TTC for 10+ months, part 10

[princesschick]

A very friendly and supportive thread for those taking way longer than they had ever expected to make a baby.

Totally agree sar that repeated MCs are absolutely devastating, and I think even harder to take than long-term TTC. I just found the responses so different that it is baffling.

As for me, I don't have a coping strategy yet, and pg-announcements do make me howl for hours still. But I do think I will get back to a more even keeled lemon and I hope will cope okay until a viable pregnancy materialises. I am going to see a counselor next week, so maybe that will help. And relying on DH for support and laughter and cuddles helps a little as well. Also, I am talking a lot about it in RL and lapping up the support that comes so naturally to people now!

eleth (whispers) FX
sarlat I too am impressed by you. Hope the interview goes well if you decide to take it.
buzzy if it helped that has to be good.
artemis Day 21 bloods will be Oct 10. I'm hoping MrTeu will do his bit by then too. Not sure how back to normal cycles should get, all I know is they are totally different to pre-Pill. Although 2 day scanties are preferable to 8 day sagas.
Sunny weekend ahead here. Daylight saving starts which may or may not help the fur baby's 4am wakeups .

Sarlat ? you are handling everything so well. And you are right, you will have a baby. I?m glad your parents are providing a lot of support. Out of interest , are they young? I just wonder whether my parents are a bit out of touch with all this because they are old(ish). You have put together a lot of good questions for your meeting. That?s interesting about sore throats after transfer being a sign of an over active immune system. I had never heard of this but useful information to know but so confusing! I think the antibiotics question really is one to pursue. Is it worth putting together some evidence that women with hydro and quite a few ivf places put women on antibiotics after transfer? Just a thought as the doctor didn?t recommend it last time. I hope you get the chance to have proper exploratory conversation with your doctor who will go through all your possibilities. I agree that tubal removal is not a solution right now and actually this last FET may have just been bad luck so going to the extreme doesn?t seem the right way forward. But Artemis has expressed what I wanted to say much better than I can. Also well done on getting an interview. That?s great and going forward hopefully this will provide some excitement about progressing your career ? ttc does not define us . Also, in terms of my ops and things, i will be meeting you 48hrs before my lap (so if my teeth are chattering that?s why!). My scan on my lump yesterday showed it to be benign tumour but it is big and thankfully they suggested i get it out and so that will be another op at some point. I have spent my 30s in and out of GP surgeries, Holland&Barrett, fertility clinics and hospitals....in Coco?s words, ?smile and carry on?.

Pout ? it?s really lovely to have you dropping in. And totally understand the mentalling over not mentalling dilemma. I get that on holidays when I am suppose to be relaxing and not ttc because that?s when people are suppose to be off guard and then get updiffed but i?m so busy pretending not to be thinking about it that i think about it even more. I just have to accept that currently it is a big part of my life but not my whole life yeah right. And I was reading over on the short luteal phase thread about 2 ladies who took soya iso thingies and that got them pregnant. I?m wary about getting sucked in to any more things after the manuka honey gate which actually made me hypoglycaemic , a definite no no for wanting to get pregnant! And why haven?t i heard about the link between gluten intolerance and infertility? I look like a pregnant woman every time i eat bread . writes in my fertility notebook to investigate

Artemis ? one of my biggest gripes is having to behave like a pregnant woman for the last 2 years. The alcohol thing is difficult to take on board especially when you hear of so many people conceiving after heavy nights out. But i guess it is just trying to do everything we possible can to put the odds in our favour. However, numerous times, i have heard of women trying for years and behaving impeccably and then after hitting a brick wall , they let their hair down , get drunk and then get pregnant. I will never understand where the truth lies. And yippee for your spa day. I think it?s great to try and balance out the crap by doing good stuff straight after. Mrjoy was given direct orders to take me for tea and cake after my hsg and it was lovely. You?ll be fine.

Lemon ? i totally identify what you were saying about the pain and grief of m/c v infertility. People don?t understand the emotional consequences of not being able to conceive but if you tell someone you have had a miscarriage, they get it. it?s also how people discuss things as well. I have found the consequences of infertility a lot worse than my m/c. And I don?t mean to put them in some hierarchy or diminish one more than the other but that?s what i have found. Also I know we are now labelled by others as ?they have problems and issues? whereas with my m/c there seemed to be sympathy and sensitivity. I don?t want people to feel sorry for us but I do want people to be sensitive by what they say to us ? you don?t get that as much with infertility because you can?t possibly know what people go through unless you go through it iyswim.

