Did you choose to bottle feed and why?

[Alexandersmummy]

I am currently 40 wks + 5 days and want to bottle feed, as I did with my first but feel under increasing pressure to breast feed from midwife. I was just wondering if you bottle fed did you feel this pressure and how did you cope?
I know all the good reasons to breast feed but it's not for me, I feel uncomfy with it.
I'd really appreciate any comments!

Seems some people are forgetting that on a talkboard, people talk...they have a conversation that evolves and develops, just as in real life.

This means that the title of this thread is merely a starting point, and the content of the OP is an opener....and when other contrubutions are made, these too can lead to developments and other, related, topics.

PuppyMonkey, you say this thread is long and somehow this means that other threads asking for help with bf are neglected shows you fail, spectacularly, to see the point.

A thread asking for help with a particular aspect of feeding may resolve itself within a few posts...and I am someone who often contributes to those 'help me' threads, as well.

AFORBF: Anyone who asks for help with formula feeding and is then told healthcare professionals are not 'allowed' to give it, is receiving poor postnatal care, and they should complain. Sabire has explained what is and is not permissable in this regard, and there are threads about this, if you want to look in the archives.

By the way, there are people on here who have already expressed distaste for the term 'articifical feeding' or 'AF', and it is puzzling to see you perpetuating it in your name and in your posts.

I support this view, personally - I think the term 'artificial feeding' while accurate, is too loaded with judgement, and it is better to say 'formula feeding'.

yes but as you can see i have changed in threads and am truely sorry for the name!!
Like it or not, i do know what i am talking about, as i said i am a HP and i have to demos behind closed doors in case a BF mother sees. In my own personal opinion, not professional i believe that every women should be given appropriate support on their chosen feeding method. Whether that be BF help or FF help, demo's. I think it is too late sometimes to wait until mum is at home, they do not always get to see a midwife on their first day home to be shown how to do these important things if they do not already know!
Even BF mums need to know how to sterlise bottles etc in my opinion

AFORBF - another HP who fails to understand the issues. You may be undertrained about this, so it may not be your fault.

All mothers should be informed about the health impact of infant feeding choices, yes, including the ones who ask about formula feeding. That is the only way to ensure an informed choice.

If you have been told that you are not permitted to explain to formula feeding women who ask how to sterilise a bottle and make up feeds, then that is clearly crazy....and I am going to say something I have never said on mumsnet : I don't believe you.

In pregnancy, if a woman asks how to FF, then she needs to have a dialogue about her choices, including information on the health effects of her choices ie that breastfeeding gives the best health outcomes.

Postnatally, then if she chooses to formula feed, and asks how to do it, I do not believe you that you are not permitted to tell her.

Perhaps you have expressed yourself incorrectly.

Am I now correct?!

What is wrong with doing demos one to one, behind closed doors, if needed? What's wrong with privacy in teaching anything to do with feeding??

surely if someone says breastfeeding makes them uncomfy, it is better to try to get to the root of that before a method of feeding is chosen.. surely that is the point of advice and information.. is it making an informed choice if your reasons are never explored and counter opinions offered... ?

I'm sorry, FFORBF, I am finding it difficult to take you seriously.

Lulu, I agree.

No one is suggesting anyone be oppressive about these issues...but having a dialogue to explore a mother's feelings and her reasons behind them is part of good care, I would have thouught.

Thanks Tiktok - whether you believe me or not, have you recently seen any leaflets in a hospital setting on how to sterilise and make up a bottle?? NO
I am not undertrained i hasten to add!
All I wanted to point out at the beginning when i first posted is that i am dissappointed and sadened by stories i have been told by the pressure that is put on mothers to BF.
Comments like 'what are you doing feeding you baby that stuff, give him your breast'
have left mothers in tears years after and afaid to say that they wish to FF for fear of comments again.
I am aware of informed choice and i always give information and the benefits of BF to all women but i also feel that more support should be given to FF feeding mothers!

To me doing things behind closed dorrs implies that there is something wrong with it!

Doors

Yes, FFORBF, I have seen leaflets that explain this - there is an excellent DoH one, a pretty good (though less glossy) UNICEF one, both free of charge and available everywhere. If they are not available to the women in your unit, on request and easily obtainable, then your unit is offering poor care.

The comments you list are an example of poor postnatal care.

No one should make a new mother feel judged, and rudeness should not be tolerated.

If you think 'behind closed doors' implies something 'wrong' then I am puzzled. It's emphasising the one to one nature of the support, and the necessary privacy of personalised care. I think someone being helped to attach her baby to the breast might appreciate it being done privately, as well. What if someone is upset about using formula (and many are)? Is it not better for them to get one to one support with the practicalities of it in private? And privacy allows opportunity for questions, even the 'daft' questions.

If you hear colleagues sayiing rude things to mothers, perhaps you could report these incidents or bring them up in training.

You're not still claiming you are not permitted to give info about FF to mothers who ask for it are you?

