This article has me fuming....thoughts?

[PrincessZ]

I just read this article and I am so shocked at how they can categorically ban cesarean sections!
www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2028443/Hospitals-ban-pregnant-women-having-c-sections-cost-cutting-move.html?ITO=google_news_rss_feed

I'm pregnant and I was going to ask for a cesarean. Reading this article has made me lose all hope.

I didn't post here for judgment or approval.
Its a simple question.
I'm not asking if you approve of my choice, I'm asking the right way to go about getting things done.
If you don't approve of cesareans and they make you angry, why post?

any reason why would you prefer a cesearean? (sorry about the spelling!). I guess doctors might take that into account if you have a good reason.

You can certainly try for one but unless you have a sound reason you will not get one just because you prefer it. This can either be a physical problem like breech baby, some other medical condition(usually serious) or a psychological issue, like an extreme fear of birth. We're all scared of it but it would have to be a serious fear.
I had am EMCs with DD1 and was terrified throughout this whole pregnancy they would make me try to VBAC but thankfully when it came to the consultant appt. they just asked me how I wanted to give birth and then booked me in for an ELCS, which I'm having next week.
I totally understand your desire to have a CS over a VB. For me, the thought of a VB is horrific now.
If you have made your mind up stick to yur guns and you never know, they will try to talk you out of it though and of course this is about money. CS' are perfectly safe! Good luck x

I'm shocked too. I'd link to my blog post on the matter but don't know if that's goot MNetiquette.

There are plenty of other ways they can cut costs before puting targets on C Sections and epidural refusals (which I am convinced has a lot to do with cost cutting too).

I'm pretty sure if you want a section "just because" the way to do it is get your cheque book out

I have had a VB and an EMCS and prefer the VB option personally. However after having the EMCS it has left me petrified of not labour or birth, but the complete dread of it all going wrong again. I discussed it with my Consultant and from a medical point of view I am an ideal VBAC candidate, he has said if I don't labour early I can have a ELCS at 39 weeks, if I labour early and all is progressing well then I am to try for a trial of labour.
The latter is the more likely option for me as my DD was born at 39+1 and my DS at 36+3 so not sure making it to 39 weeks is likely.

While I am still petrified I did feel listened to if I am honest.

I think if I had of been told a definate no you can not have a section, I would have been upset but I would not have gone private so I think that says everything in my case if that makes sense.

I feel very strongly that there aren't enough midwives or obstetricians to provide good and safe care even with our current v. high c/s rate. Wouldn't want to see the numbers of c/s and epidurals go up without this issue being addressed.

I don't think you can be compelled to have a VBAC, due to the increased risk? If women are to be forced rather than encouraged to have a VBAC, there will be a lot of litigation to follow...

I have had one ELCS for a breech baby, and intend to have another if I get pg again.

I have bad birth injuries and one of the gynaes who is trying to piece me back together also does obstetrics on the NHS. The pressures to reduce the number of C-sections, both to just get the numbers down and to save on dosh, means that she and her team sometimes have to fight tooth and nail to get sections for women even where they deem them to be medically necessary. Examples she gave me were where women have existing continence problems. Yes, these women can give birth vaginally, but it's not at all in their best interests to do so, if increased incontinence is something they wish to avoid.

Seriously?? I had an ELCS because damage from a sexual assault years before meant I was at high risk of suffering from incontinence if I gave birth normally (sorry if TMI). I'd assumed that if I had another baby, the situation would be the same. Petrified now

(notices how tethers uses CS instead of spelling the word ).

I think there is a myth attached to caesarian sections that they are 'easier'- they're not, its major abdominal surgery that can have long term implications.

The female body is generally well equipped to deal with labour and birth after all women have been doing it for years .

The caesarian section used to only be performed if the Mother had died during childbirth in order to get the baby out hopefully alive.

A caesarian certainly isnt the easy option indeed I have been very ill after all 3 of mine (different reasons) and ds3 did nearly kill me.

Lots of women are afraid of labour its natural to be fearful and in those situations knowledge is power and it can help you cope with labour and the delivery -some women for a variety of reasons find the whole idea so very traumatic that Caesarian section is the only way forward-but I dont think caesarian v vagina is the way forward and I think to a certain extent we need to be careful that we arent offering this service at great cost to an already floundering NHS.