Buzzy ? i totally understand about having someone to speak to in RL about everything especially someone who has been through it. I hope it was helpful.

Ele ? whispering congratulations and hoping this is 3rd time lucky for you. very exciting!

Coco ? a lot of this is about smiling and carrying on isn?t it but it?s horrible hard when you realise you are amongst people and you are the odd one out. I hate that.

Eth, wow I'll whisper my congratulations! Bfp announcements are always welcome on here, they're so different to real life ones which make me want to throw up. The ones on here give me hope that it can happen. This thread is a bit short on bfps, and we need so many more.

Sarlat, I'm very impressed with your clear thinking. That's great that your mum is so positive, having support like that is a wonderful thing.

Lemon, this my theory. I think people are only able to emphasise when it's something they can imagine could happen to them one day. So, if someone has cancer, other people can empathise because they know that one day they might have it. With miscarriage, they know it might potentially happen to them. But infertility, if you are already pregnant or have children is totally unimaginable. They can't think how'd theyd feel and so can't put themselves in our shoes. I also think that miscarriage is fairly common, much more so than infertility so there's a lot spoken and written about it. Whereas, it's hard to find much about infertility, no one speaks about it. It's a real taboo.

Another thing to add is that miscarriage is seen as an event, rather than a long running process and I think people find it easier to cope with a one off loss rather than this endless process. I've had three friends suffer miscarriage, and I know they each received a lot of sympathy and support, but I also suspect they did get some inappropriate stuff said to them too. Two of them went on to conceive the very next cycle and the third took 5 months. I remember symapathising with them at the time of their miscarriage, bUt I'm afraid that deep inside I was very selfishly wishing that they might not conceive straight away, I know that's an awful thing to think and in ashamed that I thought it. When they did conceive I did wonder if the pain of mc was still there or if it does go away. The two that conceived the very next cycle actually only had 6 weeks ish before they were pregnant again so the very acute pain must have been short lived. I do know through that all 3 of them think they had a tough time ttc, and it was a struggle whereas I've been trying for 27 cycles with no sight of a bfp. They had miscarriage and gave birth to healthy baby in less time than that.

I totally agree Mrsd and I heard about the odd person who had fertility issues in the days I wasn't trying and my thoughts were 'oh'. I had no idea of what that really meant. I desperately wanted to get pregnant again quickly after mine so I could replace what I lost and if that had have happened, I don't think I would have given the m/c much more thought. Obviously mine was fairly early though and i have no doubt a later one is much harder to handle. As it is, I do think about what could have been though and I have the due date etched in my head. But I think my sadness now is really not being able to get pregnant rather than losing it.
No shame in saying thats what you felt as I sometimes wish I had a friend in RL who truly understands all this rather than being the only one with issues.

Hello everyone

Very interesting discussion on here this morning about m/c and long-term infertility.

sar I think your plan sounds brilliant. Well done you for articulating all those questions. You are my hero.

teu isn't it weird how periods change pre- and post-Pill? I know they don't for some people, but for me, the Pill totally buggered my cycles up.

pout so lovely to see you on here!

artemis the spa day sounds amazing. I might actually book one, you've inspired me!

eleuth massive congrats and fingers crossed for a sticky bean. It gives us all a lift when someone gets a BFP!

lemon So sorry to hear you have a cold on top of everything else. Hang in there and wrap up warm.

coco that's a lovely story about your boss. Good to have some positive inspiration!

euro hope you are recovering after your trip - you must be so looking forward to having a lie in at the weekend!

buzzy glad you got to have a chat to someone IRL. It does help. Sorry that you're still feeling so sad. Big hug to you.

nelly, gin, rabbit and everyone else I have missed - how are you all doing?

Ok... warning, mega me me me post coming up.

Well. So. I went in for yet another scan this morning and the doc said that if I triggered now, I would probably ovulate eight eggs as I had multiple large follies. He said it was strange, because before on Clomid I wasn't even producing one egg, and now I have an embarrassment of riches - and that my body is just unpredictable.

So... in order to avoid high order multiples, he recommended cancelling the cycle, which I think is probably a good idea. I don't mind twins but I don't fancy triplets or quads or quints...or octuplets, God help me. I am fairly short (5'3" and a half) and I don't know that I could handle it.

