TTC for 10+ months, part 5

[MuddyWellyNelly]

Filled up our old one, I'll put our updated list on a separate post so that it's not a huge chunk of text at the top of every page.

Old thread here. Newbies always welcome, much as we'd like to hope nobody ever gets to this stage of TTC!

Hi mrsden i have no symptoms at all....literally none! Hoping that doesnt mean anything bad tho. The midwife from infertility clinic called and she has arranged a scan for me for 22nd March to check how many are hiding in there!

oh at those of you who are kept or semi kept women. I'm hating my job at the mo and trying to convince DH I should quit (it's a v stressful job and I'm sure its not helping with the ttc) but oddly enough he doesn't think it's a good idea...

mrsden like you the idea was that I would be pg soon so would only have to hold out till mat leave. that didn't work out too well. On the plus side I suppose the fact I've been at work longer will help pay for IVF...

pout ignore your MIL, what's it got to do with her - surely she wants you fully rested anyway so that you have best the possible chance of producing grandbabies.

Right, I am off now for third session of acupuncture.

Sorry everyone, been a bit caught up in RL recently. But wanted to say sorry for the various spottings etc, and especially sad to read of the BFN for ladygee. I know you will have some processing to do, but hopefully after your break you will feel a little better, and see the path forward :)

Re the jobs, I turned down an opportunity when I started TTC as I wanted to protect my maternity benefit, HA! Now, I am possibly being made redundant (but probably not, but I can elect to take VR if I want) but again I'm thinking I should stay where I am to protect the sodding maternity pay. And the final salary pension scheme.

When did my life become this glamorous and exciting, I wonder

Anyway have promised myself an early night so quick wave to everyone, will try to chat more tomorrow.

See, my periods were always horribly painful pre-acu. That seems to have helped quite a bit. I also get some flooding. I used to be very clotty but that has also been helped by acu. Hmmm.

Morning lovely ladies!

Thanks for the info whatmess! I do have clotty periods, but am not sure what flooding is. I do the belt and braces approach (tampax and pad) but mainly to avoid a mess at night... And to come back to the euroscale (was it yours?!?) I am heavy for a day or 2 and light for the other three. Oh well, I get to show my bloody parts to the gyn as part of the IUI and if it is heavier or clottier than other patients' I am sure it will be noticed. You did panic me a little though. But the consultant mentioned doing a lap&dye in any case this summer if the first few rounds of IUI don't produce the result we hope for...

About jobs and TTC, my contract is finishing this summer and as there is No Money, I'll be job-hunting afterwards... So Sod's law should produce a pregnant belly by that stage, right? And I would be delighted, even though I am quite career-minded - that is one thing TTC has changed for me. (TMI-alert, another one is enjoying particular bedroom practices, esp involving saliva, as I read somewhere it effects the swimmers) Oh and izzy, lurk away, fingers crossed for stickiness but don't challenge me with your positions until I am fixed. By which stage any possible conception will take place with me in one of those chairs...

How are things with you nelly? Hiss boo to jobs ending!!! And sorry about evil MIL pout! I hope you can move to a less stressful environment, mini. Oh and euro how long did they say to try on the immune-treatments? Because if IVF is likely to take at least three cycles, I would guess natural-ish should take longer. What I am trying to say is, don't give up just yet!! Agree with the OMG about the thread on IVF costs, mrsd. How much would it be where you are? Waves and cookies all round for spotters, AF-ers, and others I forget.

euro* - completely understand, the unexplained diagnosis just leaves you in limbo land and second guessing what could be wrong and scratching around for answers . I know you have done the NK treatment for 3 cycles but i do wonder whether that is long enough. i..e it could take 5 or 6 cycles . However, at the end of the day how long do you give it and it?s very difficult to sit tight when other people on the same treatment seem to get pregnant easily. Are you not tempted to just take the steroids after ovulation on a natural cycle so give the superovulation a miss? If you ovulate already doesn?t superovulation just mess your cycles around? Anyway, I am a fine one to talk, I did clomid for a couple of cycles and just gave up. Something told me it was doing me no favours.

I?ve never considered I have Endo but now! Although changing my diet and taking progesterone cream seems to have got rid of cramps and clottiness. The sore boobs are still a problem though.

Now you mention them joycep, my boobs have been less sore the last few cycles. Why would that be? I actually think my DH might have more to do with the soreness than I gave him credit for until now... The things one discovers if all types of S and cuddles get banned for a few weeks.

And agreement about grappling for answers when unexplained. There clearly is something not going right and we really should be able to find out what and why...

Hi lemon, sorry didn't mean to panic you. By flooding I just mean I have very heavy period flow. For instance, I have soaked through my tampax and pad a few times at work. I had no warning, no pain or cramps. I just went to the loo and realised everything was wet. I can sit on the loo for half an hour and not be able to get up because the flow is so heavy and can be like this for 5-7 days tapering off towards the end. Of course I put all this down to the long cycles, but the doctor had suggested endometriosis.
I'm not sure which is the cause and which is the effect. You know, do the long cycles mean the uterus tissue spreads outside of the womb as it rarely gets the chance to disperse, or does the endometriosis cause the long cycles. So many questions. Not enough time with the consultant to get any anwsers.
If you are worried about endometriosis, then a lap and dye would show it up, but from what you say it doesn't sound like you need to worry.

