SEN boy making inappropriate comments to my DD

[Sushisurprise]

My DD (year 5) has been having trouble with a SEN boy in her class for a couple of years. Nearly every day she comes home with stories about how he hurt someone or said something inappropriate - usually about sex. During year 4 he took a liking to her and would follow her around at lunchtimes and try to play with her which DD found annoying. His mother then complained to the school that DD and some other children wouldn't play with him so DD and the other children were told off. His mother has on several occasions made allegations that he is being bullied at school. Recently the comments being made by the boy have become a bit more personal towards my DD - they are of a sexual context with my DD as the subject of the comments. The comments are quite adult in nature so I can only suspect the boy is being exposed to this language at home. I told the teacher and he was quite shocked and said he was unaware that this language was being used. The boy had to miss his lunch break. Then one of the TAs at the school apparently was told by someone else that my DD had repeated something inappropriate that the boy had said and laughed and the TA reported this to the teacher. The teacher then called my nanny in for a meeting (as my nanny had happened to be picking my DC up that day) and said that they were also having issues with what my DD was saying! I have been fuming ever since. It is my DD who has been subjected to foul language and they are not considering what affect it has had on her or trying to protect her. Shouldn't the school take this a bit more seriously? I can't help thinking that they are basically trying to avoid the issue with the SEN boy and trying to now blame his behaviour partly on someone else. And that they are scared of his mother (she is quite scary!) This all came to a head at the end of term so I wasn't able to speak to the teacher myself again. Any advice gratefully received. I really don't know what to do for the best. I have this horrible feeling that if I make a fuss it is just going to make things worse for DD...

He is a boy with SEN not the SEN boy!

'The SEN boy' that's just not a very nice way for a grown up to talk about a child is it.

He was trying to play with your daughter and she ignored him. That wasn't nice and she was disciplined for that. That's good, why do you have an issue with that?

She says she has heard him say inappropriate things, the school have only heard her say inappropriate things, so they have to act on what they hear but I'm sure they'll keep an eye on what the other human child is saying as well and I'm sure he will be disciplined if they hear him say inappropriate things just like your DD was.

Your language used to describe this boy won't do you any favours for a start!! The school appear to have acted on what they have seen and heard, however the issue of sexualised language remains. Not knowing the basis of this child's needs, it's hard to comment though. For example, if he has Tourette's, or if his additional needs are physical, or if his SEN is an attachment disorder. I don't expect you will know this, however it does make a difference.

At the beginning of term ask for a meeting with the class teacher. Explain that this boy has been using inappropriate language to your daughter and that you aren't happy that she was disciplined for repeating what he said.

Ask them to put in place strategies to protect your daughter from his unwanted attention. Your daughter shouldn't be unkind to the boy but, equally, she doesn't have to play with anyone she doesn't want to play with, especially if she's uncomfortable with what he's saying. Ask for their support with this.

Girls of her age can get a bit silly and giggly over "language" so tell her to report what he says to the teacher and not laugh about it with her friends.

Although your use of 'sen boy' is not pleasant I agree that what is happening is wrong. Of course your DD should not be forced to play with a child they find unpleasant and his conversation topics should be investigated.

Sadly some schools have an 'inclusive' policy' without the backup and support needed for both children with additional needs and the others.

My DS went to a primary school with a high proportion of children with ASD. They marketed themselves as a specialist unit. In fact it was utter carnage. He was battered, spat at, punched, insulted, had possessions stolen and learnt nothing until I removed him from the school. It as letting all its children down.

It sounds like you need to communicate strongly with the school, what is happening is completely unacceptable. don't let them blame you for being disablist, they will try!

You need to be engaging with the school on this ASAP and not your Nanny, although I do appreciate that isn't your fault that the school got them involved.

The Mum of the boy with SEN is probably the way she is because she is hugely protective of him. A friend of mine has two children with SEN and she had to fight tooth and nail to get statements and then again for the additional support that they require.

I appreciate that this must be distressing for your DD but it does need to be you to deal with the school.

Sounds like a weird SEN to me, saying rude words.

If your DD has been coming home with regular stories about this boy making sexual remarks to her and you have already reported this to the school, then you need to keep doing this each and every single time.

DD needs to be encouraged to also report this to the teachers when it happens.

Do the school have a policy about who children play with? Do they consider it is appropriate to make a girl play with a boy who has been making sexual remarks to her? The issue here is not whether he understands the sexual nature of these remarks but that your daughter does and that she feels (understandably) threatened by them. This could develop into a safeguarding issue so the school have to act now. It does sound as if this boy is a bit obsessed with her and that is also something the school need to be aware of.