Tiktok - yes i am, now it may have been that the HP that told me this during study was going a bit over the top but it was still said. Whether you believe me or not or wish to atke me seriously or not, it is what goes on in some areas, not all but some! I have undergone many years of traing to do what i do and although it may not seem like it i do encourage BF and have successfully done so myself.
I agree with tou on your behind closed doors comment about privacy of personalised care, daft questions etc, but i also stand by my own view, why should it be hidden from BF eyes?

Sabire - when read from some people's viewpoint, a couple of your posts did come across rather holier-than-thou, which i can only assume is because you are passionate about the subject. Who among us doesn't get this way about something? But i re-read all your posts on this thread and most of what you say is true - i also googled the info about bf preventing diarrhoea and diabetes as i didn't believe it.

I did experience not just a lack of support for breastfeeding, but a total absence of person-to-person help - leaflets and books just don't cut the mustard when you are bleeding and sore and have two babies crying with hunger! Nor does people telling you breast is best at every opportunity when you have ten years to develop a fear of bf!

FFORBF - you say you now believe the HP who told you that information on FF to mothers who asked for it is not permitted was possibly 'going over the top'. In fact, she must have been, because you are clearly permitted in your own job to demo formula feedig. You object to doing this behind closed doors, for some reason - I have given you good reasons why it is perfectly reasonable to give this support in private. In fact, I'd go further. If you do it in front of a breastfeeding mother, ie she sees it being done for someone else, you do risk undermining her choice to breastfeed. Breastfeeding is a fragile choice, socially and culturally - we need to do what we can to support it (and I am sure you agree with me there). If there is any chance that seeing a demo of formula feeding affects this, then it is easy to avoid this happening, by making demos private and personal.

If it is indeed the case that formula feeding information is permitted, please make it clear to mothers on mumsnet who might now feel unable to ask about this that you were wrong on this count - and that HPs are permitted to give information on making up bottles and sterilising. You say you are an HP with many years experience - they should be able to believe what you say. You have clouded this issue by reporting something that one HP told you, and which you now think was going over the top.

There is nothing in Baby Friendly that precludes giving out information on FF to mothers who need it. In fact not giving out information would be very poor care.

FFORBF - please also clarify your ideas that there are no leaflets on formula feeding available in hospitals - I gave you two widely available examples.

tiktok - sorry, I said I wouldn't post again but I have kept reading. I have to support fforbf on this. There defo isn't any of the info you refer to at my ante natal clinic (within the hospital). Think I referred to the lack of this in one of my origial posts.

Looby, the leaflets should not be in a pile for routine handing out.

But if there is nothing to give to mothers who ask for it, then that's poor care. Mothers who need this info should have a personal one to one demo, plus the written stuff, on request.

If there is nothing then either someone is slipping up. Or and it's just occured to me, maybe the previous leaflets were out of date (preparation guidelines changed recently) and they are awaiting replacement.

Looby, I see you said 'antenatal' clinic...quite right, there should be no info in the antenatal clinic. People do not need to know how to make up a bottle before the baby is here.

Tiktok - I am not going to apologise for lack of info where i work! No leaflets are given to FF fed mothers antenatally. I am not saying they are not there they are just not in my unit!! By saying this i am by no means discouraging mothers to ask for information, it is their right to and i would defo encourage it!
With regards to demo's - this is a now in situation, i am either undermining the FF or the BF. I am in no way by doing a FF demo saying that this is what should be done and what i agree with, just the same as giving a BF mother support with BF, is this undermining her choice. Do we hide their support away no, every where is info on BF!
As i have said more than i am in support of BF and do all i can to help those who choose to do so, so please do not undermine my qualifications and experience, i did not post to have this conversation, my point was just to say that if a FF thread comes up, we do not have to jump on a BF high horse and try to change minds or ask why not BF, it is a personal choice and does not need to be explained to anyone!

ok tiktok - maybe I ask next time to see. thing is - if you were a first time mum would you know to ask ? i doubt it. if they're not there for you to take, you'd assme they weren't available.

'People do not need to know how to make up a bottle before the baby is here'
and yet there are classes, leaflets etc for BF mothers to show them how its done!!!

i find that the use of exclamation marks is often in indirect proportion to the confidence, calmness and wisdom of the poster

tiktok, you are a marvel, keep it up

Tutter !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FFORBF: of course mothers get bf information antenatally, and not ff information.

This is because to breastfeed is a socially and culturally fragile choice - as a public health issue, we want more people to make this choice (surely), and so we do what we can to support it. This will include taking the chance to correct myths about breastfeeding, to share information on the health outcomes, to help involve the partner, and to build the confidence of mothers that they can do it.

None of this applies to ff. FF is not a socially and culturally fragile choice. No woman wonders if she will be able to do it. Partners who want to be involved are clear about how they can be involved.

So antenatal preparation for formula feeding is not needed in the same way.

You seem to think that the playing field of infant choices is a level one - if bf women get X, then ff women should get X as well.

If women would benefit, postnatally, from some written material on how to make up a bottle, then of course they should get it. The minutiae of how to ask, who to ask, where to ask is the finer detail. I have no argument against giving women who are formula feeding correct, up to date info on doing it safely.