After m/c - the [wine] and [shagging] thread

[FoofFighter]

Funthatisfunny, booboomonster, madeinchinababy - anyone else who's recently had a BFP sadly followed by a miscarriage - welcome [busmile]

Me - got a shock BFP on 5th March, had early scan at 9 weeks (after I talked to midwife about feeling something was wrong, lost symptoms) on Friday 6th April showing baby had died around 6-7 weeks. Our little Widget left me on Saturday 7th April thread here

I have been wonderfully supported here on Mumsnet but especially by the above people who are sadly going through the same thing right now or waiting to, very special people to be thinking of others at such a sad time for them and their partners.

Although the baby was unplanned and completely unexpected, we want to try. And time is against us as I am 39 in June. So here we are. I'm not sure if we'll wait a period of time or just see what happens but having had secondary infertilty with my now ex husband for 5+years I do NOT want to get het up on BBT, CM checking, OPKS.

So in talking with the lovely ladies we decided that other threads were quite well established and to start a new one based mostly on alcohol and sex

Anyone is welcome, just jump right in :)

Just found this link www.babyexpert.com/get-pregnant/conceiving/vitamins-boost-fertility-and-conception - so am going to carry on taking my Pregnacare and extra folic acid (BMI is 36) and extra Vit D (not prescribed, just taking as have been as near as dammit housebound for a year with a back problem so probably not a bad idea - plus other countries advise much higher doses than the UK does).

so maybe it is a good idea to leave it, but you do need to take the time and make sure it really is what you want and not something you will regret later. Take your sick leave, wallow in feeling rubbish for a while, then think about it again. I'm not sure I would want to be a career driven academic either, I quite like my career as a teacher though (most of the time, when the kids are being reasonable). I am a lefty liberal too :) and quite fancy working for charity, I did a gap year with Mother Theresa's nuns when I was 18 and absolutely loved it, maybe I should have acted on my thought to become a nun.

I wish this was a freaky dream too, but I don't think it is, it's been going on too long for that :( I hope you mc soon (I never thought I'd say that to anyone) so you can start moving on properly.

Foo Good luck with the CAB interview. What do you do when you aren't off sick? I wouldn't get up either if I didn't have the dcs to get up and out, like you I feel empty. I think I prefer the crying, at least then I'm feeling something.

Just jobs, not a typical mner career type :) last post was in catering.

sovery I am SO sorry that you are going through this. I know how you feel in terms of the waiting as I had my EPU scan on the 20/3 but didn't start bleeding properly (i.e. more than an odd spot here and there) til the morning of my best friend's wedding. How's that for timing? And we then went away at 3am the next morning for a week. Trying to find toilets in a massive French ski resort, with 2 unsuspecting children in tow, in order to check what was going on wasn't fun. All I can say was - it didn't hurt, just a dull ache in my 'bits' every now and then. The bleeding wasn't a regular drip like a period, but every time I went to the toilet the clots came out. That lasted about 6 days, then nothing. It literally dried up overnight. The scan I had last week says my uterus is clear. The few people I've spoken too who've had a mc say their bleeding only lasted days rather than weeks too.

foof - I think you must be a very stoic woman. Not sure I could go to a baby fair. Was meant to be helping at our local NCT NNS, but bottled out as couldn't face the bumps and babies likely to be there.

Also my MW (a family friend) made a very good point to me: if we feel we've received less than satisfactory treatment at the hospital etc, we need to tell them formally. So many women must go through similar experiences and not say anything because they are feeling emotionally fragile at the time, and then leave it because time has passed/don't want to make a fuss etc. How on earth will things change unless we tell the 'professionals' that they are getting it wrong?

I'm sending off my carefully considered, not remotely hormonally influenced or alcohol fuelled letter tomorrow, berating the 'toff' consultant and the 2 other junior doctors (who weren't introduced to me and who didn't ask my permission to be there, but whom I allowed to 'learn' from doing an internal scan because my emotions were too shot to do anything else) for being insensitive and lacking any sort of bedside manner in such a sensitive situation. At no point did they say 'I'm really sorry but the sac we saw 10 days ago appears to have gone so you've lost your baby'. They discussed it over my splayed legs, then handed me a copy of the report (which was someone else's I discovered when I got home and could see thorough my tears to read it).