At the end of the day, your DD has the right to attend school/go about her daily life without being subjected to sexual remarks whatever her age, but for year 5 that behaviour is a matter for concern and would be raising red flags about this boy's home life.

The school should put something in place as the boy has made inappropriate remarks and his behaviour as described above is inappropriate, the words used would indicate that they have been heard by him elsewhere so that is a concern.

Your daughter can play with who she wants, you have every right to be protective of your child just as much as this other child, the other child might have additional needs but that does not mean that your daughter should have to accept this behaviour

I think the previous posters are harsh and I have sympathy for you op. I think all you can do is get dd to tell the teacher every time she hears something she doesn't like and you so you can keep track of it. I'm a teacher and would have sympathy for your daughter it's hard to ensure children with sen are included but forcing children to play with them isn't the solution and certainly not telling her off if she doesn't want to- perhaps discuss ways she can communicate this to him without being unkind. Hope things get easier as the school start taking it seriously

You won't win any popularity contests using the term 'SEN boy'. If I was you I'd ask MNHQ to change the title to something about 'boy used sexual language towards DD in school'. Then ask them to edit the OP using the terms a 'boy who has SEN'.

I'm not going to ignore your post though because as a mum of a child with SN whom themselves has been the victim of bullying and sexual remarks I understand what your going through.

I sent an email to the HT. I made sure I was 100% sure of what my DS involvement and actions had been with regards this incident (quite easy as my DS doesn't know how to lie!) and emailed the HT. Make sure the email is short, concise and unemotional. Make you you use words such as well being and safeguarding. Don't give small facts just a fact of 'what was said' and ask for HT to investigate - the more you give them the more you give them things to defend rather than answer and/or deal with the actual issue in hand.
Check out their behaviour policy and bullying policy and only quote a passage from here of necessary.

For example:

Dear HT,

I am concerned for the well being of DD due to recent incidents in school.
*on x date at y time Z said "......"

I had an off the record discussion with CT in X day at y time.

Further incidents have occurred and therefore I am concerned that safeguarding efforts are not effective at this stage.

I look forward to your comments when you've had time to investigate.

Yours ......

Do please bare in mind that if you DD repeats what is said then she will also occur a punishment. However politely point out that although it's misguided use of words she knows is wrong it's not done in order to cause upset or fear. It's best not to be defensive and act like your child is gods given angel as it gets you know where.

The HT was an absolute dickwad to me when I called school up on safeguarding after 2 pupils threatened to rape DS and told him I'd rape him when we got home.

Comments and replies were as follows....

HT"We do not believe there is a safeguarding issue and that your DS is safe"
ME " recent comments are evidence of the contry"

HT " we don't believe this is after repeated sessions where these boys have bullied DS" (ref previous complaints from DS and I about these lads)
ME "you have previous complaints which are logged as I always email.

HT" well we know everything that's said in class so we would have picked it up" (with ref to this being isolated and not end of long term bullying)
ME" then you would have known this threat was made so I'd like an explanation why you ignored it originally"

HT" well these are generally nice boys"
ME " are you saying my DS isn't?"

HT " these boys say your DS is annoying to them too"
ME " no doubt my DS is annoying to his peers. He has a social communication disorder - however a disability is not bullying. Your bullying policy states bullying is.....intent to cause harm"

I was also told my DS needs to learn to tolerate a 'bit of banter'. I highlighted bullying is not banter and I don't believe this incident was banter but as we couldn't agree as all involved are 10 yo we should contact police and SS for advice.

The poor man nearly fainted

Don't let people minimise this. If the child has SEN and cannot distinguish between right and wrong, appropriate and inappropriate the school needs to support him. Perusing this correctly and calmly will get all children involved in this the right support.

Sorry for war and peace!

Youarekiddingme is absolutely right. The school needs to take action here. The boy with sen is being failed as they are not supporting him to integrate properly and it is not appropriate to pass the buck to your daughter. If they don't understand his social needs then why should she and she certainly shouldn't be punished for it. But learning tolerance is a very important part of school life, she needs the support and so does the boy and he needs to learn that his language is not appropriate. The school needs to take this seriously. You say his mum is scary? How? Maybe she is just naturally guarded because she has learned she has to be to protect both him and herself? It can be like walking in a parallel world when your child has sen. She probably needs the support too! Have you ever spoken to her?

