TTC for 10+ months, part 5

[MuddyWellyNelly]

Filled up our old one, I'll put our updated list on a separate post so that it's not a huge chunk of text at the top of every page.

Old thread here. Newbies always welcome, much as we'd like to hope nobody ever gets to this stage of TTC!

joycep the scan showed nothing out of the ordinary. There was a visible corpus luteum on the right side, confirming that I had oved from there at least. That as quite interesting to see. I had never seen my ovaries post ov before. My scans have always been pre-ov.

nelly that was a very long work day!

izzy welcome to the world of ovulation drugs!

ladygee I am glad there has been some sort of resolution too your work situation. They were being absolute c0cks. I am not planning on telling my lot what treatment I am having when I get to IVF, just that I won't be in on X day because I have a medical appointment/hospital procedure or whatever.

Morning ladies

ladyg I am so glad that you have sorted out your work issues. It would have been really harsh of them not to allow you some time off in these circumstances. I understand that you probably still feel a bit miffed but once you get your treatment underway you will probably get so absorbed in that that you won't be too worried about what work thinks anymore.

mrsd Hope that you are better today. How's your tummy? How you describe your pains is exactly how mine felt in the run up to AF, do you think it could be related to your period too?

I know what you mean about the thought of SWI throughout the cycle. I really don't reckon we could manage that but I do panic that I am getting the timing all wrong and not SWI'ing enough at unlikely ovulation times. The trouble is trying to SWI at the "right" times is causing huge pressure on us, I can't imagine doing any more

euro it is amazing how many of you ladies are starting IVF. It seems that everything is happening all at once on here. It must feel like a massive step and I'm sure that you do feel like you need time to take a breath but like I said to Ladyg I imagine that you will get swept along by everything once your treatment starts and all your focus will be on a good outcome FX

Fatima Good luck with the drugs and hope that your busy week goes okay.

joycep I'm not looking forward to the rooting around at the back door Not sure that I can stand any more indignity!

izzy Glad that the Clomid is going okay for you.

nelly LOL at peeing on the wrong sticks, you have solved the mystery of our collective barreness
I'm sorry that you are still feeling a bit fragile. I understand where you are coming from and the 18 month milestone isn't very nice. It hit me yesterday just how sad I feel about our predicament. It isn't depressed, like I thought, it is just a deep sadness. It also hit me how empty I feel and how very little has any meaning anymore (except the people I love of course). It sounds cliched but I do feel incomplete without a child. I realised while I was walking the dogs and was wittering away to them pointing out the heron and the "noisy lorry" how said I must look to passerby (actually what a nutcase I must look) and how I should be wittering away to a child in a puchchair. I don't think watching the Social Worker programme helped, topped off by the 15 children and Counting thing. Christ it would take me 400 years to ever get near having 15 kids and even then highly unlikely! I am wallowing in the unfairness of it all and just kept saying to DP how we would make such good parents. Sorry, all horribly self indulgent. Anyway just wanted to let you know that I'm sorry you are feeling down too and thinking of you.

Hello to lemons and hugs to everyone else.

nelly I feel a bit low today too. I think I feel stuck in a sort of limbo land, unable to move forward and plan like normal people can. We've been invited to a party in the UK in June and I want to go but then I keep wondering if we'll have started IVF by then. After waiting so long for it I don't want to be delaying starting it because of a birthday party.

pout I so know what you mean about the sadness. I am fed up of seeing crappy parents and thinking that me and DH would be so much better and how unfair it all is. DH's cousin is having her second and she ticks all the unhealthy boxes, obese, smokes, drinks, eats crap as does her DP. But they've managed it twice. And she's not even excited or even particularly happy about the pregnancy, she's been moaning that the midwife is nagging her to give up smoking. Apparently this is really stressing her out. And if I have to hear her say one more time that smoking in her first pregnancy didn't do anything to her DD (except she does have asthma which may or may not be related) then I will scream.

lady well done on sorting out work. I think our works policy is to give you unpaid leave for any medical procedures which is deemed not for health reasons and IVF is lumped in with cosmetic surgery in their definition of this. I don't agree that having IVF is like having liposuction but I know I'd get nowhere arguing it so I'll take unpaid leave. The whole IVF is a lifestyle choice thing really bothers me. We have a medical problem, and we have to have IVF to get round it.