Oh whatmess that sounds really horrid. Poor you. I know the soaking feeling, it has happened before, but only very rarely (and usually on day 1 or 2 if I have a longer than usual commute and accompagnied by clear cramps). I do drip a little in the early days, but not so bad that I can't get up from the loo. It sounds pretty nasty... Oh and long cycles are def not an issue here (am a fairly regular 27-day girl). Thanks for the reassurance and I'll find out this summer for sure, if I have not done the unbelievable (and got that elusive BFP).

I've read loads on endo over the last couple of months and while heavy, clotty periods are a big flag there are loads of other symptoms that you wouldn't expect to be connected to a gynae problem like endo. These can range from pelvic discomfort, bowel problems (intermittent diarrhoea and constipation), back ache, hip pain, shoulder pain, bladder issues, tiredness, depression, stringy old blood when on period, spotting and pain during sex. There is some research that migraines are more prevalent in women with endo too. Another thing is endo can mimic other conditions like PCOS and IBS. Apparently 60% of women with an unexplained diagnosis have endo which makes me wonder why when you get slapped with the unexplained diagnosis you aren't routinely given a lap. There is some confusion over how endo can cause fertility problems ranging from adhesions blocking the fallopian tubes so the egg can't fertilise to theories that the immune system goes into overdrive and stops implantation. There is also another theory about an imbalance in hormones (too much estrogen if memory serves me correctly) which also means that implantation is disturbed and also explains the prevalence of migraine in endo sufferers. For me the interesting thing is the research that suggests that women with autoimmune conditions are more likely to have to endo.

As an aside I have always been gobsmacked by how similar many of us ladies are on here health wise (migraines, Raynauds, sore boobs etc..) and have always felt that it wasn't a coincidence that many of us have the same conditions and are taking an age to conceive.

The shoulder pain I am having as we speak, I think I can safely write off as an endo-symptom

whatmess I have the flooding occasionally too. About twice a year. The first time it happened I was at a summer party wearing some very expensive lilic trousers...

joycep I waiver between feeling like I want to give the steroid treatment more of a chance (without the superovulation programme, which I really don't feel is helping) and not believing it will happen for us without IVF so just wanting to get on with it. One thing the Dr Beer book on Reproductive immunology mentions is that once immunology problems are identified and fixed, most people get pregnant within three cycles. And if you look at the buses, most people get pregnant within three cycles. I just feel like there must be another reason why it is not happening for us.

pout the 60% figure is quite worrying.

Morning everyone!

Posting on my phone again, I'll do a proper catch up post when I get my laptop back, it's a lot easier then.
Just wanted to send massive to Ladygee. Can't even contemplate how you're feeling. Hope you and your DH enjoy your few days away.

I was shocked at the IVF cost thread, all clinics I've looked at are around the £4-5k mark so when the London clinics were mentioned as being around £10k!!! I could never afford that. Presumably they've got higher success rates though?

I am absolutely bricking it today. Just waiting to hear from the embryologist to see if the embryos have made it to blastocyst, I'm petrified they'll ring and say none have made it ET is booked for 2pm today of they have made it

Sorry for the "me" post

lemon* - that?s interesting because when my dh went away for 3 months i had no breast pain whatsoever. So i always had in my mind somewhere that breast pain was linked to sex and dh?s squeezing and fondling! . I?m not sure how this really could be the cause though.

whatmess - poor you. I can?t believe how awful your periods sound. Hopefully zapping the endo will greatly help.

That?s all interesting pout . But what causes endo? And in the book i?m reading it says migraines are often a sign of too much estrogen as are sore boobs so it all could be connected. Not surprising that women are so estrogen dominant these days considering non organic animals are pumped with estrogen to fatten them up quickly and then they end up on our dinner plate. . So does anyone know whether ivf would get around the endo problem or would a bean just not be able to implant?

euro - i do see what you mean. I have noticed people on the pred thread do conceive quite quickly although many of them have had numerous miscarriages. I do hate all these stats though and how most people are suppose to conceive within 3 goes ? that?s what they say for everything, clomid, iui, progesterone supplementation, ivf. It?s so frustrating when you realise you don?t fall in to the ?most people? category. And what is ?most people? anyway - 60%? It does leave out a lot of people.

Fatima - oh good luck today . i?m sure you will have some embies ready to go!

Yes that ivf cost thread is scary. £13k to go to the ARGC-can this be true?. karbea - if you are still around, is this what it is costing you?

best of luck fatima - I really hope some are ready and you get to to do ET today.

Good luck Fatima I hope there are some suitable blastocysts ready for transfer!

joycep I've wondered about hormones in food. I've also wondered about immunisations. Are high NK cells more common than they used to be and if so what is it that has prompted our immune systems to produce them at higher than normal levels?

Good luck fatima!

Keeping fingers crossed for fatima's perfect blasts and transfer!