He then recommended moving on to IVF, as it would allow him to control how many embryos he put back in, so I didn't massively overstim and get pregnant with high order multiples. He said we could either convert this cycle, or, he would actually recommend that I take a break and schedule a consultation to talk to him with MrC about it, and then do a full IVF cycle where I would do a higher dose of stims to produce even more eggs. I think he was worried that I might burst into tears as he said it might be better to talk about it 'when you aren't totally amped up on hormones' (this was in a nice way, not patronising, I know it might look like that written down).

I talked to my mum this morning after the appointment, and she said that she thought I should wait 2 or 3 months to see if my periods came back and I started ovulating on my own again, after this big hormonal shake-up. She and my sister both had similar cycles to what I used to have - 6 or 7 weeks long. I think this may be a good idea - to wait until Christmas, doing mega amounts of woo to try to kickstart my natural cycle, and then if that doesn't work to think about IVF in the New Year. Anyway - if any of you very wise ladies have any thoughts of questions I should ask when I go back in, I am all ears.

A cautiously optimistic tiptoeing tail feather shaking fertility dance to you all.

Joyce I think you're right re the alcohol etc. For me, I don't know if it makes a difference or not, but if we have IVF and it doesn't work I don't want to be torturing myself by imagining that it might have worked out if i'd only avoided the booze like I did after the mc. I think you're right about sensitivity vs pity. I can't bear the idea that people might pity me (probably one of the reasons I haven't told many people) but I would hope for some sensitivity towards my situation.

Mrsden I like your theory on people's reactions. It is hard to empathise with things you can't imagine experiencing yourself - though even so, I'm not sure it takes a massive amount of imagination to try to avoid saying things that are actually hurtful. I also think embarrassment plays a part. People don't know what to say or are frightened of getting it wrong and are more concerned with their own discomfort than that of the person going through the difficulties. I don't think that just applies to infertility. I lost my dad to cancer 9 years ago and when he got his diagnosis people my parents had known for years would literally cross the street to avoid him. Friends of mine couldn't deal with it, including the guy I was seeing at the time. I think that ties in with your event vs long running issue question. People can cope with a one off thing because they know it will be over. They can deal with someone who's ill when there is a prognosis that they will be OK, or an event like miscarriage because they can say "Oh well at least you know you can conceive" (grr). Terminal illness and long term conditions such as infertility are different. Add to that the further embarrassment of sex being involved, the fact that our society seems to view breeding as both a right and a duty, the social expectation that women's worth is tied up with their reproductive ability and the politically/morally charged question of assisted conception and you have a toxic mix.

I'm off on one today... I've done loads of work this week but now I seem to have run out of steam! I shall get back in my box now and stop hogging the thread

x-post Critter... jeepers.... 8 follies!!! Blimey. Go ovaries. It reminds me of that story about the hare and the tortoise...

Octuplets would clearly be a bad idea though you might solve the thread's problems in one fell swoop if you shared them out Your mum's suggestion sounds very sensible to me particularly given that long cycles seems to be a family trait. Since that your ovaries have proved they work, and Mr C has super sperm, IVF may well be a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

One thing I wondered was, could they do EC, fertilise any eggs and freeze the resulting embryos for FET at some point in the future? That way you could avoid having to go through all the stimming if you do opt for IVF. That might not be possible or sensible, but it seems like a shame to waste 8 eggs!

Mrs Den - I don't think those thoughts make you a bad person. It's part of being human - the difference is we don't behave by them. I'm so sorry about all those preggo freinds right in your face - your time is coming soon.

Joyce - my parents are late 50's so youngish yes. But they both have quite 'careery' jobs ifsim so I think they they both like problem solving and coming up with ideas. I guess in their management roles they have heard all kinds which maybe makes them less suprised by all this stuff. So glad that lump was benign! And don't you worry about teeth chattering, we will keep your mind off the op and on the bigger picture!

Critter - wow, that is amazing. Isn't it great how things can turnaround so quickly. You must be feeling more hopeful for your baby coming along soon. I agree with your mum and artemis. Lets see if your body could do the natural ovulation thing, and it that isn't working, no fear, IVF would be a doddle. Wow - good luck with what comes next.

Art - you are not thread hogging, I have won that award this week. I love all your updates. Hope you have a restful weekend after all your hard work recently.

artemis you made me about the octuplets. Funnily enough it did cross my mind that I could always give a frozen embryo to my older sister if she didn't meet Mr Right in time (we've already done a deal that I would be her egg donor if she needed me to be, although given that I wasn't ovulating it wasn't a very helpful prospect). I know what you mean about the 8 eggs. I have a lot of questions for the nurse when she rings this afternoon!

mrsd sorry, I also wanted to say that those feelings don't make you an awful person at all. I can totally relate!