Yay to the first clomid izzy how many do you have to take?

fatima good luck with all those drugs! I can't wait to be starting now, focussing on that is keeping me sane I think.

My cramps have gone today but my lower tummy feels bruised, as though I'd done a million sit ups yesterday.I can't work out if it's my bowel, intestines or uterus. It even hurts when I sit down in my bottom so I think it's maybe bowel related, although I do have a tilted uterus so it could be that. I've only ever had this feeling before after really bad AF pains. I still have sore boobs and normally they go back to normal a day or too before AF so I think AF is still a few days away. And I'm only on CD23 when I normally have a 30 day cycle. All very odd. I'll keep you posted

Hello lemon, joycep, euro and everyone else x

mrsd I would find it very difficult with a cousin in law like yours. I can't believe that she thinks her midwife is "nagging" about the smoking. I saw a programme last year, I think it was Mums Behaving Badly, and it showed the baby's oxygen levels every time the mother had a cigarette. Not good. I also have a bit of a huff at the telly if I see an obese pregnant person...I am turning into a really bitter, horrid person.

It would anger me that IVF is classed as a lifestyle choice and could be put in the same bracket as a boob job. You are right, infertility is a medical problem. I was watching the Fifteen Children and Counting programme last night and one mother was saying how it isn't irresponsible to have so many children & basically saying how all her children simply balance up situations where women have no children. What angered me, totally irrationally I know because it was just a harmless turn of phrase I'm sure, was when she referred to "these women who don't have children". I know it is a really stupid thing to pick up on but for some reason it bugged me.

As for your tummy pains, at risk of coming over like one of those people who have been there & got the tee shirt, every month before AF I get what sounds like a similar feeling. It feels almost like a tired womb and is very much like I imagine it would feel if I had done quite a few sit ups - I say "imagine" because I haven't even attempted one sit up in 20 years, let alone quite a few

pout your words about feeling a deep sadness and an emptiness sum up completely how I feel. It's like my life is on hold while I wait for a baby to come now.

mrsd it must be awful to have to hear that from your cousin in law. Mother nature does seem to have effed up quite badly in deciding who to make fertile and who not!

The IVF as a lifestyle choice viewpoint makes me very annoyed. If my thyroid/pancreas or whatever didn't work properly, the NHS would look after me with no fight for funding and work would view treatment as a medical matter. In our situations, our ovaries/tubes/partner's bits/some unknown part of us is not working properly but we have to fight to get medical attention and then the treatment is treated like we are getting some cosmetic procedure! Grrrr.

I also completely understand pout and mrsd about the sadness thing. I find it comes in waves although generally I have been feeling better this year, there can be days where the feeling is palpable. But it is always there really at the back of my mind. In fact I hate it when people say to DH and I that we would make fab parents as that just makes me even more sad. Oh and the crappy parents thing mrsd is shite. I would find it very difficult to talk to an irresponsible cousin like yours but I have neighbours who are similar. Feckless parents. I also was reading about a 500lb woman who has lost a tonne of weight and I noticed she was a mother to a 2 year old. My first thought was how?
Your cramps sound weird mrsd - still crossing fingers for an ironic bfp.
Oh and don?t get me started on the whole IVF being a lifestyle choice. I cannot stand it when there are all these arguments about whether the nhs should fund ivf because it brings out hoards of unsympathetic worms. It?s ok that we pay our taxes which help families with their children?s welfare and education yet it?s not ok to help people get pregnant in the first place.... Diseased tubes, sperm issues, inhospitable wombs are not life style choices - They are medical problems that need help fixing.
euro - i am glad all was ok in the scan. Cross fingers that you popped a goodun!
ladygee - so pleased your letter worked. Well done you! What a relief. I definitely don?t plan to tell my work about ivf . I?m saving my hols this year so i can somehow work ivf around it.

Bugger. Am I going to have to put holiday plans on hold until I get the eventual referral? I'm already delaying honeymoon booking for next year.

The sadness - really sums it up. My SiL ( she of the up-duffed-ness) always slags us off for talking to our cats in "baby-voices". I agree, it is cringe-worthy, but it's because of the gaping fucking hole we feel, and having her laugh at us and belittle our love for them makes me very very angry.