As you can tell I am bloody furious still.

The good news is I think I've now got everything off my chest, so thank you thank you for bearing with me today.

I've read through all the posts on this thread over the last couple of days (being new to MN) and am relieved that I am not the only person thinking/not thinking/feeling/not feeling etc. Thank you for posting your thoughts, ladies. It's taken me a couple of days to pluck up the guts to post, but I still felt comforted by just reading. Now feel purged by posting too!!

Time to be positive, and hope for a bfp in a few weeks time.

PS - what does bfn and bfp stand for?!! Am hoping I've used the right one in the right context!!! Best have another ?!

lol I know jo it is crackers that I knicker check for spotting! I can't wait to start spotting! bring it on you bugger.

Arf i would be a shite teacher. mentoring peeps who want to learn, grand, or even little scally types who aren't being looked after properly but normo's who can't be arsed would do my head in. And gangs of teenagers scare me to death, think you secondary school teachers are well brave ;0)

yay for lefty liberal types :) And oooh exciting foof am well jeal :) Good luck good luck! doing CAB work is definitely a good way forward, or just any job in the council dealing with peeps on the frontline, reception etc - councils are fond of internal interviewees.

Sure thing jo I shall take time, i absolutely must make sure that it is a good decision and not a knee jerk reaction to the mc/hormones/general laziness.

Am going to make some toast for my dins and watch homeland. hurrah!

Foof - good luck for the interview, the CAB desperately need more good staff.

Icequeen I'm not surprised that you are still furious, I'm livid for you!! (And I know what you mean about plucking up the courage to post, I think I've been loitering for weeks).

Sovery have you thought about what you would do if you quit? I know it's a bit cold, but maybe write a list of pros and cons?? It sometimes helps me to make more of an objective decision.

Jodidi I hope your day improved. I'm also a job loving teacher, I can't think of another job that I'd rather do!!

Sorry for the 'listy' post!

Ice that sounds hideous, definitely make a formal complaint about that. How insensitive can people possibly be! I'm becoming more glad by the day that I chose not to go to the hospital for any scans or tests. I'm glad our hormonal and grieving ramblings are helping you feel a little bit better about it all, it is a completely rubbish thing to be going through and we all need some support. Bfp stands for big fat positive and bfn stands for big fat negative ( I think, they are definitely positive and negative).

so gangs of teenagers scare me too but when I'm in the classroom they don't seem so scary. I actually enjoy reducing some of the more obnoxious ones to tears every so often . On the whole though, the kids at my current school are fairly decent and want to do their best (obviously there are exceptions).

icequeen sorry about last night, I must have x posted. I cannot believe your experience, you poor thing. I had my sacn with three people in the room and another popping her head in from a busy corridor :( It was horrible! they were nice, the us lady was a trainee and her and her sup talked about my sac, so I knew there was no baby from the mere omission. Fucking awful and I dread going abck for another tv scan on monday for no, bloody, reason. Thanks for sharing your mc story, it give me hope mine won't ened up with me in a and e. So hard for you being skiing. for some reasonm I keep imagining you in all your ski gear trying to get to the loo but prsume you wouldn't have kept going on the slopes?!! Oh BFP - big fat positive preggo test; BFN big fat negative :)

jo hehe you make the scary gangs cry. Scary lady!

hi chellie! If I quit I would be a SAHM to my toddler and hopefully a new baby and a kitten :) hubby has a wonderful but 70 hour a week, stressful job and I would like it if I could cook proper meals and be a stable nice person and look after my family instead of a stressy working shouty one taking all weekend and evening family time to study for a qualification I don't want any more! my life is so different now at 33 than when i started as a foot loose and fancy free 27 year old... Am going to do pros and cons over luncheon with DH! Who and what do you teach?

Well today I am very chipper but I know it is hormonal. My sense of smell and taste are more sensitive too and I am crying at silly things. If i didn't know better I would think I was pregnant :( I think my body lets some hormone drop knowing there is no baby, then freaks out and raises it a bit again instead. I hate being this way!

Woke up and felt sick and sleepily thought ooh yeah morning sickness at last - then remembered managed to not cry though is that good or bad thing, I don't really know. maybe crying would be good as someone said above, means you are feeling emotions and not numb.

