SEN boy making inappropriate comments to my DD

[Sushisurprise]

My DD (year 5) has been having trouble with a SEN boy in her class for a couple of years. Nearly every day she comes home with stories about how he hurt someone or said something inappropriate - usually about sex. During year 4 he took a liking to her and would follow her around at lunchtimes and try to play with her which DD found annoying. His mother then complained to the school that DD and some other children wouldn't play with him so DD and the other children were told off. His mother has on several occasions made allegations that he is being bullied at school. Recently the comments being made by the boy have become a bit more personal towards my DD - they are of a sexual context with my DD as the subject of the comments. The comments are quite adult in nature so I can only suspect the boy is being exposed to this language at home. I told the teacher and he was quite shocked and said he was unaware that this language was being used. The boy had to miss his lunch break. Then one of the TAs at the school apparently was told by someone else that my DD had repeated something inappropriate that the boy had said and laughed and the TA reported this to the teacher. The teacher then called my nanny in for a meeting (as my nanny had happened to be picking my DC up that day) and said that they were also having issues with what my DD was saying! I have been fuming ever since. It is my DD who has been subjected to foul language and they are not considering what affect it has had on her or trying to protect her. Shouldn't the school take this a bit more seriously? I can't help thinking that they are basically trying to avoid the issue with the SEN boy and trying to now blame his behaviour partly on someone else. And that they are scared of his mother (she is quite scary!) This all came to a head at the end of term so I wasn't able to speak to the teacher myself again. Any advice gratefully received. I really don't know what to do for the best. I have this horrible feeling that if I make a fuss it is just going to make things worse for DD...

[thornrose]

Yes indeed fanjo, surprise, surprise!

[HoHoEffingHo]

Me too. I wasn't very popular today because I kept pointing out their offensive remarks, but they still didn't get it and I was being militant (or a scary mum) :(

[SamCroClaus]

interesting first post

[thornrose]

Oh yes HoHo it's so frustrating isn't it?

[Tron123]

The op daughter was bullied that was the issue, that was the issue that the school should deal with, the incident should be investigated. The parent of the other child should not be factor in the way the school handles the incident, sadly quite often institutions act differently depending on the parent as there are some vociferous parents. The fact that this is a child with additional needs should make no difference to the op daughter he has no more rights than her

[youarekiddingme]

Good call fanjo wonder why I rewrote war and peace now! I hope it helps someone though.

[youarekiddingme]

No Tron he doesn't have more rights. But he has equal rights to have his needs met - it's called inclusion.

[Tron123]

Yes I agree he has equal rights, inclusion does not mean that other children suffer

[youarekiddingme]

No - supporting the boy will probably mean other children don't suffer though.

[Tron123]

My point is that the incident needs to be dealt with fairly, the op says her daughter was bullied, that is the issue

[Sushisurprise]

I'm really sorry, I didn't mean to offend anyone. I have never posted on here before - I saw another thread which used the same words so copied that for shorthand but I see that it's offensive. Thank you for all your comments - very helpful and has put my mind at rest as I have some guidance now.

youarekiddingme - thank you for your wise words - I will be setting it all out in a measured way in a letter to HT.

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

Wow . You came back suddenly. Didn't expect that at all

[CastlesInTheSand]

School should not be talking to your nanny. They should be talking to you. Regardless of who is picking up. If it's serious enough to need an urgent word they should have rung you.

Really state you are not happy with them talking to your nanny or else lots of things you'll only hear 2nd hand which they feel they have told you.

[AnonyMust]

I find this post really upsetting. I've a 'SEN boy'. He's just turned 7. I've become a 'scary mum', quite possibly - as I'll tell mums how hurtful it is for their children to send invitations and Christmas cards to all children in the class except for him.
OP would you have written 'Disabled Boy', 'Black Boy', 'Jewish Boy' with equal ignorance and vigour? Are you really quite that ignorant and insensitive?

If so, perhaps you'd like to know how hard it can be to parent and advocate for your DC with SN; how hurtful and harmful allegations (that are often untrue) can be; that much to your disappointment, our children have every right to be at school in your DC's class; that an avid but harmless interest in things of a sexual nature is often associated with autism (this is something I've been pre-warned about and am afraid but prepared for) - and how helpful it would be if, in an ideal world, parents of neuro typical children could be less judgemental, ignorant and negative.

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

I wouldn't let this get to you. Although i know it's hard.

[Hurr1cane]

Anony, best off hiding threads like this of they get to you I know they're horrid but there will always be ignorant people and you are doing a wonderful job so don't let them bother you

[AnonyMust]

Thank you both. But I have so many dirty looks thrown my way, obvious whispering and social shutting out by playground mums - to the extent that my son is completely isolated by them despite being loved by his classmates. They greet him with cuddles. It makes me cry inside. And to read this post reveals the ignorant attitudes I know to be held and aired behind my back about me and about my little boy.

It could be my son, that 'SEN boy'. That 'bully' the OP writes about. You know, the one who was never invited to a play date because parents sensed he was different. The one who's no idea how to interact because school haven't put into place social skills group that'll help him to develop the skills to interact appropriately when he wants to play with / talk 'to' someone and how to deal with rejection - or, at least, recognise it and respond appropriately.

Social communication isn't easy for these 'SEN kids'. The labelling is like the lurgey. IT IS NOT CATCHING! Autism, sensory processing disorder, hypermobility, ADHD, social communication disorder... these thjngs are not contagious.
But ignorant parental attitudes are. Gossip ape reads. Reputations are made by parents of neurotypical children that exacerbate social difficulties and ultimately make it worse for the children (and parents) who are already having to deal with so very much.