Sorry, mini rant there. Today has been manic so will hopefully catch up later!

"slags us off". God that's a horrible phrase! I've turned into a chav, it would appear

We get the same nelly, people make comments about our cat being our baby and how we spoil her, think she's human etc. I don't think she's human btw, I do love her though and she's the closest thing we've got to a baby right now so those other people can bog off (another chavvy phrase for you)

joycep how I'd love an ironic BFP. During our hols, I've probably eaten and drank everything you shouldn't so it would be ironic if this was the month. Sadly, I think all that holiday food has caught up with me and my insides are punishing me. I've just eaten a prune yoghurt and eaten a high fibre bar to see if a clear out might help. Sorry for TMI It even hurts when I walk like I'm bruised inside and putting my foot down on the ground hurts my insides. And I'm having to sit down slowly because if I flop down, my bottom hurts.

I'm always amazed when the subject of ivf comes up on mn, how many people do see it as a lifestyle thing and are so against nhs funding. Like you say joycep we all pay taxes and not having children means we are effectively funding everyone else. Over here taxes don't cover health care, or at least not very much. Our insurance won't cover ivf which really annoys me considering we pay so much and neither DH nor I have ever really been ill before. DH can't produce the right number of sperm. That is a medical issue. As yet there is no procedure to correct this so the only thing available is IVF to work around the crap sperm. I don't see that it's any different to a hip replacement.

"nelly" I forgot to say I am sorry about how down you have been feeling. I know that panicky feeling all too well. Its horrible and a claustrophobic feeling because there is no way of escaping it. Perhaps it's the 18month thing. It's a long time. I am nearing 2 years and I think that may bring on a nervous breakdown .
Oh I was told I was sad by a friend because I had a picture of my parents dog on my phone. Shes allowed a piccy of her baby and i am not allowed a piccy of my dog? I've since defriended her! Harsh but she was a toxic friend. One who makes you feel crap.
mrsd - poor you, I wonder what on earth you have done. Eating fibre sounds like a plan! You didn't fall on the slopes?

Ok when we finally have our babies, do you think we will still be angry and sad an dare I say bitter that It took us so long? Will we look at our friends whose kids will all be much older and think our kids would e that age if we had conceived quicker? Or perhaps when it happens , all this won't matter?

So many words resonate with me from today's posts. I too feel The Sadness. It has replaced The Fear that I might be one of the unlucky ones, I felt this from really early on. And now I apparently am, well now I have The Sadness. On bad days I have The Sadness and The Fear, I've had a few of them in the past fortnight. Bring on The Happiness!

I have developed a new issue - I can longer wee properly. Oh ttc how I love thee. What I thought was cystitis has become wees that dribble out very slowly. (sorry) it is most odd. I went to the gp for antibiotics and said I thought I had a water infection but that it wasn't burny just like I always need the loo a bit and it won't come out properly. She said it was most likely the fucking invisible fibroid was pushing on my wee tube ( can't spell the other one urethra?). She also said lap trumps ultrasound every time and already did my private MRI referral. So after the 9th it will hopefully be MRI all systems go. I need to get this beast out of me. And THEN I might be able to think about babies again. We didn't (confession) use contaception this month. But given the ultrasound news that I ovd on day 20 ish, we missed the egg anyway, in the remotest chance that an egg could find a bed. Now cd26 and EMOTIONAL so I'm expecting my period v soon. Might as well throw in a short luteal phase too! No spotting yet, every day feels like a small victory.

joycep I wasn't using fertility friend but I'd had 5 temps much higher than pre ov before the scan so I estimate three days of high temps when apparently an egg wouldn't have popped. I so agree with you about the ivf bashers. Put them in a room with a pmt mrs wine and let me at them!

mrsden I'm wishing so hard for an ironic lucky wee stick for you. Come on holiday sperm! But you do realise that would make alpine air a possible fertility tip sorry about your cousin. More and more I think it isn't about health at all but all about the mechanics. In my work I see smoking pregnant girls often

pout I'm with you on the bowel issues, my ibs is awful right now and has been in a state of flare since the summer. I've had a good week until yesterday and December was great. But today is evil! I keep thinking I should push harder to get checked, just in case but the gps swear it's just my ibs because of ttc anxiety and also, a colonoscopy would prob finish me off. I'm glad you've been listened to more though. How's your wedding plans?

nelly I talk to my rabbit like he's a toddler. I love him and he is our family. Most people think this is ridiculous but he fills the hole you described. Sorry you're still feeling wobbly, it can be a bugger to shift the low feelings. Sending you a big virtual hug x

Ladygee so glad your work saw sense, but it should never have come to that. Good luck with your big bag of drugs. And good luck to Fatima too!

euro any interesting symptoms?