Still in bed, not getting up today.

oh sovery this limbo must be so shit for you. I really wish there was something I could do to help you. (((((((((hugs)))))))))))

Foof that's horrible when you forget and have to remember again isn't it? I still look pregnant, although I can fit into my normal fat jeans, so every time I look down I think there must be some mistake.

I am dreading going back to work tomorrow as some of the kids had guessed (because I started showing so early) although I hadn't confirmed it. I'm sure they know I was pregnant though, and in their heads if you are pregnant and then suddenly you aren't then that means you have had an abortion (I know one of my yr 11 girls has had an abortion a few months ago). This only occured to me today :( I've had a few weepy moments this morning, and really, really need to do some housework as the house is now starting to smell foosty. I can't be bothered though, and just want to go back to bed again :(

Afternoon all!

sovery thanks for your message. Am sorry to say that the ups and downs/taste/smell thing keeps going til the hormone levels really start to fall. While I was away even tho I was 'allowed' to drink wine, coffee, eat blue cheese etc the smell and taste of them still put me off which I put down to hormones. However, now it is a different matter entirely! The last week I've felt normal again albeit the hormone levels aren't quite down. I did a test this morning (Boots own) and it barely showed anything at all in that I can't work out if there is a line there or not. Am taking this as a NTFN (nearly there fat negative)!! I was terrified of the bleeding etc, but am convinced that you will be just fine. If it does get really heavy do go to your GP. Another tip would be to take an iron supplement. My MW packed me off with sachets of Spatone? I took 2 each day I bled - really seemed to help.

I can't believe the number of teachers on this thread! I am too - although not currently 'active'. My dh and I made the decision that I'd stay at home after our 3rd as childcare became prohibitively expensive. I'm very lucky indeed. Although dh might comment that I still get stressy and shout... can't think why!! I'm not too keen on going back to all the marking and planning, but would like to do something to contribute to the coffers. I did some 11+ tuition and 'GCSE Eng/Lit OMG I've just had my mock results and I'm going to fail my exams' type stuff between DS1 and DS2, but the pay was rubbish. I like the idea of a start up, but have friends trying this and they are struggling in this climate. Lottery it is then. Or magistrating - I've heard that's fun!

jo - letter posted this morning before I had the chance to back out. Will await any sort of reply.

Off to play on the Wii with DS1&2 while DS3 snoozes....

Afternoon all

Hope you are all having a good day. My first day back at work has been fine apart from the bit where I had to teach my class of 15 year olds about reproduction and the swopping of genetic information which lead to one of them asking about when it goes wrong and what happens then another one asked when a babies heart starts beating, and as far as shes concerned as soon as there is a little heart its a little person not an embryo :( :( :( . I have spent the last 3 weeks convincing myself that it was just a group of cells I lost not a little person.

Wish I was still in bed foof!!!!

Still, no class now so time for a , I think would be frowned upon.

Good Luck tomorrow Jodidi incase I'm not back on later

shit chuckle! I would actually cry at that, i really would.

I've been out for a three course lunch, in my fat jeans hurrah. Am going to have to stop eating so much soon!

Hmm ice yup, my preggo feelings disappeared a week ago but creep in every so often when my body is clearly trying to stay pregnant and not let the progesterone drop too much. (please drop! start spotting goddamn!) I couldn't bear to do a pg test to see this baby's BFP again. I wanted this BFP so bloody much and... well... Just meh.

Bah seems like i have to stay at uni :( Damned work! However, i am definitely allowed to get my kitten so that is ACE and Brilliant and am so excited. there is a rescue shelter up the road that has a tream of them but none this week, i shall ring up again next week. Little ball of fluff to cuddle hurrah.

foo this seems to be the only thing I forget is happening to me when I wake up. every morning I have to go over the situation again and just feel like utter shit.

I am going to start taking b vits to get some energy. Thanks or the iron tip, I should get some. TBH I am not eating properly, if it isn't saturated fat it ain't for me, which is most unlike me but I am too mardy to care :( I bloody will care when I have to get a dress for this wedding in a couple of weeks and look a right mess!

I have to get DS. Is tipping down again!

hope you ok pip, your mc post was lovely, sad, but lovely x

Chuckle that must have been so hard, kudos to you for holding it together!