I'd like to ask parents who share such attitudes (the 'contagion factor':- keep my child away from X):
'Where would you have my child go?' Would you like him to be out into a 'special school'? One where his high intelligence couldn't be catered for? Would that be appropriate?

First ask yourself this:
Do you KNOW this child? Have you had him over for a play date? Of course not. Not just because you've labelled him as contagious having heard that he put his hands over his ears when in a music lesson. How rude! (He was in pain caused by the pitch of the sound playing on the music teacher's CD player). So you haven't seen how polite he is, how he likes to share, how he's articulate and friendly and would love to see what someone else's play room/ lounge looks like having only seen his own and that of two friends from outside school.
Yes, I'm ranting. And so would you. It is sad, frustrating, heartbreaking! What these children need are opportunities to integrate, socialise and communicate. You could've helped this child, OP. Too late now, I'm sure. Your attitudes and inevitable gossip won't have gone unnoticed. Had you had a play date when they were younger, you might have helped to establish a friendship that had helped to avoid him pursuing communication with your daughter in ways you naturally now feel are undesirable. I would too. I'm not disagreeing with your objection to a child using bad language around your daughter. I dread my children hearing and repeating bad language. But is sickening that you attribute the boy's language to his parents. Sickening.
I wish I could tell all parents I see judge and exclude my son from social gatherings: there but for the grace of gd go you.
This is not to say for a moment that I think that you may not have your own struggles. It's to say that you haven't THESE struggles. These lie-awake-at-night worrying, crying struggles every day. Your stomach rising to your throat type struggles just because you're dropping your child at school type struggles. I've felt this since he was two years old. If only he'd follow instructions more easily.
I'm done.
I hope that this pierced your bubble.
I'm sure it won't.

[Hurr1cane]

Oh anony I can quite honestly say that I had the opposite experience in mainstream, the parents were lovely and the teachers shit.

I experienced one or two parents like that but they were in the minority so I just told myself that they were clearly jealous because my child was way more fun and ignored them right back. In fact that probably had nothing to do with my sons needs and they just probably didn't like me.

The only attitude I received like that was from my own family believe it or not. The woman that started all the nastiness now has a child with severe autism herself. She has to live with what she did. I passed on lists of good independent schools for autism and lists of therapies and can happily live with myself whereas she has to remember what she said about my gorgeous boy as she raises her lovely boy.

You rise above it, you do right and your son will be fine.

I wish you lived in the NW so I could get you along to our coffee mornings and for play dates

[SunnaClausIsComingToTown]

OP has apologised for her inappropriate use of language. It isn't kind to carry on having a go at her because of it. She is worried about her daughter and some empathy on all sides wouldn't be a bad thing. It's unfair to condemn OP for her lack of empathy while showing none yourselves.

The vast majority of parents are "ignorant" about children with additional needs. Teachers cannot explain to other concerned parents the particular issues that some children have without breaking confidentiality, as a teacher I found this often. We have a now grown up person with autism in our family and his mother was open about it and told anyone who was interested about his problems. She found other parents very understanding, more so than they were when they had no idea what was going on with him. It takes a village to raise a child, especially one in need of a lot of support.

In an ideal world everyone would educate themselves about the additional needs some children have in a general way but they don't. One thing I love about Mumsnet is the spreading of information about various conditions. I hope this also leads to a greater understanding among parents who have NT DCs and have no idea of the problems other parents of non-NT DCs have.

[AnonyMust]

I agree entirely - it does indeed take a village to raise a child. However, not all parents are fortunate enough to have that understanding reception to their child's SEN. As a teacher myself, I'm shocked and appalled at the bullying and social isolation occurred by parents - not by children. It takes being a SEN mummy to know exactly how it feels and what goes on in respect to other parents' reception of and reaction to children with SEN. I hope that other parents have had more positive experiences than those I've had so far.

[AnonyMust]

Incurred - not occurred

[SunnaClausIsComingToTown]

Sadly, there will always be ignorant and cruel people with zero empathy. On the whole, though, I think decent people behave decently but they need to know what's going on.

When DN went into a meltdown when we were out Dsis would say so all around could hear, "He has autism and isn't coping well today." This would usually stop the stares (which made him worse) and often raise a sympathetic smile and sometimes an offer of help.

I truly believe most people are decent.

[AnonyMust]

Agreed. I find I need to explain (silently mouthe) to parents in the park when he gets upset when someone's been mean and insists I speak to their mummy in his quest for justice and fairness fairness. They're always very kind in their response.
Sadly not so with all but a couple of parents in his class at school. One of whom went to a summer camp to tell the leader that she 'had to put up with having him in her DD's class at school but this shouldn't be compulsory!'. Fortunately, the leader knew him well and so had a far better idea of what he was actually like in reality (vs the false reputation he'd accrued through gossip and elaboration). She told the parent that it was indeed not a compulsory camp - and that her dd was welcome to leave. She then told me what had been said about him as she's been so shocked and upset by it.
My heart broke.
I still watch her gossip obviously (in a teenage fashion, concealing her mouth with her hand). I don't want to confront her as it'd be pointless but I'm so angry.
Fuming.
So forgive me if I'm rather passionate about ignorance and labelling.

[TheXxed]

Fango you have been a complete bully on this thread it was unnecessary.

[SunnaClausIsComingToTown]

I do understand, Anon. It must be very hard to see that day in and day out.