Wave to all other 10 plussers.

I hadn't thought about that joycep. But I think I'll always feel of people who fall easily. But in terms of kids ages, I think that will matter much less to me. Whilst this is probably not how a lot of you will feel, I only want one baby. No matter if boy or girl. I am not putting me and dh through this ever again, or risking feeling like this whilst I have a little one, or knowing another battle awaits once broodiness kicks in again. No way. I have 100% made my mind up about that and so has dh. If I do have this op, my womb will also be pretty knackered after being cut into twice. So, one baby is all I want, to the point where we have discussed vasectomy. We might consider adoption or fostering if we want to extend our family. I've found this decision very helpful in terms of the panic I was having about running out of time to have more than one. We are really interested in fostering. We have both worked with many looked after children and it feels very right for in the future. But I do want to experience pregnancy and having my own child too.

I'm not sure we will carry the bitterness on. I think once we have our babies, this will all become like looking through a telescope backwards and become almost unreal. We will be so thankful to have made it. I really want to support people in a similar position and would love to run a support group/fertility yoga or some such thing. I often think this will make me appreciate so much more that I have a child, cos god knows it looks so hard! I reckon smoking pregnant ladies will always make me livid though!

I fall over so much when skiing, it's possible I have done something joycep but it's strange it didn't start hurting until I got back and also yesterday it was very much like cramps . Whatever it is, I am 99.9999% certain I won't be getting a BFP, because I never do. That is what happens to other people.

I've read a few IVF ladies say that once they're pregnant they feel like every other pregnant lady. But my fear is that I will always be so negative and expecting things to go wrong. I expect ivf to fail, if it works I expect to miscarry or be told the baby has something wrong and I have to terminate. If that doesn't happen I expect to get a DVT or preeclampsia. If I don't I'll go into prem labour. Or if I go full term I'll need an emcs and then die in childbirth. And if that doesn't happen I'll get awful PND etc, etc. I hate feeling so negative but I can't imagine getting a BFP and then sailing through pregnancy and birth. I am very jealous of friends who can glide through it all without ever thinking that things might go wrong. I can't understand people who announce it before 12 weeks because I'd be so worried about mc. I was actually thinking that if I ever do get a BFP, I might hide away until the due date and not tell anyone.

wine poor you and you bladder. We're a right pair aren't we, what with my aching bowels and your squeezed urethra? I like your idea of a support group. It's such a shame that infertility is so lonely.

mrsd I think a lot of pregnant ladies feel like that. If you look on the pregnancy boards there are lots of "you never stop worrying" comments on there. I think the worry seems to stop when bean reaches age 30 if they are settled and sorted!

wine I had thought similarly to joycep. One of my friends started trying half heartedly for her second the same month we started trying properly. She now has a 2 month old baby who will be a minimum of a year older than any child we manage to have. There are two of my close friends who are yet to have kids (one is just starting her second round of IVF, the other has had several miscarriages). I'd love it if we could all go through pregnancy and the early years at the same time. I'll feel sad if I "leave them behind" and bitter if I am the one left behind (again) I think.

I'm on the symptom spotting wagon, wine. If you spot me mentalling about cramps, etc, please hit me around the head with a virtual wet fish!

Oh euro I hear you on that I guess, I do wish I'd gone through it with my two best friends. The first birthdays are on the horizon now. Maybe I'll manage to catch up with their second? Or third.....?

And mrsden I'm exactly the same with worrying about pregnancy. I could have written that post!

So many friends have had babies or are currently pregnant. Some of them meet up regularly and I've heard them say things like "it's so lovely that our babies will grow up together" etc. My worry is that I've been left behind and if I ever do get pregnant they'll all be at a different stage.

