! You should get there with DE though - I have heard such encouraging things about Serum. And you get a nice Greek holiday (your Big Fat Greek Holiday?) out of it.

devon my "advanced age" wasn't mentioned. The only time it came up at all was when they were assessing the blood clotting risk when being over 35 is one of the risk factors, along with high BMI and a multitude of other things. And even then they just ticked the box and no one mentioned "advanced age" (possibly because they thought they had made me prickly enough over the consultant referral thing). It factored in to me being labelled high risk for that, but the biggest factor at play was that my mum had a huge post-operative blood clot after cancer surgery and family history plays a big role.

cos I think whatever method we get pregnant by now, it is not going to be an easy experience. We've all been through so much, and have so much ttc-related baggage.

@ being high risk at 35/36?!?

It's so fucking annoying when they bring age into it, I've been broody for 7 years but wanted to be responsible and secure my career, income, house, and then wait for OH to be ready for kids and get married. At 33 I thought I was doing ok to have all that sorted and now I'm given the impression that I've left it too late!?? FUCK THEM!!

Sorry about the general feeling of meh! I still have high hopes for everyone, but well aware that might just be annoying!

Sea, I thought all twin pregnancies are considered high risk, and I'd say you would want the care. As to advanced age, I am just 34 still and got told at the combined test, that my age would not be the issue... It is funny that changes over 15 months, which is our age gap...

I am hoping everyone has a good weekend. And please can we have some nice weather to lift spirits where possible and needed!

Critters - I am glad it is something that they can look out for. And I hope you get more answers from the doc next week as well. I know the need to understand why it happened must be overwhelming. How are you feeling? And MrC?

Nelly - I understand the need to not think about TTC. It was the only way to stay sane sometimes. Greece is lovely in the springtime.

Cos - Too scared to out myself but I work in a v business/finance environment right now and the new opp would utilise that but the aim is to help society. It's a v new market.

I am sorry it feels like an ivf round with all the worry and stress. You should take some comfort from that fact that the scan all looks okay. I know it's hard not to worry. A big squeeze.

Dev - I think baby asiprin is just used as a blood thinner as an addition to clexane.

I agree about the age thing. It doesn't leave a lot of time does it really? I guess we should all have been popping out kids at the age at 20 when we were most fertile. I don't regret waiting. I was an idiot back then and would have been a terrible parent. It makes me so mad that in the news today they are reporting that the public think 40 is too old to have ivf. Why is it any business of anyone else other than the couple having it. I am so sick of hearing the views of people who don't know anything about it have uninformed and uneducated opinions on the matter. Grrrrr

The age thing is interesting. It didn't bother me that they told me I am old and like critter said I am happy about the extra monitoring. I just felt a bit crossed because when I was in the queue for ivf they kept telling me 35 is still v young, it could well happen naturally even though the private docs was saying i had less than 0.5% chance of it happening naturally. So when I wanted ivf I was young, keep trying. Once I am pregnant at 36 I am old!

I am rotting all my teeth by constantly sucking on lemon sweets - the only way to stop throwing up throughout the day. I am in a weird place when I am happy to feel sick but have thrown up 6 times a day on a really bad day. It's v odd. Lots of wombie pains in the last few days which is v scary and [tmi alert] I constantly feel something coming out of lady parts so keep running to loo to knicker watch. It's just discharge so far but keep expecting to see blood. The mentalling just doesn't stop.

Had another scan today and everything looks fine. I still feel so shock looking at the 2 heartbeats and they have grown quite a bit so all seems okay so far. Just hope it keeps going.

That's brilliant sea. Are you around 7 weeks now?

I'm sorry to hear about the sickness. I have had nausea but no actual comming, and even that didn't start until about 9 weeks. I would have found some earlier symptoms comforting, but I'm also glad I avoided them, iyswim. In short, the worry never stops!

It is fairly quiet on here. I guess because those of us still trying don't have much to report. I'm waiting for Monday and the blood results and then I will be told if I can do the fet or not.

Sea, that's great news although not so good about the sickness.

nelly, there is no rush for you to make a decision about Greece. I think I'd be looking at it as a holiday in the sun too.

princess, thank you for your kind words. It means a lot because I think I sound so miserable on here and I'm genuinely not. Things in my life are good if you ignore the ttc part and everyday I'm grateful for what I have got.

Am I wrong? I am sure someone on here was shocked when they saw something saying they were of 'advanced maternal age' and they were only 34/35.
Sea - the average age at the Argy is 40 and so you would be considered young in terms of doing ivf. They kept harping on about how young I was which i gracefully lapped up not that it did any good!
And the classic one was when Gin (i think it was Gin) rocked up to the clinic with her mum and they thought her mum was having treatment. Fab!
Great news about the scan Sea but Sorry about the sickness. Sounds thoroughly unpleasant. I was desperate to be sick and at 9 weeks I started to get nauseous and then on one occasion i nearly threw up in Sainsburys and I suddenly realised it wasnt a pleasant feeling after all and rhat was only mild compared to you. Feeling seasick is ghastly. I hope it all passes soon.
But ladies you are doing so well. It is horribly worrying and you just have to put faith in nature now and believe all is going to be just fine.
Oh and that horrible article in the DM today. Why are people so unsympathetic when it comes to ivf. It pisses me off.

Ray - I am always posting yet I have nothing to say. It's probably just going to be me posting to myself on here one day!

Oops comming=vomming.

sea that sickness sounds intense. I am really excited for you though honey. I know I'm jumping ahead but I also think that your twins are going to be so incredibly cute.

euro how is the warm weather holiday planning coming? We are thinking of looking for a cheap deal to go somewhere sunny for a few days, before I go back to work.

nelly I am glad that you're busy and that the hobbles are providing good distraction. I do think that sunshine helps a lot, and I like the idea of combining a Greece DE trip with some rest and relaxation in the sun.

fox thinking of you and squeezing your paw tightly.

ray I agree that you always look radiant on t'other place. I would never guess the crap you've had to deal with. You manage it with such grace and bravery.

devon I don't feel like I have a lot to say either but I like chatting to you all and this thread is one of the few places I can air my feelings and know everyone will understand. I'm going to be in a holding pattern for the next 5 months or so, so will be available for cheerleading and tail fluffing as you move forward with your NHS round.

My mum is here this weekend (I have been so spoilt by having family visiting every weekend) and it's been lovely to have her here. She lost a baby at 34 weeks, and has had two or three miscarriages, and has been really supportive. Funnily enough this experience has made lots of women I vaguely know share their histories of infertility and loss with me and with my family. It's made me realise that there's a big, unwilling, not-so-exclusive silent club of women who've dealt with sorrow around missing babies of one sort or another. I really think there are more of us than you'd think out there.