Dh won't lie about Father Christmas

[lazycow]

That's it really. He says he refuses to lie to ds for something that is purely recreational even in an indirect way and has suggested we say something along the lines of

'Everybody plays a game at Christmas where they pretend Santa Claus exists so we can play too etc..'

I have some sympathy with this view actually as I don't like lying to ds either but this seems to be a bit TOO PC for my liking. I suppose I remember the excitement of waiting for the Santa delivery on Christmas eve and would like ds to have that.

As dh says though a lot of the lying about Father Christmas is because adults enjoy watching the result so in a lot of ways we are lying to our children for our own pleasure.

As ds is only 2 this year I'm sure we can skirt the issue with 'Let's put the stocking up and see if any presents arrive' without mentioning who brings them but next year I think will be different. Although I can see dh's point I can't help feeling disappointed and that somehow ds will miss out.

Does anyone else tell their children that Father Christmas doesn't exist from the beginning and if so do your kids still love Christmas and get excited about it?

Dd1 is 10. She still does not let on to me that she doesn't believe because she wants to continue pretending. I let her. I just have never lied about it. It's all very very gentle and untraumatic.

I can't read past custy's classic one liner ....

we are pretty hardcore tbh

I think we do pretty much every tradition going...but always room for more...

oh and we stay up to hear sleighbells...and the rest...just like we look out for witches on halloween. we also go to church at xmas though we're not religious. its just custom and tradition and a bit of fun.

I think every kid with a decent childhood loves whatever they did as kids when they grow up so I don't think it really matters too much how things turn out as long as it's filled with love and happiness.

colditz, i still think i can hear the sleigh bells now and im 38

Fetid arse biscuits.

Don't get why some are trying to force their views here on others.

Why can't you all just accept that some people don't tell their kids about FC, it doesn't have the same importance for them, they have JC or whatever, they feel Christmas is just as good, so why not leave them to it?

It's hardly child abuse now is it?

Actually - in retrospect - Santa usually was pissed in our house and left the prices on and then we would regularly be dragged into the kitchen to "tidy up" and then on going back into living room find more presents under the tree that (pissed) Santa had missed out!!!!

What do you mean you can't believe in Father Christmas?

I do.

Can I please point out at this stage that Father Christmas is a fine and venerable old tradition and not created by Coca Cola at all

don't tarnish our icons please, even if you are joyless pc non-believers

Can't believe someone said this was going to 'wreck' the children's Christmas. This is totally out of perspective.

OK colditz I was rude, sorry. But... people are ignoring this point. You can have christmas, and FC, and magicalness - without having to believe or worrying that your child mught "find out the truth". If you gave them credit in the first place for being able to handle the truth and enjoy suspending their disbelief, that is. And those of us who would prefer to that are not ruining christmas or taking away the magic.

Just out of interest, do your children not know who their presents are from, if you say they're from FC?
I had this conv with dh ages ago & he said he'd never known, whereas I don't recall ever believing in FC & knew who bought what, how else do you thank them?
When dd started asking me v directly whether FC was real, I prevaricated away but told the truth in the end, I've always told her I won't lie to her so didn't feel I had much choice.
She still spends most of the year v excited about Christmas tho.

Can I just point out to the venerable Franny that the image of FC that we see today (i.e the jolly fat man in red suit with beard) was created by Coca Cola. He wasn't so appealing in his original form and wasn't so popular either.

Firstly there is proof that Jesus exists, what you believe about him is up to you. FC most definitely does NOT exist. We're really careful when telling our kids about religion that we say 'we believe that' rather than categorically saying 'this is fact'.

And dh's reasoning was that if our kids found out that part of the christmas tradition was a lie (i.e. FC), then they might reasonably assume the rest of it was a lie too. Which we don't want them to because we don't think it is, or at least is not founded on a lie.

It's nothing to do with Political Correctness - and actually I'm fed up of hearing 'PC gone mad' - I hear it all the time in real life, and it really annoys me. What does it mean? It's one of those phrases that gets used instead of a proper argument.

And my kids DO get the pleasure and magic of Christmas, INCLUDING Father Christmas, just they provide it themselves, and imagine it themselves within the framework of knowing it's a fairytale.

And like Rhubarb, my kids don't have a wish list for Christmas, but get REALLY excited about it being Jesus' birthday. And seeing family etc. They have a 100% magical Christmas. And because FC isn't a big deal, I'd be REALLY surprised if they could be bothered with telling anyone at school that FC doesn't exist. Like someone said, it's far more likely to be someone who has just found out.

I have over reacted I know.

ok fine

just hijacked and used to sell fizzy cocaine to minors. so thats ok then .

Oh and the original FC was Saint Nicholas, that is Saint Nicholas, a Christian, you know, those people who believe in JC?

Eowyn - Your question makes me laugh. Hubs's parents always gave some presents from Santa whereas mine were always from who they were from. He couldn't believe it when I told him and spent a while having a laugh at my expense at my Santa who just gets delivered presents from people's houses then has to spend a night taking them all back to where they came from!

i grew up in belgium where we have sinterklaas , not santa. he comes on the 6th of december, so christmas was never about getting presents.
DD has visits from sinterklaas, santa and the toothfairy, but i hate lying to her. i remember how betrayed i felt when i found out the truth. i swore i'd never lie to my children like that.

Rhubarb did you read my link?

"Although some versions of the Santa Claus figure still had him attired in various colors of outfits past the beginning of the 20th century, the jolly, ruddy, sack-carrying Santa with a red suit and flowing white whiskers had become the standard image of Santa Claus by the 1920s, several years before Sundlom drew his first Santa illustration for Coca-Cola. As The New York Times reported on 27 November 1927:

A standardized Santa Claus appears to New York children. Height, weight, stature are almost exactly standardized, as are the red garments, the hood and the white whiskers. The pack full of toys, ruddy cheeks and nose, bushy eyebrows and a jolly, paunchy effect are also inevitable parts of the requisite make-up."

May I inform the honorable Franny that the website is wrong because I have personally seen a BBC documentary on the origins of FC and it is universally accepted and admitted by Coca Cola, that before they did the fat man in red suit, he was a rather thin man in a green suit. They chose red and white as it's their brand colour.

So nerrrr!

Well I believe our Father Christmas comes from pagan midwinter celebrations, old guy dressed in green. So I'd question your original Christian theory, rhubarb. Hijacked.

But think religious aspect is another topic entirely here.

Um...

"The Santa image may have been standardized before Coca-Cola adopted it for their advertisements, but Coca-Cola had a great deal to do with establishing Santa Claus as a ubiquitous Christmas figure in America at a time when the holiday was still making the transition from a religious observance to a largely secular and highly commercial celebration. In an era before color television (or commercial television of any kind), color films, and the widespread use of color in newspapers, it was Coca-Cola's magazine advertisements, billboards, and point-of-sale store displays that exposed nearly everyone in America to the modern Santa Claus image. Coca-Cola certainly helped make Santa Claus one of the most popular men in America, but they didn't invent him. "

Off to bed - night night!!!!!