Oh wine I can't believe what you are going through now. Poor you. I hope they get this fibroid out as soon as possible to stop this misery. I still don't understand your high temps either but I guess it was a second egg releasing. I totally understand the one baby thing. I have gone from wanting 3 to now 1. If I hve one that will be amazing but I don't want to end up going through this crap again because we become desperate for 2. I would just want to draw a line under things and appreciate the one. Ideally I want twins actually so I never ever have to TTC again. I would be very interested in adoption as well but only if they make it easier to adopt. Its good you have discussed this with your dh. Mine refuses to talk about it. A support group would be amazing.

mrsd - I am incredibly negative as well. Sometimes I think it is self protection and good not to expect too much but it's probably best to be positive when it comes to TTC. However, after this long how very difficult it is to imagine that it will all actually happen.

Thinking about my parents I didn't grow up with any of their life long friends kids. As far as I can work out most people make more great friends when their kids go to school. So perhaps we shouldn't worry about our kids not growing up together. And who is to say they would lime each other anyway!

evening all, things still manic at work so can't do a proper catch up till next week but just wanted to say izzy thank you so much for that page about hormones - really really useful! now I know more about what to ask the GP when I see her tomorrow.

mrsden I have exactly the same worry. Loads of my friends have had babies recently (and all of them girls as well!) and they are now all off on maternity leave together ... I am feeling so left behind. and I'm running out of friends who might possibly be having a baby at about the same time as me!

Joycep With SP there's no downregging phase, so I ring in on CD1 then start stimming injections on CD2 for about 10 days, from about CD5 onwards I also inject something to stop me ovulating too. I think anyway, will know more after my appointment next wednesday

Oooh good luck with the clomid Izzy

ladygee How long have you been downregging? When do you start stimming? Glad your letter has worked. I've just told work, my team leader's really good. I've saved up holiday for egg collection-embyro transfer and I'm using hospital appointment allowance for the appointments. I work flexi hours so that helps fit things in and to get extra days off. If I need anymore I can take them sick although I don't get sick pay.

Thanks everyone else for the well wishes

The IVF lifestyle choice bugs me too. When NHS funding comes up for discussion there's so many people who comapre it to cancer i.e. why should it be funded when money could be going towards cancer treatment. But what about all the other treatments on the NHS which are for things that aren't life threatening but do affect a persons quality of life, like not being able to have a child does. You'd never get someone saying "you shouldn't have a hip replacement/bunion removal/kidney stones etc etc paid for on the nhs because taxes could be spent on cancer" would you so why do you get it with IVF?!

The "sadness" really resonates with me too. I find i'm ok and put on an image of happiness for a while and then it hits me. I'm one for thinking ahead and I feel like a realist and what often worries me is if we try IVF and it doesn't work and we try again and again and we get nowhere, when do we stop? And what happens to DH and I? Do I love him enough to have a life with him but with no children. I know I shouldn't think like that but when i'm down or when DH has been out and got drunk again it creeps up on me

But we've just got to think positive

I'm sorry that we are all so familiar with the same feelings. It can really wear you down can't it? I completely share the future worries too - even if we do get the miracle first BFP, what then? I expect to panic throughout any possible pregnancy, but as to whether I'd go through this again - well so far, I think so? But age is a factor, right now I am desperately wishing for a time machine (or, failing that, maybe twins).

But as to the friends leaving us all behind, I'm going to give an opposing view! I think it's a good thing that the majority of my friends will have done it before. They can offer advice if needed. They will be on hand to babysit, as their children will be older and can stay with Daddy. They'll give us all their cast offs of stuff. They will be past the sleepless nights and want to go out sometimes, forcing us to dress up and be ourselves again once in a while. They'll be done chatting about the contents of your babies nappies, meaning we won't turn into PFB-bores. Plus, one of the most important things is no falling out over parenting styles! I think that my friends will be beyond the stage of obsessively judging watching everything you do, will be relaxed enough to leave us be! We can form new baby-only friendships with our NCT groups or whatever, leaving our existing relationships to remain multi-dimensional and loads of fun. .

See, you all feel much better now don't you .