Sar thanks again for your lovely advice. I do feel more hopeful, if a little freaked out. I hope that everyone else on this wonderful board can get some hope too.

eletheo whispering congrats to you :)

lemon I found that people were sympathetic to a degree, I know some people thought my grief was a bit much as it was 'only a bunch of cell', but you are right there is less sympathy for fertility issues. I don't think there really is a strategy to cope with the loss of something so loved and wanted, I dread the end of the month as it will be a year since my last miscarriage

artemis you have made me think that I should treat myself to a facial and new hair cut :)

sar I personally think its worth testing your immune system, the more you can rule out the better. Tube removal should be a last resort. I can give you Shehata's web page and silly password if you like. I can relate to the time off work thing, it totally sucks, good luck with your interview :)

teu how cute your fur baby affected by day light savings yes make sure Mr T does his bit, you need to know everything so you can plan your next move.

coco if the geek can get updiffed why the bloody hell can't I searches for glasses you're a brave woman to sit through that

mrsd I agree with your theory and with joy I too feel sad on due dates but it is now the not being able to fall pregnant that worries me, not the will it last, I feel now I have total faith in the nk cell regime that all I need to do is get pregnant and I'll be fine

critter or should that be octapussy I though you had 3 and was going to put my name down for one of them, but like artemis said you'd solve the threads problems sorry the cycle has been abandoned, interesting that he suggested IVF and not trying to get the stims right. Although who knows how long that could take, I think your mum is right, I'm hoping that this has given your ovaries a good wake up call.

Well still have low temp and this continuous snail trail I'm wondering if/when AF will show up, might have to fiddle with cervix again, thank goodness the week is over, Mr B and are out tomorrow night for as it nearly our 2nd anniversary, thought we'd have a sprog by now........

Oooh... I just popped on to check up on sarlat (for whom big hugs. And also good luck with the interview! Good to keep moving forward with something, I think), and am so terribly, terribly pleased to see eleth's news! I shall keep everything crossed for you! And I think a BFP is such wonderfully hopeful news on these threads. It's certainly making me smile.

I'm onto a new cycle myself after AF arrived all-singing, all-dancing on Wednesday. Now the painful part's over, I always love this bit, when AF is winding down and I'm looking forward into a fresh cycle - it feels so hopeful.

I have some sad news. I went in for another scan on Thursday at 7+1 and they didn't find anything in the gestational sac. There had been a yolk but no fetal pole. The yolk had mostly dissolved and the pregnancy was definitely not viable (blighted ovum). MY pregnancy symptoms have never been particularly strong but I had no spotting or cramping either. I went in for a D&C yesterday to have it removed. Physically I'm doing fine but psychologically I'm a wreck but I thought I should let you know. It's a terrible thing but even upon reflection, I'm still glad we were able to conceive.

I think I'm going to take a little time off of here to heal my body and my mind but I'll be back :)

Oh MissM... I am so sorry. That's such dreadful news and especially hard when you have had weeks of hope and anxiety leading up to it. Huge hugs. I understand the need to step back from the boards but we will all be here for you whenever you need us

MissM - I am so so sorry and so cruel especially after everything you and your husband have been through. It's a good idea to take some time out to recover. Huge hugs. We are here if you need us.

Oh missm, I'm so so sorry. I was just thinking of you and wondering how you were getting on. You must give yourself time. Big hugs.

We're all having such a rubbish time at the mo. This Fred could seriously do with some good news. Are you listening fertility gods? This was meant to be a lucky one for us all?!

sar I hope you are doing ok. I totally understand the need to make a plan (I already have my post ivf failure plan worked out!), but do give yourself some time to grieve. It sounds like you have lots of support, which is great.

The chat about mc vs long term ttc and people's reactions is interesting. I think mc used to be a very taboo subject and it's only recently that people feel ok to talk about it and show some understanding. Hopefully that will happen with infertility too at some point.

Not long til the op joy! I'll be starting ivf a couple of days after our meet up, so will be a shaky mess too!

buzzy hope you have a lovely evening out with mr b. Do you think the meds have mucked up you cycle? Mine certainly took a while to get back to normal after the ivf meds.

critter the 8 follies must be v frustrating but at least you know you respond well to the meds! A few cycles trying naturally sounds sensible and you don't want to be going through ivf over Xmas.

artemis you are doing v well sans booze/caffine. I've cut down but haven't totally gone cold turkey. I can't bear to act as a preggo when I'm not actually pregnant, although will do actually during the cycle. The Guardian article was Intersting, although I've never heard before that eggs take 3 months to develop. Surely this can't be right?? They wouldn't down regulate in ivf if it was?

pout lovely to see you back briefly! I can't not ttc, even though I know it's not going to work for us!

eleth how's it going?

princess have you moved? Hope it went ok.

lemons hope you are ok.