Hi princessz, I can understand your worry about VB, the pain trauma etc, but a CS is much more traumatic for your body. As someone pointed out earlier, your body is meant to go through labour and VB, having major surgery (and that is what it is) puts your heart/lungs etc under much more stress and shock. I really would think long and hard about it before you make a decision.

I am desperately trying to avoid a CS (for medical reasons), and really want a VB, and if I keep doing as well as I am currently, then I should be able to have one :) But if not, I'll have to spend the first 24hours in ITU, and not be with my baby at all (though DH gets to stay in hospital with her for that time), which scares me more than anything. I can't stand the thought of being separated from my LO for that length of time before I've even gotten to know her.

I was chatting to one of the prev-antenatal ladies yesterday, who had her baby 10wks ago. She was saying that with hindsight she wishes she could go through labour again and appreciate it, as it was not as bad as she thought, and knowing that things were going to be fine at the end. It made quite a few of us 1st timers feel a bit more confident.

If you want a relatively pain free labour perhaps you could opt of an epidural? They relax your lungs and heart. Also, have you though of doing more antenatal classes like yoga or hypnobirthing? I've been doing yoga and it really helps with concentration, learning positions for pain relief and breathing exercises - and the MW was saying that those who did antenatal yoga generally had quicker and less traumatic labours and births. I'm not saying it'll be a walk in the park, but there is help out there to make VB easier to cope with.

PS Caesarean is meant to relate to the method from which Julius Caesar was born (there is some quote about him being born in an unnatural fashion), although it is likely to be tosh as his mother would not have survived that sort of op in Rome BC, and she was definitely around during his childhood :o

I know the risks of a cesarean, but I prefer them to the risks of a VB gone wrong. I am certain I will not agree to a VB. I know a CS can be traumatic, but I prefer it to an episiotomy or a 4th degree tear.
I'd rather have a scar on my abdomen than mess up my fanjo. No thanks!

Besides the recent cost cutting measures imply that hospitals are trying to avoid emergency cesareans as well by using forceps and ventouse instead.
I don't believe in assisted vaginal births. Thats why I don't like epidurals because they increase the chances of an assisted birth.
So, no VB for me. I've known I want a cesarean since I was 17 actually. I've done years of research and I prefer it.

I'd go private, but I don't have private hospitals in my area. I'm in Manchester right now.

BTW, for those who said that initially a cesarean was only performed on dead women, do you know what they did to alive women when the baby didn't come out?
Symphisiotomy. Look it up and be horrified. Sometimes they had to break the baby's shoulders to get him out.
Thank god for modern medicine!!

I don't believe in this tosh about "our bodies were designed to do this". Maybe so, but that doesn't compel me to so it. I can take the route I prefer.

"I am certain I will not agree to a VB"

I don't think you have to agree to it OP, it just kind of happens no matter how much you stamp your feet and cross your legs

where has anyone mentioned dead women?

Nickschik said something about it.

When I said I will not agree to a VB, I meant I'm asking for a planned cesarean. This is my only baby btw. Subsequent pregnancies are not a concern.

The data surrounding epidurals leading to a getter number of instrumental deliveries I believe is very misleading. It is impossible to accurately separate the 2 factors. For those who birth is not progressing well/easily are more likely to opt for an epidural and and therefore more likely to need assistance due to possible poor presentation etc... So often it is not because they had an epidural that it was a difficult birth, it was always going to be a difficult/long birth and therefore an epidural was necessary.

I haven't had one but the data has always looked bonkers to me.

In any case, does anyone know of private consultants around Manchester?
Or do I have to go to London? How does it work?

The epidural can interfere with the ability to push(because it numbs the area) and hence increase the chance of intervention.
Thats not so bonkers:)

Oh and like the other posters this isn't really news as WHO guidlines try to limit the number of CSs and the NHS is under pressure to get closer to their ideal figure which is something like 15% (sorry if that is wrong, can't be bothered to google).

I'm pretty sure that if you raise it with your midwife and state your case re CS you would be given one, however should you go into labour early (pre 37 weeks) you may have no choice.

There are plenty of private consultants all over the UK, but you will likely need a hospital that does private sections (asuming the NHS wont permit you one). As far as I am aware there is one in Bristol but the main one is the Portland. A section + a five day stay is about £14k. Consultants their are independent so their fees are extra.

assuming ...consultants there the shame...

I have nothing against CS's but I do wonder why you would choose to have a child in the first place if you didn't want to give birth to it?