Ahhh a kitten :) I am not a cat person but ex H and I ended up fostering a new mummy cat and her kittens as the owner couldn't cope. We had them 6 weeks, they went back for a weekend and then ended up with us permanently :) two kittens stayed, and he has them now of course they are little shitbags now not lovely kittens any more!

Pip, replied on your mc thread x what does your reflexology person say about using it for conception do you know?

Chuckle that must have been so hard. I remember saying something equally as earnest to my RE teacher when I was 15, and it took me ages to work out why she cried, then I felt soooo guilty. I am sure she would feel awful if she realised what you've just been through. I wish I could convince myself I only lost a group of cells but I can't :(

sovery a kitten to cuddle sounds lovely. I'm not really a cat person but I do like them when they're small.

pip I read you mc post too and it made me cry it was so sad. I hope you are ok.

Foof I used reflexology to help me concieve dd2. I had 2 sessions a month apart and then fell pg before the next session. I really do think it helped, along with the healthy eating, exercise and organic toiletries (I don't react well to SLS which is in most toiletries).

I'm starting to wonder what all this is going to do to my periods. I have actually only had 5 periods in the past 10 years, due to contraceptive injection, then pcos meaning I didn't ovulate/have periods for over a year, then 2 periods before falling pregnant with dd2, and only 3 between her and this pregnancy because I've been breastfeeding. I don't really want to have periods regularly, but if I don't then how can I get pregnant again?

Interesting you say that about diet jo, I was wondering wether to continue eating well and avoiding alcohol and all that. I've been taking my pregnacare and extra folic acid all along figuring it would do any potential pg good to have the extra goods there from the start, also haven't taken any of my medication for my back as i suspect this is what the problem might have been, I stopped as soon as I knew I was pg, but it would have had 2 weeks of pretty heavy stuff inc tranqs and sedatives.

but then the other side of me says don't be silly just eat what you want, drink what you want and worry about it if and when you get pregnant!

jo when did you last have the depo jab can I ask? I feel this is what caused my secondary infertility for 5+ years and had only had two shots of the evil shite

I think my system only got sorted out when I went on the pill last year and it kick started it all.

Link in the first post about benefits of pregnacare (etc) def worth a look if you haven't btw

Hello Chellie and IceQueenKate, sorry to learn you have reason to be here.

I know what some of you have said about wanting to apologise to people who've MC'd in the past, before I knew what it meant. I did apolgise to one friend. She was so helpful to me when my turn came around.

chuckle what a shame the retail therapy didn't do it's trick! I went masively overdrawn with the MC - mostly things I will like to wear to work, which I now absolutely hate. So hard to be planning on leaving and then realising I'm not!

foof good luck with the baby show. Let us know how it goes.

Soveryfedup - appropriate name change, "starting to feel like some freaky sort of dream". I really can't imagine.

Jodidi, hope your dp's method of withdrawal didn't work, we could use a good 2ww on here!

As for me, I'm still bleeding, I thought I'd go for the world record, and not bleeding is sooo yesterday... which reminds me . Yesterday I had my first ever period related need to rush home and change and put clothes in the machine. "A burst damn" would describe it quite well.

Baby show problem may be solved for me. Have got a job interview/trial thing on Monday and if I get it, will be working every Saturday and won't be able to go. I know I can say to them that I have a pre-arranged thing on that day (which would only be 4 weeks away) but seeing as the job is to essentially cover for others, then who would cover me?!

Wrigle, my MW said that past the first few days post mc bleeding should be quite light and nothing heavier than a normal period, your burst damn doesn't sound normal to me, I think you might need to get some medical advice?

MW did say if bleeding got heavier to get advice - sorry I wasn't very clear!

ah, diet and lifestyle... I have managed to convince a small part of my brain that my BO is because I used to smoke and drink once a week so am now paranoid that if I have a drink (staying away from fags) I will kill another baby. Ah, the joys. Oh, I think it is because I was on flu medication constantly (terrible, terrible flu for the first time in years) when I woould ave conceived but felt so awful and did not really dare to think I would be pregnant so took them anyway. Hmmmf.