The cost thread is frightening... And I do wonder how karbea is doing too.

joy From what I've read, AGRC really is about £13k! They have great results, but are totally out of our price range. I've also read things about their cutomer service not being great - if I was paying that much, I'd expect it to be gold plated! Other clinics in London work out at about £6.5k for ICSI. I've only looked at one clinic outside London and that was a lot cheaper (the country hotel/manor house type place!). I randomly looked at how much it is in Oz and it's a lot cheaper there too. Quite tempting to have a long Australian holiday...

fatima Good look for ET! Hope it's all over and done and went well.

Interesting stuff on endo pout. At one of the clinic open days we went to, there were lots of questions about endo and ivf. Can't quite remember what the consultant said (had been stupified by his hour long talk on the causes of infertility...), but think he didn't seem to think it was a problem with regards to IVF. Like mrsd, even though we have a reason for our lack of baybees, I convince myself that everything is wrong with me! The very small rational part of me is fairly sure I don't have endo, as I don't have the symptoms some of you guys have listed. I do have mirgaines though.. hmmm....

lemon when do you start iui?

izzy not long until the scan. V. exciting.

Had our HIV/Hep B & C tests today. I think it was kitty who became afraid she might have HIV - I'm now getting the fear and am sightly nervous about the results! We also picked up print outs of Mr Gin's SA, which both stated "0" normal forms. Am a bit worried about the implications of this for ICSI, although the urololgist seemed to think it should be ok. I think the dr said something to DH about there being too few sperms to find normal forms, so hopefully there are a few hiding in there.

I hope ladyg is ok and is recovering on her time away with her DH.

Waves to everyone else.

Best of luck fatima!

ladygee, I'm so sorry. A few days away sounds perfect and it will give you time to get your thoughts together. I really wish it could have worked first time for you, but remember that for most people it does take a few attempts.

I'm heavy for a day or two, but have no signs of endo but still wonder if I have it which is totally crazy considering we know the reason we're not pregnant is because of DH's crap sperm. I'm still always thinking I must have everything though.

I don't really know what the true cost of ivf is here. We've been quoted about 3000 plus the cost of the drugs, I don't know how much they are. But the clinic are very careful to say that they can only estimate the cost because it is tailored to each person and depends on the treatment they need. It is so much though, fertility clinics must be raking it in.

On the food issue. I have a friend who lives in the US, which I may have posted about before. Anyway she was suffering badly and the ob-gyn told her she had ovarian cysts. He said it was because she wasn't used to the hormones routinely pumped into the food, and that she should start eating organic. She did and now has 2 lovely boys. She didn't say that it was causing TTC problems, but perhaps it was just lucky timing, but she didn't conceive her first until she left the US, again not sure if that's related or not. Scary though?

I'm a bit about the food/hormones thing. If it was such a problem, then why are so few of us struggling? And the people that stuff their faces with burgers have no problems ttc? It's not as though the whole US population are infertile.

True. But then I read a book about the US food industry that was alarming beyond belief. Still, I already eat organic meat, and as much organic everything as we can. It might not be the cause of my, or anyone's, infertility, but I don't like the idea of eating food that has been pumped full of hormones

I'm astonished by the volume of periods some of you suffer from, particularly whatmess. That certainly doesn't sound normal! I don't suffer from anything like that or many of the other symptoms listed, so I don't think Endo is a problem here. But who knows? In fact I always worry that I'm too average! I have short-ish (c26 days) but otherwise normal cycles, an apparently normal LP, normal ovulation signs, blood tests ok, SA ok, no indications of PCOS or Endo, no Raynauds or IBS or immune concerns. Still making no difference at getting me pregnant though. :(

How did it go today fatima? Hopefully lots of little embies, with some leftover for a future shot?? Fingers crossed.

Hope everyone else is doing ok. I have just realised we never say on this thread things like "who is next to test?" Not sure why I've not noticed this before, but we really have moved beyond the point of tracking cycles, haven't we

Hello thready lovelies. I'm oh so tired today so this may be garbled and I may miss people out. But I did want to really say that I'm sorry Ladygee that this wasn't the cycle. I hope you manage to have a much needed rest to dust yourself down as best you can. It must bring so many new emotions. I wish k knew you in the real world, I'd give you the biggest hug.

whatmess how you feeling? I saw my photos, no one has mentioned endo and there weren't any red bits so presuming that isn't my issue. But now I will ask! But pout I have most of those symptoms, except flooding. Talking of periods, mine often ends very abruptly, like from normal potential mess make-able at lunchtime to barely there spotting late afternoon. Is this just me?

lemon hope the bone is on the mend.

fatima wishing you all the best x

Oh dear, my brain has run out. My period has wiped me out this month. And last night we left our gate open and it banged periodically so I slept BADLY. A a result I've felt poo all day. Which made me think, this is what it would be like to have a little baby, every single day. No babies has some good points, I find it so hard to see them, but sleep is Very Important to me - I need 9 hours to feel happy. My friend said last year that she was surprised she was still alive, at about 6 months of babyness. Shudder! Love to all of you, I'll post again properly soon xx