Hi lovelies, I've had two v busy days and nights so am just popping in to say hi and give everyone a sleepy wave before I check in properly tomorrow. Also I wanted to send hugs to everyone feeling down. I also seem to have fallen back into the pit of despair this week after recent unnatural cheeriness. Bah. Monster post to follow tomorrow- I think todays posts have pretty much contained all of my thoughts about ttc. Sad it's so hard for us all but glad we're here for each other, and excited for the ivf/other intervention ladies :)

Morning lovelies.

This situation that all us ladies are in really does throw up an awful lot of other worries doesn't it. Interestingly DP & I had our first proper discussion about adoption the other night after watching the social work programme. We both agreed that it wasn't for us. We want our own child and and are not naturally child orientated so agreed that we would both struggle with the idea of bringing up someone elses child. I'm not sure that we would be approved easily for adoption anyway what with being oldies and having neurotic doggies that might well eat a child Weirdly, before these troubles, I used to think that I would like a couple of kids of my own and then would like to adopt but now the concept of adoption is more "real" for us I realise that it isn't for me. I have these awful and nasty thoughts turning over in my head about nature over nurture and worry that the child might turn out "bad". That is awful I know and I would never say that to anyone in RL.

Like mrsd and wine I am eaten up by thoughts that even if we do get our BFP that everything might go wrong. My big thing is the worry of there being something wrong with the baby because I am "old" and the angst of thinking about having to terminate such a longed for pregnancy.

As for how many babies I too would be overjoyed to have just one child. Obviously I would like more but would see anymore as just an extra blessing. We have decided though that we will probably never use contraception again, though I agree with you ladies who have said that the thought of manic TTC is not something I would want to go through again. I would just see it as if more babies come along then great, but if not, then that is okay.

Waves to everyone and hopes that your bladder issue sorts itself wine Incidently I now have a bloody hemarrhoid (sp???) I have 4 days for it to go otherwise I will be limping and grimacing up the aisle, well registry office gangway thing

Boo for wedding day bumgrapes, pout! I tried just about everything last year when I was suffering and only Prep H seemed to soothe them (and you can always pretend you have it to use as eye cream, like all the models claim to).

I am absolutely fricking shattered this morning. The steroids are affecting my sleep anyway and Mr euro, who rarely snores, was chuffing away like a buzz saw last night. I tried turning him and talking to him but ended up going to the spare room myself. But by then I had woken myself up too much to get back to sleep. I am sat at work at that level of extreme tiredness where I actually feel a bit weepy. Meh.

Oh pout I'm sorry but I laughed at the image of you clenching your butt all the way up the corridor aisle . I seem to be suffering too. Waaaaay TMI but I'm pooing out enormous ones at the mo. I agree. No more contraception ever. Unless of course euro's octomum scenario comes true. Eek.

I know that feeling of exhaustion well euro. I had a similar night after my 11.30 finish. Last night however I was feeling a bit icky (sore throat etc) so took a beechams laced with rum. Slept like a cat ( because to say Baby is stupid, as by all accounts they are shite sleepers!). Or perhaps it was the shag at bedtime wot did it . I was way too tired but Mr Nelly had paid attention and errr persuaded me. Sorry to say we managed one of those mutual appreciations again . I'm back to hoping this isn't my month, as the pressure on all of us to not drink, go to the alps (MrsD?!!) and all the other theories we come up with, without adding textbook sex into the mix

I have been thinking about the lesbian pg announcement. We all assumed IVF I think, but I watched a programme on surrogacy a while ago (only on in Scotland I think?) and one woman was using her surrogates eggs. So no expensive treatment, they just ordered a fancy turkey baster, then the couple would come round to her house, jizz in a jar, then the surrogate would skoosh it up. Not romantic no, but it's a means to and end. However I did wonder, in complete desperation, if it was worth a try. Would it overcome issues say of hostile pH, or not really as it is still going where it would go if you had actual sex? Weird the ideas your mind comes up with, isn't it? I don't know by the way if that is a problem for us. Probably not, but I'm panicking we aren't even doing The Sex right . I think where this came from is last night Mr Nelly had some leakage before we properly got down to it, and my mind had a momentary "you're wasting it!" reaction. Thankfully not out loud. That may have killed the mood somewhat .

Working at home. Can you tell?