Yousrekiddingme

What you described us the default setting for schools I.e to deny that bullying etc exists and that your child only perceives that it does.

Always challenge idiots who would rather lie go you than take positive section go improve an intolerable situation that your child has been forced into

Saying rude words is not "a weird SEN", a child might use them for a variety of reasons. In autism for example a child might find that using rude words gets a response and the interaction from others they crave, however negative and inappropriate that might be. This does not mean however that other children have to put up with it. It needs to be addressed by the school and at home.

I don't like a child with SEN being described as "the SEN boy" though, that could be my son who is autistic. Thankfully he doesn't use rude language to get interaction.

My DS has ASD too grateful but it tends to make him the bullied rather than the bully - and his disability used as a defence by the school.
Some parents probably think I'm scary - but if people had been supportive from the start I wouldn't have had to build a 1 woman army and fight

i am aware about that aspect of autism Grateful, however I suppose i was trying to convey my scepticism about the scenario.

However I shouldnt have as its against guidelines

My ds has asd. He hears inappropriate things from other dc (and in yr 5, this is rife), but doesn't have the skills or filter to know not to repeat what he has heard like his NT peers have.
He is not exposed to anything "adult" at home, and he definitely hasn't been abused, but it is a constant worry that at some point this will be flagged up as an issue.

Just wanted to point that out.

HoHo I totally get that. My biggest fear after the rape comments was not they'd said it (cos DS had no idea what it was) but more he'd repeat something like "my mums going to rape me later". (Iyswim?)

HoHo I think you have summed it up really well. The appropriateness is just not grasped by AS kids the same way, and as others have said, when they get a reaction it just fuels the situation.....which is where school should step in. The lack of understanding - well let's face it, unless you have experience of AS why should you - doesn't help. But we should be a society of tolerance right from the playground - again school!!

Just marking y place as ds has asd and mn'ers are brilliant at putting things into words that I cannot eloquently do and there are a few phrases on this thread I want to steal to use with the ht at ds school!

Sorry op!

OP do you really think it's ok to refer to a child as 'SEN boy' or 'the SEN boy'?

My DS went to a primary school with a high proportion of children with ASD. They marketed themselves as a specialist unit. In fact it was utter carnage. He was battered, spat at, punched, insulted, had possessions stolen and learnt nothing until I removed him from the school did your ds have ASD too. was he in the special unit? Did this all happen without intervention from school staff?

Sorry, I just needed some paragraphs to help me read it - hope you don't mind me editing it, OP.

My DD (year 5) has been having trouble with boy with SEN in her class for a couple of years. Nearly every day she comes home with stories about how he hurt someone or said something inappropriate - usually about sex.

During year 4 he took a liking to her and would follow her around at lunchtimes and try to play with her, which DD found annoying. His mother then complained to the school that DD and some other children wouldn't play with him so DD and the other children were told off.

His mother has, on several occasions, made allegations that he is being bullied at school.

Recently the comments being made by the boy have become a bit more personal towards my DD - they are of a sexual context with my DD as the subject of the comments. The comments are quite adult in nature so I can only suspect the boy is being exposed to this language at home. I told the teacher and he was quite shocked and said he was unaware that this language was being used. The boy had to miss his lunch break.

Then one of the TAs at the school apparently was told by someone else that my DD had repeated something inappropriate that the boy had said and laughed, and the TA reported this to the teacher. The teacher then called my nanny in for a meeting (as my nanny had happened to be picking my DC up that day) and said that they were also having issues with what my DD was saying! I have been fuming ever since.

It is my DD who has been subjected to foul language and they are not considering what affect it has had on her or trying to protect her. Shouldn't the school take this a bit more seriously? I can't help thinking that they are basically trying to avoid the issue with the boy with and trying to now blame his behaviour partly on someone else, and that they are scared of his mother (she is quite scary!)

This all came to a head at the end of term so I wasn't able to speak to the teacher myself again. Any advice gratefully received. I really don't know what to do for the best. I have this horrible feeling that if I make a fuss itis just going to make things worse for DD...

Thornrose, I've spent the day with family who all think it's acceptable to refer to dc with SN in less than complementary terms, and worry about their poor dc having to share lesson time with children who might possibly be distracting, so I think referring to a child as "the SN boy" is probably commonplace amongst those who don't need to know that it's offensive.
Hopefully she'll know now.

She posted once then disappeared. ..

HoHo I have a 15 yo dd with SEN and I have worked in schools for years. I'll keep doing my bit to ensure it's not 'commonplace'!