I've not had a cat before but want cats and dogs and the rest and now seems a lovely time to start. DS loves cats for some reason. I think a bit like with children I will love my own cutey cat, but not other peoples Can't wait.

jo I haven't really had periods for donks either. I was on the pill (not real periods) then got preggo by accident and BF'ed DS for two years so only just came off BF'ing to get pregnant. My cycles were completely up the spout and I was so hormonal for two weeks a month I have a stash of the pill I went and got if I didn't get pg in feb. Well, i did and now I am probably going to be mroe hormonal and generally stressed than before! What fun! We'll all go through it together eh? Dreading the long cycles again, they are soooooo wearing, just waiting and waiting! i am going to make DH shag me every 2/3 days until after ov and get pg as soon as poss. No faffing as faffing missed the eggy every time before ;0) he is afraid, let me tell you. he said he is going to get some mace!

foof I keep reading terrible stuff about depo. Freaky strong shit.

Mace! [GRIN]

i know, he is a funny one! he said he might get a whistle to put by the bed too, so people can run to his aid, I said no one would be able to hear his screams :)

Also wanted to say chuckle and jo - my baby actually, literally is only a group of cells that never developed in any way into even a yolk sac yet to me that is my baby. I miss this little person. For some reason in the early days of being pregnant (when the pregnancy had already actually failed but no one told the fecking placenta bit, or me) I thought this was a girl called mathilda and this weirded me out because I wouldn't call my baby mathilda (close friends already have!). Anyway, to me now, that is who I miss. i wish I could cuddle her, it is so strange. I don't think I'll tell DH though, it's a bit weird. It is weird but who cares, whatever works for you to get you through :)

I suppose we are (we! i wish) all in the WTF cycle! So the two week wait could be a month or so long!

Erm wrigle are you sure you are meant to still be bleeding? Do you feel ok generally?

I could have cried but I did manage to stay composed - shes a lovely girl, she would be horrified if she knew I was upset.

so I hope I didnt upset you (or anyone else for that matter) saying I was convincing myself if was 'just a group of cells' I dont actually think that about either of my mc (the first was very early) its just how I have tried to make it less painful to deal with, and having a 15 year old tell me 'its a proper little person even if people don't call them people' was heartbreaking to me. (and for the record mine was a little girl called Poppy - so I dont think you're wierd so!)

wrigle I agree that you should maybe get checked out, even just to see if there is anything they can do to make it stop.

Anyone else being a football widow tonight?!? No chance of shagging for me this evening - I'll be asleep before the final whistle!

Yes I'm a football widow too as I've just found out we are watching it. more MN for me then!!

Bunch of cells - I took a pic of my scan pic on my phone, I can zoom right in without loss of picture quality. On the scan pic, looks like a rough baby shape, zoomed in, it looks a lot like cells, like bubbles almost. I find it morbidly fascinating seeing as I've not been actually told what the gestation was I am assuming from my google travels it was between 5-7 weeks.

Foof I last had the depo jab about 4 1/2 years ago. My periods didn't come back for almost 18 months, so long that I went to the gp which was when I was diagnosed with pcos and put on the waiting list for the fertility clinic. I was then told I needed to lose 2 stone before they would see me as I was too overweight, and even after the first appointment it could be up to 3 years before they would actually do anything to help. I researched as much as I could about the pcos and followed everything I possibly could to help, which involved pretty much completely changing my diet so I had no refined sugars, lots and lots of fruit, veg and protein, I joined a gym and started dancing lessons, I took loads of vitamins, and I tried reflexology. The month I started all that I had my first period for over 6 years, I then had a very early mc (it didn't bother me anywhere near as much as this one as it was so early it was just like a slightly late period), and the following month I was pg properly with dd2.

wrigle I agree with everyone else that you really should get checked out now. I know you don't want to see a dr, but it's better to be checked out for complications.

sovery I think this was a baby too. I always have. I just think it would be easier if I didn't think of it as a baby. I think of it as a boy, but we didn't have a name in mind. I've been cuddling dd2's dolls as they are baby-sized. I really, really want this baby back. :( Please try not to worry about your diet and lifestyle, there are babies born every day to alcoholics and drug addicts, so if they haven't killed their babies you most certainly have not killed yours. I keep thinking of things I did wrong too, but I think I blame dp more than I blame myself, as I think if he'd wanted it more it might have survived. How irrational is that?