Waves to everyone else. Nothing to report here. I'm working yet again, so tired and grumpy, but at least all this working is doing something productive and distracting me. I find if I have too much time to myself I end up mentalling about ivf etc and madly googling! We're at the clinic on Monday for a scan and treatment consultation. Not looking forward to dildocam...

Holy baloney critter 8! I'm sorry this spells the end of this cycle. Your mum's advice seems sensible. Hopefully this has kicked things in to action but I can imagine you not wanting to waste all these eggs. If I found myself in your position I'd certainly stick a few in to deep freeze just in case.

buzzy your octopussy made me Happy (nearly) anniversary to you, hope MrB treats you to a lovely night.

rum it's great that you are feeling so positive right now. On a gorgeous crisp morning like today I can't help but feel brighter.

MrsM I am so very very sorry. Life is so cruel. You have my deepest heartfelt sympathy. From experience I can only say you need to make sure you take plenty of time for yourself, give yourself lots of treats and rest. It is good to see you have managed a small smile, even if its a virtual one. We will be here for you if you need us.

medusa super big hugs I really am so sorry to hear that, it is heartbreaking and you do need time to grieve and heal.

gin i'm not really sure what is going on with this cycle i've never had such low temps so when AF arrives i'll have all my blood tests and some are thyroid ones, I did have a cycle break in June and that was fine although had only been on the Tamoxifen then. It does make me worry though. I'm sure all will be fine on Monday :)

I am now thinking of postponing IVF, I really can't cope with it all right now but will see how I feel after I have been to Create, I feel I need to be in a good place personally if I'm only really going to get one good shot at it. Frustrating as I would like to get on with it.

buzzy I do think it would be wise to postpone until you are ready. There's no harm keeping the Create appointment though. We're going in October with a view to starting in the New Year. I just want some time to process any info they give me, and to have any tests they want me to have as most of my blood tests are over a year old now.

MissM I'm sorry to hear your news.

Critter that is amazing egg laying! It's a shame you have to abandon the cycle though. But it is very encouraging for IVF, if you end up there. Your plan to try naturally for a bit sounds sensible.

AF arrived yesterday for me, so I'm on to cycle 24 now. I don't feel too bad. DTD wasn't very well-timed this month, so I wasn't expecting anything. And this morning I managed to have my first lie in for ages - at least 2 months. And it felt great!

euro Glad you got a lie in, I find I swing from from one emotion to the other, i'm ready/i'm not ready, its more the fact that I'm frightened about the blood test and scan results, I worry that we won't get any frosties to try FET and that we will only get one shot at it. The last 3 weeks have been so stressful I could barely cope with life full stop, but then I think I'm going to be 40 in March so bloody well get on with it I didn't ovulate this month, my temps would suit an Eskimo and AF should be here but isn't but chatting/crying with my patients daughter has calmed me down a bit for now and made me think a little clearer

Dashing in - I am STILL at work - to say I'm so sorry to sar and medusa words just don't cut it. It's a cruel game and it's so that we have to be in for the long haul. My thoughts are with you both.

Huge loves to everyone else, I'm falling behind but trying to keep up when I can. I've been swallowed by a campus. But I did lay an egg this morning on cd17 please let it be golden, not hard boiled, scrambled or off.

Let's all keep going, we have to spot land through the telescope soon.

Oh gosh medusa I'm so sorry. Massive hugs. Hope you are being well looked after and you are coping ok. Can't imagine what you're going through xx

I have been mistaken twice this week for being preg . I always carry weight around my middle but the constant gastro side effects of met are giving me such a pot belly. On both occasions I laughed it off when the person was corrected and then looked mortified. Inside I'm crying though, living like a preggo and now looking like one. When will this end? I feel helpless.

The steroids gave me a pot belly that just won't go, frannie. It's very annoying. I do look a bit preggo.

I had another lie in this morning, which was ace. I still have period pains, which is not.

medusa - gosh sweetheart, I am really really sorry. What a nasty shock after all that time to get that BFP. Like others have said, take time out and allow yourself teats, tantrums and chocoloate. You will be happy again, I promise. xx